Thank you. Erik 6 minutes past 11. Today's programming a Minnesota Public Radio supported by the Pillsbury company Foundation caring for the community by giving kids a loving lift. Good morning. Welcome to mid-day on Minnesota Public Radio. I'm Gary eichten. There was some low-level grumbling last week when outgoing Secretary State Joe and grow look into her pre-election crystal ball predicted that only about 20% of Minnesota's eligible voters would actually vote in Minnesota primary election this week. She's wrong the critics charge more people will vote than that. And the Star Tribune pollsters agreed with the critics babe predicted that about 29% of Minnesota voters would actually go to the polls bottle ass as usual. Jonesboro was right on the money. If anything she might have guessed a little bit high this low turnout and general lack of interest in politics is leading to the usual round of hand-wringing about the state of the Republican today. Jonesboro joins us to discuss whether all that hand-wringing is Justified and whether any changes are likely as a result and of course we invite you to join our conversation, we're talkin to shower with Secretary of State John grow about Minnesota election system if you'd like, To call in with a question or comment to 276 thousand Twin City area number 2276 thousand. I'll try the Twin Cities 1-800 242-282-8227 6000 or 1 800-242-2828. Thanks for coming by today step to draw thank you for having me any final figures on how many people actually voted to 19% of the people voted for governor of the state canvas keyboard does not meet until next Tuesday And as bad as we're speaking County canvassing boards are meeting around the state. So we'll have the final final figures for you on Tuesday, but it looks like we'll probably just barely hit that 20% Why don't people is it simply a question that people really don't care. I don't think that's necessarily the case. If you want to look on the bright side of it you have to remember that we never ever expect nor do we have turnout in a primary like we do in the general election it it's a whole different kind of an election. It's a nominating process. We have to look at the fact that Nationwide turn out to have been running between 14 is 15% in other states and then you have to look at what we had on our ballot this fall at the primary and it really was a contest only among the Democrats are there was not a tough contest among the Republicans and and and the results show that because many more Democrats are at least made more people went to the polls and vote for the Democratic side then for the other two parties that's certainly going to have an impact on it also, but still at all at work about a third of the people identify themselves as being DF ehlers and gosh, I mean you couldn't ask for much more you had the top of the ticket governor's race 5 well-known candidates. They were out there all summer working hard Lively debates more debates and you can shake a stick at they have a blitz of TV ads. I was usually generate Lots of interest and media coverage lots of media coverage true and I did great Grassroots campaigning and and the ranch civil campaigns. Third of people the Democrats would go vote, you know, the interesting thing about it is that in and I know all of the candidates I've served with all of them and they're all friends and they're all good. The people there wasn't a great difference on the issues among them and I heard an awful lot of people say I like I like all these guys I can't really make up my mind until I think there was a bit of that at play to it wasn't this distinct difference in candidates such as we had four years ago on the Republican side with Arne Carlson and Eliquis and we didn't have that scenario present this year. If we had I think it would have brought out more voters, but I think people in Minnesota were relatively content. Economies good things are looking pretty good. And they had a group of very good competent people running for governor. And many of them would have been happy with any one or two of them Clinton scandal that that play any role you suppose. I don't know I can only guess that I don't think it had an impact on the primary. I think primary voters are people who understand the process. They understand that it's not even an election. It's a nominating process and they're pretty dedicated people and their folks who want to have a boys and who their candidates are going to be on the ballot November. I tend to think it did not have a great impact on our primary. I may have an impact in the general election, but it's a little too soon for me to make that judgment. Is there any reason to Why should we care that 20 only 20% of the people voted. What why is that bad Define it as bad and I don't think that's really inappropriate definition. The highest turnouts we've gotten in primaries have been I don't know if 2527 28% if we're not looking at overwhelming participation. This is not like a general election. I think we always want to have as many people as possible participate. I think we want people to have a voice in their government. I think once you vote you feel as if you have a stake in it. I mean, I always say that if you don't bother to vote then don't complain then just keep quiet. And so if if you can get people doing some action, whether it's going to their caucus whether it's voting in the election, whether it's taking a candidate handing out literature, I think they feel a steak in what's there and then I think their attitude toward the This is more 1 of 12 might not be perfect, but I'm going to do my part for or a better understanding of it and quite frankly. I need from candidates points of view. I know when my name is been on the general election ballot. I always feel better for a more people who vote because I think I'd rather get elected, you know by a larger number of people and feel you have a little more of a Man dates and have a small number of people go out there, or she never lost. So I suppose it for you if you have a huge turnout, and they all voted against you spell process. I wouldn't want to do that. Again Secretary State Jonesboro is our guest this hour were talking about Minnesota's election system. If you'd like to join our conversation, give us a call 227-6023 area number to do 7 6008 win City's 1-800 to +422-828-227-6000 or one 800-242-2828 before we get Are collars one more question sector growth do we focus too much on the active voting as opposed to have a broader participation in in political and public life, which is to say if you're if you're out there and you're engaged and and and kind of public affairs, you're obviously going to vote but do we focus too much on that one narrow aspect of civic participation. We try not to but I think that often the candidates the parties the media ya end up looking at election day and it's easy to focus on you know, it's easy to say go vote today. Here's where you go. And so that seems to be the easy way to do it. We actually start in our office way back in December and January trying to get information out about Precinct caucuses and encouraging people to do that and I know A lot of the other organizations do also that's a little more complicated to explain. It isn't something that's talked about a lot on the talk show. Is there interviews? Yeah, we try to focus on participation year-long in terms of registration getting involved with your political party getting high school students involved in their senior year in high school where they learn about government where they actually have the opportunity to register when they're high school seniors. So I think there are lots of groups including our office around the state that are really focusing on the year-round continual kind of civic education if you will, but when you get right down to it and you got two or three candidates out there, you know, that's where the most excitement comes that's where the the television commercials are. And that's what people really start focusing on it's time to go vote. What time is it over the years you have established yourself in my mind is one of the best inform people in the in state government and I always appreciate hearing your opinion wanted to say that I think part of the problem with the primaries is possibly a misunderstanding on the voting public role is and their value so many Democratic candidates with seemingly the same platform. It may not have been as important very important voting for him. But I think more people to or from the from voting if you're hearing a call that says it's skip Humphrey has got to 43% if both in the other guys. Marketing plan why even go so I think polls are a problem and I've often wondered if maybe news media should not be allowed to use the poles that is to publish the polls. It might be a good tool for the candidates, but the publish the balls. I think the scourge is voting. That's an interesting comment and I have heard other people talk about particularly the polls in primaries rather than the polling they do in the general election because in a primary you have a small number of people going. I'm just so surprised this year that the polls were were semiaccurate and we were talking about before when on the are usually the poles have been wrong because it's very difficult to screen for primary voters be gotten better though because they were right on I mean, hey they were on this year. But you know remember for years ago the polls had John Marti last among the Democratic candidates and he one and eight years ago. I believe one of the major newspapers said that aren't Carlson had a insurmountable lead and you know, he was going to be the Republican nominee and the end result was that Jon grunseth one that primary so that with primary vote. It is difficult. Now that we have more computerized records and people can buy the list from us and pole accordingly if they're doing that. They're more likely to be correct, but I don't I don't disagree with them with you that I think a lot of people saw that pole two or three of them that showed skip Humphrey way ahead and thought well gosh, he's my candidate. I don't need to bother to go vote for him or as you say they were supporting other people who were so far down in the poles that they thought it might not pay but you know the meteor going to do the polling sometimes I suppose candidates can use it to their advantage if it's a close race, you can point out to your supporters how important it is to get out there. But we've managed I thanked it to keep exit polls from being used while polls are still open in some some places or to create enough pressure, but I don't think that that we have any control over over the pole. What's going to go on I think we can only hope that it's accurate and there's enough of it to give a real sense of what the what the picture is in on that day. The other kind of poles that you see before elections are poles that focus on issues that people care about kind of rating them. Well people seem to care most about this one and not so much about the are those at all helpful in or should they be to get out of that business. I think those are very helpful aminos. It doesn't pull the candidates take to I mean, if you're running for governor, you're going to want to take a poll and you may think you know what that evil, Minnesota are concerned about, but you may actually want to do some polling to to find out exactly how they feel about it and exactly what temp some of those issues are. I think that's very helpful. I mean if I'm sitting and reading the paper and I find that most of the people in the state they're concerned about the same issues. I am tents made Feel him on the right track virtually. I suppose if you had the other way. I what am I doing that? I'm not paying attention to what's going on. Chuck your comment, please. Thank you. I too want to voice them kudos to join Girl for a national leadership in voter participation. And I think she understands and has expressed this morning. A lot of the reasons why this primary may not have been quite as high as others. But I My overall belief is that we really do expect too much of our voters. We have too many elections for too many different off for voters to feel confident that they really can keep track and they are people don't like to go to the polls and feel ignorant when they look at a ballot that has all kinds of names and offices on it that they don't know and don't understand and I think our system has developed in a way that has really expected too much of the voters. And therefore we're never going to have extremely high participation even in general elections where we leg most of the democracy. The world Chuck before you run here. Do you think it would be do you think people are put off they can't just go in and both like for governor and then then leave you think it's they feel like they can vote at all. If they don't know who's the soil and water type. I do I think that they may know that they can do that. But still they've got this big ballot with all these offices on it and it makes me feel inadequate people don't like that and it is because it really is only the major offices that do that advertising and television quite frankly. Sometimes you don't learn a lot about the candidates through through a 30-second ad but we had for years in our office push to have a Boater's guide produced and sent to every household in the state. They do this in several of the western states. Where in your home comes the Information about all the mechanics you need about voting whether it's registration are absentee or whatever and then the candidates will be on your ballot Statewide. Obviously your congressperson your legislator and we had proposed actually coughing some things that we've seen in the state of Oregon and Washington where candidates pictures there and then the candidate gets to say a couple 300 words about themselves anything they want so that somehow when you give a candidate an open-ended question and say what is it you want to say you learn maybe a lot more about that person than if you just say answer yes or no to these next five questions. We had thought this was one of the better ways to give voters some nonpartisan our bipartisan information about the candidates. We could never get it through the legislature for a variety of reasons. So I'm hopeful that the next secretary of state likes the idea and will pursue it, but the second point about so many of Actions is the one thing that we have in Minnesota. And in this country, for example that differs from other democracies as that. We have a lot of opportunities to go to the polls between State elections in local elections in bond issues in this than that. I have a few years ago we counted up in in one Suburban District. I think voters had like twelve opportunities to vote that you and so when that occurs you tend not to put as much importance on it, which is why we work for a consolidation of Elections and have moved in that direction where you vote for school board members in the fall and you vote for your county and City people on the regular election day. I think that's the other different factor for the for the United States versus other democracies. What about our callers contention that excuse me that there are so many of these offices that do they just don't know who these people are. In the building guards would help us suppose, but maybe if we had what about how to balance people get to balance one would have the that I'd big high-profile raise that presumably everybody knows about them. The other one you could grab in that would have all these other ones for the more informed would that would address his concerns you suppose you want I just want to be informed. I don't I don't want the other ballot. I'm not far up. So even though you are informed you're really want to admit that. I don't think when you go away as you know, I think one of the things is that when you get to some of these ballots have any number of judges on them who don't even have a contest with people think is ridiculous to have on the ballot. It's a question of how many people are you going to lock your not alike and how much you get to know about it's tough it is it is tough sometimes to be informed at all levels in a general election. Got to pay attention to the newspapers. You've got to listen to the radio. You've got to look at some kind of material and I guess the solution that that we thought worked most of those people who don't really want to pay attention to a lot of it or don't know how to pick and choose if you had one one booklet that could be as a secretary of state Washington described it to me. He said it's the Bible out here and he said if I ever suggested taking that voters guide away from the state of Washington, he said they'd hang me immediately, but we thought that might be the answer and certainly there might be other options. I know we're exploring putting more information on our website and you know, the new technology is helping but but it is a problem and it does require some work on the part of Voters doing your comment. Nothing's right just like about Minnesota's primaries is it's just so highly discriminatory for the average person that doesn't have party affiliations. And most of the populace is not affiliated with the Democratic Party of the Republican party. And what I have is there may be people in the Republican side that I want to make sure are in there and election and people in the Democratic side and I can't vote for the people that I want to see run. I mean to me this is the most serious flaw against our primary system is that it perpetuates the two party system and only allows you to vote like in a democratic side if you're in out and I just I find that just highly discriminatory. But it's an entrance, Do we have to remember now in Minnesota? We have three parties the Reform Party also, but what we have is what's called an Open Primary and you it is true. You can only vote for candidates of one party, but you're given a ballot with all three parties candidates on at it in the privacy of the voting booth. You make your decision. You have to remember that a primary is not really an election and we infect had recommended that it be called the party nominating process because it is a party function held at State expense. It is where members of a political party or Affiliated people with a political party choose who they want to be their candidate on the November ballot in some states. It's much more discriminatory than what we have. You have to register by party when you go in to vote. Only given your party's ballot if a one-year you vote for Democrats and the next time you decide you really like the Republican candidates better. You have to go change your voter registration. So it is not unusual that were only allowing people to vote for one party. It is the way the law set up but there is a purpose behind it because it is meant to be a nominating process come November general election. You can go back and forth across the ticket as much as you like and believe me minnesotans 10 to do it, but you have to remember that the primary is a party nominating process. What about changing the purpose of the primary essentially hold? I don't know what to call it a runoff primary or whatever. Everybody is on the ballot the top two vote-getters go on to November and everybody else is out an interesting concept and I think California just made that change for Their last primary and I don't want to be held to the fire on that but I believe they made that change and I don't remember what they call it. They might have called it an Open Primary. Is that the legislature to change the law to do that where you'd sort of mix-up all the candidates in other words you're saying and and the top to wood would come out of it. It would require change in the legislature. Did it totally goes against you know, the grain of what we view now is our party process where we have caucuses convention that enjoy versus the primary which is kind of the checks and balances and then of course the general election, would you say that they current system works pretty well. I would say that we're getting about how many people actually end up voting, but I mean it in terms of the way the system operates. Does it seem to function pretty decently just the primary and general election. Yes. I think it does function pretty well. If you're talkin about going back to the caucuses. I am a supporter of Grassroots policy politics, but I do think that Tim I do think that the caucus system need some improvements and some changes. I think that has Merit, but I think that caucus-convention system needs. Some change shower was Secretary of State Jonesboro about Minnesota election system, you'd like to join our conversation. Give us a call 227-6023 area number to 276 thousand. I'll try the Twin Cities one 800-242-2828 more colors in just a minute. Taming the Death monster is difficult for many folks easy credit bad spending habits and unforeseen setbacks can all lead to disaster. Hi, this is Bob Potter and on the next sound money. Attorney. Robin Leonard will have answers to all your credit questions from spreading off student loans to rebuilding your credit rating. Chris Farrell has answers to your personal fan asked questions to all on sound like Saturday morning at 10 again Sunday afternoon at 5. Public radio k n o w FM 91.1 in the Twin Cities might add that to a poor. Mr. Potter's program is in grave danger this weekend. He's out of town and I have to fill in for him. So I took me in and see how it all plays out some money this weekend or the noon hour today. It's off to the National Press Club. We're going to hear from William IV was chairman of the National Endowment for the Arts talking about well, dnea got its Federal funding again, and I'll be talking about what the Nea plans to do with its money. That's at noon today. Today's programming is made possible in part by The Advocates Minnesota Public Radio contributors include 3M maker of Scotch brand Scotch Guard brand protectors and the Honeywell Foundation providing the benefits of control worldwide sunny and warm all across the state today another glorious day highs upper 70s in the Northeast in your 90 in the west Twin Cities sunny and warm with a high mid-to-upper 80s approaching 90° in the Twin Cities today right now at 78th. And it's sunny. We're Talkin At This Hour with Secretary of State, Jonesboro about, Minnesota. Pinsystem and day you hadn't eaten all you wanted to add something to the earlier in the year. I think we have one of the latest primaries in the country in September. And now when you look at it, there is only it's only seven weeks until the general election and I don't think that's enough time and I would think it would serve our power process. Well, if we moved our primary up further into the season, where do the beginning of the summer I would like to see a primary late June. I think that that would make sense. You have at that point then you know who the party candidates are they have if you've had a squabble with in a party you have some time over the summer to tend to the wounds if you will and really the real important contest is in November and I think the voters deserve a long . Of time to look at an exam and the candidates from the different parties to have opportunities for various debates around the state to have an opportunity to fully discuss the issues to get an opportunity to get to know them so that they're forced to do more than just spent a lot of money on television advertising. I think that would serve us better since you've been advocating these kinds of changes for years 1995. The grow commission came out with a long series of recommendations on how the system could be improved each year of the changes are presented to the legislature in each year. They die and agonizing death why one of the things I've learned in my years is that whenever you talk about anything with the legislature that relates to an election you have 201 expert. Because I have all run for election. And so we had a package that was a result of grow commission recommendations that included moving the primary up earlier in the season. To say that the parties should be given a role that would make them stronger where they would have the opportunity to in effect endorse or a put their Mark of approval on more than one candidate requiring candidates to go to their political party and getting a certain percentage of the vote before they can go on the ballot. We recommended to the caucuses that they make participation or to the parties that they make participation much less time-consuming and easier for citizens to get involved in that caucus-convention process, but we have the package to the legislature and you are right. We got it out of the Senate would get it in the house the governor like one piece not another somebody wanted this with it. We couldn't get it past quite frankly it. Artist we worked we couldn't get it past and again, I think it's part of an unfinished agenda that needs to be dealt with in the future and hopefully it will be by by legislators next session interesting ly enough that I was at the State dfl Convention this year and then primary night as I was walking around. I heard an awful lot of people come up to me and say they didn't use have some ideas about how we should do this or what you're talking about changing the date of the primary and there was a lot of conversation just on Election night with legislators who were sitting around saying you might have been right Joan or we we need to look at that again. So hopefully the legislature will take another look at it or she could argue. I suppose the other way and say G in many respects the system worked great this year now, it's true that most of the dfl parties endorse candidates Statewide. Candidates lost just two of the five Statewide candidates are actually won the Primary, but all the Republican endorsed candidates that they were basically unchallenged in the primary. So it worked great for the Republicans and the the the dfl, although there were some significant challenges. They weren't they were all legitimate can I not send a good discussion of the issues and so on pretty much what you'd hope for you could say that I don't think a lot of Democratic party activists would say that I think that when you know, only two of your endorse candidates in a party come through in a primary and you lose the top to office as governor and an attorney general, I think it's time to go back and look at the system that you're using and it isn't just happened to the Democrats, you know for years ago the Republicans lost their endorse candidates. It isn't a party issue it it's kind of the circumstances of the Year issue. I think they need to look into parties. Both political parties need to look very closely at that whole process of caucuses conventions and endorsements and we've had declining participation over the years in the caucuses, you know this year for us for years ago for the Republicans didn't seem to make a lot of difference from Georgia and I say that as a person who could never have run for Statewide office without party support and party endorsement. I am not a person of independent wealth and I don't have a very famous name and so if you are in those circumstances, you need your party's backing and I do believe in strong political parties, but I think we also have to recognize that the parties need to kind of look up look out and say hey What can we do to reinvigorate this process and to get more people involved in not just have the same people involved process Christie you're coming. I guess I actually have to comment one. Is it a couple of colors ago said that maybe we expect too much of the voters. I think that voters don't expect enough from themselves. That's my personal feelings. But my comment was that I moved here a year-and-a-half from California and I registered to vote three times here in St. Paul and never got any confirmation in the mail. And so when this primary just came up I called to find out if I was on the list or not, and I was not and so I went to the actual polling place and register it again, and they allow me to vote and I thought Boyd isn't easy to vote in the state and I don't know if my experience is unique or if this is pretty common that maybe that explains some of the voter turnout It always hang up. Thank you. But you had I think a unique experience I if you registered somewhere three times and it never got onto the voter registration rolls somewhere. There was a human error or mechanical air technical error. What happens is that you can register in a variety of ways in Minnesota, and we have tried to make that is easy as possible for people. You'll get a voter registration card on your income tax form. You can do it. When you change your driver's license you can mail in the voter card. You can go down to City Hall and when you do register for the first time, all of that information is put into a Statewide computer network, and you should receive in the mail a confirmation card if you're still at the address at which you registered if by some chance you moved since you're registered, they will not forward that card obviously because you Registered where you live. So I am sorry that that happened to you and it it does errors. I guess can happen. We do allow people to register on Election Day with proper identification were I think one of only two states that allow that and we have tried to expand that identification to make it as easy as possible for people it is is My Strong theory that it is a citizen's right to vote. It's not a privilege that we Grant you it is your right and those of us who administer elections really have a responsibility to make this as easy as possible for our citizens to register and vote and so lacking the Canadian system where they actually go door-to-door. I think it's every other year and register voters the way they do a census in this country. I think we have opened up the process pretty well, and I'm just sorry that you didn't have a good experience with it. Now you should be Voter registration rolls. Doesn't that give you a pause to wonder though? You have been we have it's really easy to vote in Minnesota and you've been working on ways to make it easier right along and there's a glitch here glitch there, but excuse me, but basically it's it's extraordinary really easy. So isn't there something else at work here? I mean that people ultimately don't care to participate next step we could do is probably automatically register young people when they turn 18 if we knew what their address was and maybe that's something we do in the future. There are several steps we could take to make it easier to vote quite frankly. And again, we haven't been successful with those we could allow people to vote absentee without giving a reason we could allow more voting by mail which has been very successful in other states and the people in Minnesota who vote by mail just love it and don't you dare try to take it away from them. And so there are steps that we can take that way and then I think with the development of Technology you're going to be able to see new systems of voting I have said for years that if I can go to this machine that sits on the corner and punch them number in it throws $20 bills at me and it never ever gives me too many and it always takes them out of my account not someone else's then surely the technology exists for us to be able to vote from you know, different locations and keep track of the fact that I voted but but setting that aside, you know, there are Underlying reasons often why people don't vote. We're never going to have a hundred percent participation. And so to expect that is is not even reasonable. I think that as X Change in his candidates change in his issues change, you may find less enthusiasm or more enthusiasm depending what happens when we when the 18 year olds received the right to vote. We immediately saw a drop in participation overall because 20 are statistics now show that 2221 year olds have the lowest record of participation in some schools and in some states. I think there's a real lack in terms of civics are government instruction in terms of the realities of what is expected of you as a citizen and what can you do in what should you do? And then I think that that we need Explore ways of getting people involved there was a fascinating study that that I think I've talked about before and then hopefully I'm not repeating myself here, but I think I was in the state of Ohio where they set up a neighborhood Council the neighborhood programs where the neighbors Matt and talked about issues before the city council voted on them before the city council debated them. So they had first input and the end result of that was it these people felt like they really were participating because they had a voice before everybody had hashed it all over and even if the outcome wasn't to their liking they still felt that they had a voice until we hear from some people that say Jeep voting isn't enough of a way for me to participate and then you find people who are content economies good things are going along well for them. And so They don't feel that need to go out there and make any change, you know, there's that there's a whole gamut of reasons and I think four years many of us tried to look for one quick simple solution. I don't think it's there. I think that we have to do is try to give citizens what they need and want make the process as simple as possible and quite frankly, I think in this primary citizens have been saying we want decent civil races. We don't like all this nastiness. We don't like people, you know cutting each other up and I think that's what those Democratic candidates did they pointed out some difference on the issues there different personalities a little different styles. But basically it was a civil campaign and that's what the letter said they want. But if they would have I want to get to some more callers hear but I have to follow up on that if they had the the dfl candidates in this case really throwing a lot of bombs of each other really cut each other up. Got a lot of headlines wouldn't more people have responded and voted. I have seen studies that show that when that occurs that you know, the nasty enough stuff hits the TV screen voters get turned off and it doesn't matter of which candidate they get just turned off and say I'm not going to participate in this stuff and they said home. So I think there's a danger that it may work the other way Robert your question or comment place first. You've already hit on the absentee voting more and mailing and if the other point I'd like to make was all the folding of any kind on Saturdays when people doesn't have to rush off to work doesn't have to take care of the kids. So on so forth and also teach in Civics in school, you've already touched on that but mainly put it on Saturday this Tuesday's and and what-have-you is a pain in the butt as far as trying to make it there and then make Working man so on so forth. Weekend voting weekend voting is an idea that's been talked about often or keeping the election on a Tuesday but making it a holiday lots of pros and cons. Obviously, it would have to be a federal statute because we have Federal elections on those days in the Congress has debated and they've never come to any conclusion. I think part of the reason is because you know what you have now and you don't know what you're going to have if you change it, but I certainly agree with you that it would be worthwhile putting it on a weekend or making it a holiday and trying to focus on it as the day that we celebrate in the day that we go to vote and it make it more of a community spirit that kind of event war on your comment. Connected to their representatives and enter the process and that's almost rated by the the most recent goings-on in Congress having to do with the president and Monica Lewinsky at 4 months. Now the polls have been telling everybody that the American people want to put this behind us and move on with the with the additional business and yet that seems to be the focus. Aaron Paul has any influence. I think that in some cases that's sad, but true. I think it's a local level your local legislators. I hope are more responsive and if they aren't vote him out of office and vote for someone else because I think that's one of the primary responsibilities of your local legislator is to its try to stay in touch with their constituency. When I say that it doesn't always mean you're going to agree with people but if if you have elected officials were willing to listen to you and listen to your side. I think that's really what you can and should expect they are obsessed in Washington over all of these sexual scandals. Now, we've got three congressperson. I understand admitting to adulterous Affairs and it does seem as if that's all people can focus on I am and I don't want my comments in any way to be construed to say that I am supportive of the president's Behavior because I'm not I'm I'm disappointed and Illusion. I bought it for him and I think what he did was wrong. But I too am sick of hearing about it all and there is a process in place in Congress. I wish they'd just go ahead with that process and not feel every single page of my newspaper and every headline in my news with more news about I really don't care how many congress people want to stand up and admit to having an affair. I think there's other business with the public wants to hear about it. And I'm one of those I guess in the majority of the public who said let's let's talk about something else and let's focus on some of the other issues Paul your next. Good morning. We are the third major party the Reform Party. I am the campaign manager for Denise Hartmann for house seat 61 B, and we are in a recount. What are the rules governing a recount? A recount in legislative races if there is the difference between the candidates is 100 volts or less. Then there is an automatic recount and it is that at 2 no cost to the candidates in our office will come out and handle that recount next. Hi. Thanks for taking my call. I wanted to make the comment that I think some voters cynicism is fostered by the attitude of some in the commercial media. I just talked very quickly an example. I had heard that problem with the monk Community with one of the talk morning talk shows. And so I turned it in yesterday for the first time. And I couldn't believe it they were criticizing all the presidents. They said that the main person talking said every president starting with Truman was a jerk. Nixon was a best of the bunch. Then he said he hated all presidents including Washington and Lincoln we just went on and on about this and he was like laughing about it and I put some negative. You know, how I don't really cynical this is and I thought if I had somehow, you know been part of the group ever called up or something if I had called and said I voted yesterday and I was you know, I'm proud that I voted and I think our candidates are really wonderful and there wasn't a clinker in the bunch and all this. I think they would have laughed at me and I guess I'm just wondering if you know if people are and I hear that the popular states people are listening to this how might it affect them in their attitude toward government. I've not heard that program. I don't think I could bear to listen to it if it's as you described but I think that people are involved in Comedians and talk shows are involved the lion in Pilot political bashing. If you will either of the process or of the individuals that seems to be a popular sport nowadays, which I think means we need more people like you who are proud of the process and recognize that that politicians are human beings and try to do their best in most cases and and and in most cases are pretty honorable people, but it can be difficult sometimes for for both sides, you know that the elected officials in the voters to try to Wade through what people are saying and try to get to the basis of it. We have a democracy and as I have always said to people it may not be perfect, but it's the best system we know. And so we have to take some of the downsides along with the upsides. Of course in the old days when they newspapers become vicious. I mean they put us to shame in terms of cynicism and then personal attack. We're just about out of time and I know you're going to or coarse encourage people to vote for the dfl candidate, but setting aside party considerations here what should people look for when they go to vote for Secretary of State in November what follows what what's the main thing that a secretary of state ought to be able to do when you look look at the Secretary of State candidates that keep money that are office while elections is the most visible part of it. We really serve a huge number of people in a business services division. One of our our first goal in our office is customer service and what we try to offer is good customer service, whether it's helping you get registered or answer your election question or helping you incorporator or looking up. UCC filing in the most efficient effective manner we receive taxpayer money and we try to spend that efficiently and effectively so I think you want to look for someone who has some good ideas who's concerned about what's happening out there and and someone who has is positive and feeling hopeful about citizens of Minnesota and about the progress in Minnesota. Nice coming in today. Thank you very much. Joan grow who is not seeking re-election this year. This is her last year in office. So you've been there since 74. Is that right? Like a 1974? Thanks for coming in today. This is midday coming to you on Minnesota Public Radio over the noon hour. It's off to the National Press Club to hear from William IV chairman of the United on downman for the Arts right now. It's time for The Writer's Almanac.