Thank you, brother. Six minutes past 11 today's programming is made possible in part by The Advocates of Minnesota Public Radio contributors include Margaret river is fund and Merrill Corporation celebrating United Way helping people everyday. Good morning, and welcome to mid-day here on Minnesota Public Radio. I'm Gary Acton. Glad you could join as well. Of course, as you know, today is primary election day in Minnesota with voters are selecting candidates who will then move on to the November general election. If you haven't voted yet to the polls will remain open until 8 this evening. And of course, we'll be on the air at 8 tonight with extended election night coverage will have the latest returns talk to candidates and provide some analysis is well several races are on the ballot including a high-profile contest for governor Forum party. Cannot Jesse Ventura is on a pole is Republican Norm Coleman faces only token opposition, but five well-known Democrats are running for the dfl party's nomination that contest has attracted lots of media if not voter attention so far, but too often ignored and all the cartridge is a real world job description. What in the world is a governor actually do what skills are essential to the job. What are nice to have skills to governors? I have anything approaching a private life and should they have a private life? Those are some of the questions we'd like to discuss this hour and who better to ask than some folks who've actually held the office or at least work side-by-side with Governor's joining us today to share their insights into what a governor does our former Minnesota. Governor's Wendell Anderson, and I'll Quia Gunner Anderson a Democrat server 1972 76 require a republican from 78 to 82 also with this is Jean levander King who served as Governor quiz chief of staff and she not only can give us the inside dope on what Governor Cuomo he was really like when he was in office, but she also brings the perspective of a family member her father Harold Van Der was Minnesota's Governor from 1966 to 70 finally joining us by phone for Portland. Oregon is the chair of the Metropolitan Council Kurt Johnson in one of his many former lives Kurt was governor ardy Carlson's chief of staff. And of course we invite you to join our conversation as well if you got a About what Governors do give us a call 227-6020 area number to 276 thousand outside the Twin Cities 1 800 to +422-828-227-6802 for 22828. Not just one cautionary note here before we get started this being election-day were not here today to weigh the merits of the man who are running for governor this year just the job itself in the people who've actually served thanks to all of you for coming in today. Appreciate it a great with us. Great. Thanks for joining us. Let me start with Governor's Anderson and Qui. What is in your mind the most essential thing that a governor actually does Granderson I think that one of the keys and for me it was absolutely critical is Jerome surround myself with good people. I think I was very fortunate. I inherited some outstanding people that had work for governor Harold Evander including dick brubacher who was governor levanders Commissioner of administration and mine. It's a nose day shouldn't have a commissioner Finance. It was the I think dominant the state position other than maybe executive secretary and so a but I I get high I think I was really lucky and fortunate in the surrounding myself with a outstanding people and I think that made my my Tour of Duty frankly much more successful and exciting than it would otherwise have been dark. We just a minute here. We going to get your microphone on. There we go. Seven others, there's two things. What one is the pick the best people you can be Commissioners and I like the way is the system of Minnesota is that the governor has the opportunity to select them all they belong to him. Even if you select somebody who did work for a previous administration. The second one is to understand that budget and so I spent those three months really working on the budget understanding that as we prepared cuz you were the previous governor prepares their budget for the biennium that you're coming into. I think those are the two most most important wants to start out with then you're the governor needs proposed legislative agenda. And so that's a big thing in the end and to be able to do that and secure Passage through the legislature. Once that's behind you then hopefully you're on a swing do out there that your Administration until you run it as a big problems later on. But what people see of a of a governor, you know, the cutting ribbons and all that fart, you know, that's so what was it was still necessary, but it's not the job that he is 20 years ago after the election you called me and I met you in and you ask me the question that you just asked and it was in your Congressional office. I'll pay for it snowing in. Remember the guy do I do if I talk to you cuz I wanted to find a friend off sure about that and I thought my friend Harold Hughes sure of Iowa to and I also took your advice when you told me I'm sure I'd remember this way what you said on Sunday if I had to do it over again, I would not do anything, but be with my family I said, I don't mean just dinner. I mean breakfast to dinner and I bited by that give me good advice Chiefs of Staff. You think a governor ought to have? Well Gary might my strong impression. Is that a governor? Can ask for two or three things the governor has the opportunity maybe even the power to set an agenda and he can't get everything he wants but it's awfully hard to deny them a short list for governor starts out knowing what he wants to emphasize what he wants to be remembered for and sticks to it and stays focused that may be in my impression that the single most powerful early move. The governor's got to make listen and then to be able to lead its a real bout the Governor's job I think is often a very acute Balancing Act between conflicting interests in and you want to listen to the people you want to be able to represent them. And at the same time you have to lead to 2 to take them Beyond where they want to go sometime. So it's I think that Balancing Act between listening and leading Well, now what should the public expects should they expect the governor to be on duty 7 days a week 24 hours a day. Should they allow the governor to kick back from time to time? What's what's a reasonable expectation? Number one? I think Gary that when you have become a public figure you belong to the public and I think the public should if they desire and have access to your private life. I don't think there is such a thing is beyond the view of the public. However, I think every human being needs to be able to kick back relax in the end have some private time and less white Gretchen and I secure that place up at Marine on st. Croix. So on the weekend we could get her to get away there rather than be in the public eye all the all the time. I think that you have a responsibility to share with them your beliefs and provide some leadership. Without consulting poles or focus groups. I just don't believe in that. I I think that's so terrible when you when you elect talented men and women in the resort polls and focus groups. I think if you trust your own instincts, you don't become governor or congress person or whatever, but without having some experience so you should share that with with your constituents and and make a decision or recommendation based on that vast experience. And if you're going to do is reflect the poles which I think both parties now that that's all they do it and it really disturbs me because I I think we deserve better and I really think the people at holes offices are much better and more talented than the borders might think what are one of the things that I found that if your candid the people will respect you when I was in Congress, I got to the point where I listen to people, you know, what given X Malaysian before they told her they stood and by the time I was done I ever to blame computer. So I figured the only way to remedy it for myself was I given the yes or no first and then I give him the explanation and that because then I felt good with myself it might Mansfield give me yes or no and no explanation is a week 24 hours a day with a penchant for Independence who I have always been willing to speak their mind and make up their own minds without being intimidated by what the latest overnight tracking poll says it on your 70 question. I think it's just inherent in offices like governor and president that even when you're not doing it you're thinking about it and even when you're off at a cabin kicking up your feet pretending to be distracted. It's on your mind. I think you just goes with the territory. It attracts people who really kind of like all Consuming responsibilities like that. Jean you seen this from from several different angles. What about it being at one level? Because it's it's you're in the middle of all The Fray but it is terribly exhausting and I just think that if you look at that, I shouldn't say this was to Governor's at my side. But if you look at our past governors, they all developed which has eaten his shoes. I mean he that he has feed you can see his toes rolling in the show zipper and I've noticed these guys have a few Twitches. I only twitch when I heard is right. I don't think I think they can get an act activities, but then you never get it off your mind. And when you're gone people call you they want to know where you are all though. I understand once in awhile. All Purpose would leave town in the staff didn't know where he was, but on the rest of the governors that I have known they really are always on call. I think it's a very exhausting job. We're talkin to sell her about what Governors actually do this being election-day. Thought it would be fun to go to drop a job description. Lots of people want to be Governor this year. We have size seven major party candidates five more minor party candidates. They all want to be Governor or so. We thought today we would ask a question that doesn't get to ask very often. What does a governor do what's the life like joining us a to former Governor's Al quie Wendell Anderson and two former Chiefs of Staff Jean levander King and Kurt Johnson. If you'd like to join our conversation, give us a call 227-6022 area number to 276 thousand. I'll try the Twin Cities 1 800 to +422-828-227-6102 for 2. 2828 now do governors get involved in the kind of the nitty-gritty day-to-day detail work of running state government, or do they just and all that work? Not sure what that's all about handoff all that work. What we just said, there we go. Just pass all that work off to their cheap. What's a I think we're still working. Are we still working? I don't know if we are we got you know what you're doing the background clutter overwhelming. The I think there are some easy listening on fortunately. I'm going to have to apologize apologize to our guests as well. We're not sounds like the control board actually maybe on its last leg. Hopefully your mics are still working here Kurt. You still with us. You have to call your daughter's for a yes, right? Well, you know, we're getting close to pledge week again. So I think there's a governor is intimately involved and a lot of it has to do with legislation. But when when there's a strike on for instance your pretty intimately involved when the government is short of money involved whether it is as two experiences that I had when they're they're tough princess questions that have to do with the environment. You can become intimately involved. Comes to weather a large business is going to be coming into the state or not you get involved with that as well really wants to do and the current governor of has the capacity to master just about any any to tell you want to put in front of him, but I always thought it was a job of senior staff to filter through all the stuff that's going on much of which is Trivial in routine and list out the stuff that I Governor really needs to know about because his opinion matters his judgment as needed and you don't want you to be surprised by finding out about it later and sometimes you guessed right. Sometimes you guess wrong. I did not get involved in detail. I tried to avoid it to be specific. Herbst with my commissioner. We call that conservation. It's now DNR I use a great commissioner and I kept me posted if he needed a legislative response to something. We put it on a budget or talk about it, but that he ran the department of real apagard was the commissioner of what we call highways now Transportation. I did not get involved in where the roads were going to go but he's clearly got involved in getting a bonding Bill through so that there'd be sufficient funding for highways. The commissioner of Education was Howard Kay's mueser 44 Governors. I didn't second-guess him or stand behind looking over his shoulder but clearly on policy and so forth. We met we talked we discussed and we've formulated policy. Directions Jack young reminds me of when I appointed him. I told him your mic isn't working again Gene. Let me ask you and I'll go ahead now. Did you talking about trying to sort through the big issues from the the less important issues in MD so that the governor would have time to focus on the big issues you operate much the same way you try to do that. You find out what the governor really feels that he has to leverage his own influence on and then you try to keep the rest of it in and it took all Sprout off a lot of communication because you don't want the governor's surprised. So I think of an orc we had a real admirable record of dealing with his agency hasn't went through an awful lot of turmoil good times and turmoil with a budget issues and those agency departments work together beautifully because we was at a constant level of communication. And so there's an awful lot of time spent in meetings. Check my son. I remember was asked in grade school. What does your mother do and he says she attends meetings that was going to cut you off and I just said Jack Young making history of Corrections ready to be when his right hit me here. When I appointed him. I told him jack if you would never come to me with a problem. I'll be happy to take care of that over there the department of corrections, but there are times when you need to come together and then you have to bring other people together. But the one thing that I wanted to make certain of is that my Commissioners were listening to the people and if anybody help that they weren't I made certain that they had they got an audience and but I never interfered with my commissioner because when they make a decision, they know my feeling is on the broad scope and I felt I ought to back them. Back to my Commissioners I pick them but in every case, I went to legislators and both sides and political I'll consulted with them and in my Commissioner of attacks not called raveneaux R trimmer Batman. He was tremendously. Well, I received a pointy and that's where the others are coming up when you got legislative support. I think as you all and I certainly as your father did it really helps and again, I think we're small enough state so that it's almost like family and and and you can actually saw some problems other Anderson you raise the Specter of the legislature working with legislators is a pretty easy pretty tough. Is it easier to work with a member of your own party or somebody from the other side? But let me just jump in and then I became governor. Controlled by the Republicans and I was at a Governor's conference talking the governor of Texas and complaining about this and he said young man. If you think you have a problem when the other party controls both houses of the legislature, let me warn you what it's going to be like when your own party controls what causes of like they they were they were good to me. They were kind to me with very very few exceptions and I love working with him. I found that at times it was Rocky and when I was in Congress to work very well crossed the line and at first I couldn't understand why it was so difficult for me to work with the dfl side of the of the legislature in a while until it dawned on me that when I ran for re-election, I would be running in each of their districts while in Congress. I would never be running for re-election and any other congressman's District, so I was much more of a threat to them with that. Understanding it bit it built up to where I got to tell you that one of the people who is lieutenant governor candidate this time Rodger, Moe was a great asset to me as I came towards the end by term timing is critical and you became Governor during a very very difficult time. The economy was turning interest rates as a recall went to about 21% We had an Emmy off and you know, that. That was wonderful, but your timing was Norwegian Carlson, of course is cast more vetoes and every Governor combined I think's going to world record of it seemed like it was before the Saint that was pretty Rocky with the legislature on the other hand. There are other signs that he's got a long time to legislature attitude toward the lawmaking process actually in used it with more discipline and that generated a lot of respect. He became the unmovable anchor on certain issues at gay people cover to do things. They otherwise wouldn't do I would like to make a general comment about the the the legislature and the governor search for the right kind of illustration here at you might think of of the governor's office in band that part of our state life is being like go fishing in Rapid Waters or something, but when the legislature comes to town, it's like installing Niagara Falls over your head while you're fishing in those Waters. It's like a sleep and wake cycle or like a house that's relatively empty most the time but has a family Once a year bringing both the distinguished and the dysfunctional Place fills up a sudden main mainlining of adrenaline and it's just electric and I think most Governors get caught up in that it is intimidating at times are the stakes are high. The Minefield is everywhere you want to walk but you feel the opposite of it in the letdown when they all go home because it's the best game in town when it's going on. I have to say I was lucky enough to serve in both the house and a senate and go from that the governor you had a little bit of a gap that are out and I thought that was a tremendous asset but more than that. I learned very early in my legislative career. My name was on the ballot. 40 years ago today for the first time and when I was elected I was a law student that was 25 and I would sit at a meeting with some farmer from a particular area with an eighth grade education and eiserne soon learned that that farmer with smarter than me better read and making a much more significant contribution than meat quickly learn to have great respect for these different people who may not have been very verbal, but we're outstanding today. We have legislators with more degrees, but on those days we had legislators with much more Marketplace experience and they were tremendous and we lost something when we lost the citizen legislature to remember that one of the interesting ways in which he dealt with the legislature was he'd have a breakfast meeting with the Republican leadership once a week and he Deborah breakfast meeting with Republican and Democratic Leadership once a week during the session and we said that at first just perplexed the legislators that the dfl because he said I don't like sitting down for breakfast with you and then you go out in 10 minutes and you just slam me. So he said I'd like to know what you're going to say. So when you leave will you call Jean and tell her what it is you're going to say and at first they were very weird. I mean, I would just they just couldn't believe you this request and what is this but they did it and so Rodger would call and say I know in about an hour, I'm going to call a press together and tell him this and you know, it was amazing what it did was it kind of took out the personal and it made it more on issues. I think it read to find some of the conversation but it was a very unusual way of operating but it isn't it does all go down to the the more you can manage the surprise has the better off you are and if you can take out the personal and get it on the policy file personal. I remember in my office the media was there any particular legislator from the other side was demanding that I have Governor appear before a committee, which would have been not something that had been done in the past that such and I had my than I was prepared to respond to that before I could respond Stanley Homecrest the majority leader in the state senate that wonderful wonderful gentleman intervened and he said Governor if I were you I would not do that. And I think the answer should be no. I mean he took me off the hook at why would he do that? Why he keep he believed in what we're trying to do in terms of education, but we had served together. We were friends. He wanted me to know what he was thinking and he wanted the best for me. I mean, that's wonderful. I'm and I and II I don't think that's a typical I think most legislators that I work with Republican to Democrat really try We're talking this hour about the job of Governor. What does a governor do what's it like to be a governor in the state of Minnesota today, of course is election day primary election day in the state of Minnesota. Lots of people want to be Governor again this year. And so we thought it would be interesting to find out just what a governor does joining us to former Governor's Al quie and Wendell Anderson and two former Chiefs of Staff to Governor is here in Minnesota Kurt Johnson and Jean levander King Jeanne is also the daughter of former Governor hair Ollivander, so she comes from this comes through this with all kinds of extra expertise. If you'd like to join our conversation. Give us a call. 227-6002 276 thousand. I'll try the Twin Cities. You can reach us toll-free at 1 802-422-8028 and we'll continue our conversation in the moment. I'm learning Benson on the next All Things Considered will report on a plan to restore the Mississippi Rivers habitat by mimicking. Ups and downs of a natural River are getting wider and wider and wider and most of the islands are getting smaller and the habitat is becoming more uniform and wave swept All Things Considered weekdays at 3 on Minnesota Public Radio k n o w FM 91.1 in the Twin Cities talk radio is supported by Ecolab A supplier of cleaning and sanitizing products and services over the noon hour or an hour for Midday program today. It's off to the National Press Club. Today. We're going to hear from education secretary Richard Riley and we can expect it to check Terry Reilly will be talking about education issues one can only speculate that he will also be asked about the Affairs in Washington. Since he's been a longtime confidante of Bill Clinton that's coming up over the noon hour today live coverage of the national Press Club broadcast with education. Secretary Richard Riley sunny skies are forecast for Minnesota all day long today election day Heinz upper sixties in the Northeast upper 70s in the South Twin Cities Sunny through the afternoon with a high mid to Upper 70s right now. It's sunny and it 69 degrees in the Twin Cities and we're talking about the job of Governor with two former Minnesota. Governor's into former Chiefs of Staff. Let's see Lieutenant Governor's Lieutenant Governor's do they do anything? No. Now you're supposed to explain later that they are the chair of the grounds committee at the Capitol list of doing all the things that Governor's don't want to do. The Senate the course and they gave it a good thing to do. If you don't mind my lieutenant governor had two brothers in the state senate. So that was a little bit unusual. So I had additional reasons to to to keep a warm relationship there. And of course he was very useful with the iron Rangers who wore different shirt. What's your experience? Well, I mean, I think theoretically a lieutenant governor can do and be anything that a governor and courage is that person to be but all the joking does have a foundation. I think inevitably most of them slip off into Oblivion your callers probably couldn't name squeeze lieutenant governor. They just do and yet there they can be very important parts of the Machinery. They certainly have more potential and nearly every case than just running out and cutting the ribbons and meeting another group that the governor can't get too or is too exhausted to get to Well, okay, we got to call her have a line from St.Paul Brian. Go ahead please I just kind of Hip Hop maybe a unique experience. I was in college. I was up. Oh waiter for some of those practices that she talked about some of the dinners and I thought I could talk a little bit about some of the kitchen gossip and stuff going on. But sure did you get any first of all, I want to know did you get any chips and bites if I know that you're talking about picking good just really good people that they chose to work with. It was just amazing. You don't matter what time of the day you were there and the pressure is it going to be on their way so gracious and the governors and their wives to are just amazing how nice they were just as to when you know the kitchen where you can let your hair down sometimes in the family. It's like they're so nice and in a member 20 minutes. Anderson East I think he just to jog that McAllister tracking high school. We jumped the fence from a local guide wrecked. It always kind of he'll give us a couple seconds. You know, how you guys doing and I just just good people you know that you chose to work with him and Corey are so just thought I'd add that. I Remember the Titans goes running days. Thank you for bringing it up. A lot of people a lot of people say that politicians are all bums. Basically, that's not true. It was the rotten apple once in awhile gets in the press and you think everybody else is I tell you the finest people that you meet with just wonderful individuals. Not only that I found them not only to be the nicest but they also are the most interesting the most people today are Specialists. Not only are they lawyers but there are Specialists and some narrow boring area of the law or their accountants. Generous we have left as far as I know our people at the Inn interested in public service and politics and I guess I found in my all my years of Public Service pay only I think two people who didn't tell me the truth, which is a tremendous compliment and they were honest and helpful and I have nothing but affection for the people I serve with something to worry about here though. If you take seriously all those poles about public cynicism and the widespread belief that anybody in high public office is in it for themselves their corrupt or inept. They're just rip in the public off that attitude has the capacity to guarantee that only people like that will end up running in the future. I think it's a very dangerous trend. Gunner kru you out of the Mansion the WordPress which then leads me to ask Jane and Kurt who presumably had to deal with the media that hated medium or directly. Do do reporters generally treat the governor's Fairlane do governors hate dealing with the media and would rather they all went away their they're absolutely essential because you need to be able to persuade and you can't you can't do that by speech is always a lot better. If you could just issue a press release and then we would read the press release and that would be the end of it right the relationship with us, but it is it's just extremely important to have that check and balance and sure there are times when you want to argue with him or you want to add on or you just thought they got a little of the the band wrong but Ice, I really do believe that we we need to encourage the press to have issue area that they follow so that the reporters themselves have a background to so that I sit around so quickly that they don't have their own grounding issues. And that is one thing I think I I I don't find as many issue or a specialist specialist people covering the capital beat than a regular basis and I think that will be sad if that is diminished. If you ever calling this in life require you to do what Governors do in this situation where they're supposed to come up with a believable important initiatives and limit of their own party will within 10 minutes arch their Collective eyebrows over it and then the other party full of smarts killed Savvy ready to attack people. There within the hour telling the public everything is wrong with the initiative that you put out. And then you guys the Press regarded all this theater and you'll get ready to cover the battle and all that kind of gamesmanship. I think inevitably produces this this adversarial kind of Gulf between the two of my impression is from working with Governors that the only serious claim they have about the press. The only thing that really gets into their core is when the coverage is not accurate, but I think I can live with anything and they have mutual they have respect for the roll the presses got to play but when reporters don't get the story, right? That's the worst feeling ever know when you mean when you say I don't get the story right? Do you mean Kurt? Don't get the story right from the governor's perspective? What interpretations people to warn you they're putting on I'm just getting the facts, right? Yeah, it always worried meme when there was a new reporter would come and see me because elderly they wouldn't get the facts right? Cuz I couldn't take the key ideas down fast enough and then be able to read their notes back again. That's that's what I what I observed was happening and I'll tell you there's one reporter who covered for the Saint Paul paper when I was there a Bible Keith and what I really appreciate about him on quote he would call back if he had some question. Is this the way you said it and that's the kind of respect that we had between each other. I'll just go and is always double-check. You know, did I hear you correctly? Is this what you actually sent any other advantages? He had been there so long, I mean, I remember him when I served in the house. So he would judge you based on a twenty-year period of time you got a brand new reporter from California to New York. First of all, there's cynical, you know that they don't give you the benefit of anything where somebody who's from here who's seen you I have no problem with people like that generally and I think the other one has respect because some of the reporter that just playing cynical individuals and but I remember with one of them when she respects and trusts me and from that time on I I really appreciate it but she wrote and all but until that respect people are at odds with each other respect each other and that's why it has to come come about when former reporter buddy Wilson of the Star Tribune retired. I remember former Senator Duane Benson posting her and say If this is a matter of style that the Betty Wilson had her pad out and when you said something she always wrote it down. He said she didn't use it most of the time but you wrote it down Jean. What's your what's your interpretation hear? It? Does it really ultimately matter. What a governor does or is capable of doing doing isn't it? Simply a matter of how good the economy is or how bad the economy is? It matters a whole lot. In fact is the Metro Council it was created in my dad's Administration having a Department of Human Rights that was created in his administration to to push on that issue. I know he has perception though of whether a governor is a good Governor or not, isn't it? Mostly a question of how They certainly get a good ride on that after get to that that's that's that is very very key. But I do think I do think they really matter in setting a tone setting a quality setting the aspirations for people pointing out issues that we collectively have to work on mobilizing the private sector sometimes so no, I I think the government gets a spin on the on the economy plus or minus, but but there is little time and I think sometimes the people respond to that. I think that the public was always very affectionate to towards Island NE think of a presidents that served in difficult times, right? I don't think to say if the times are bad the governor looks bad. They will judge my cousin was there wonderful 222 Governors overall exceptions and so forth, but in tough times they relate to it do governors only respond to their cronies that People who give big bucks to their campaigns owners of for quite a while now cuz my age and I would say that this absolutely is not true respond to cronies are or are not at all. Probably one of the least notice things about the life of a governor use how much time he spends just listening to people and you know, when people go out of a governor's office after an audience with with him, they maybe not remember anything the governor said, but they remember what they said to the governor. And that's why you what jean said at the top of the show is Sookie mean it's really an essential part of the job is to be that person that you can take any cause any problem any idea to what makes it interesting for the staff too. Cuz often people will come to the staff and they'll be irate. I mean they want their their veins will be bulging they'll be pounding on your desk theirs and they go into the governor's office. They become respectful they tone down and then the governor says to you what they weren't upset at all. But if you're a big contributor don't you have greater access can't you get into the governor's office of Governor spend most of their time on education matters and I remember the chairman of the Board of Regents at the time was Elmer Anderson, and I I really tried to pay attention to education. I don't remember ever getting a contribution from a professor at the University of Minnesota and yet I think I was awfully good to them in those days education groups were not the contributors that they have currently. are today and still we paid tremendous attention to to the public and private education K through 12 provide some access to interest groups are the answer is yes, but your question was does it unduly influence governors in the answer to that question is no I agree public speaking. Is that important to be a good public speaker? If you're a governor and do governors do governors write their own speeches, you know that there is being rolled here in the studio. Okay. Let me tell you this. Okay? I heard me speak. Some place came up to me said George Norman Pastor my said pastor that was a wonderful swimmer who wrote it for you Vine and I read it to David Leavitt off who did a lot of writing for me and David said to me. When do you understand? When did that was a wonderful letter? The point in your early day when you're a governor. You have staph you have helped. But before your Governor, I mean it you don't have stabbing you go off people ask you questions. You give talks have to do it yourself. It's only later on that you have some help. I had great help with the written word. The spoken word was my vernacular my language me. Metro security our governor Carlson was capable of writing any speech ever gave but he didn't have time to write most of them mean if you're going to write all the speeches people expect you to guess you don't get anything else done. Every Governor edits carefully and makes it his own you don't have time to write write those but miss pearlstein was my last speech writer and he is very good. But I think that the people who are speech writers must be able to control your ego because they get that they don't get any credit speech that Victor is going to be a barnburner the governor looks that is what they decide to go to make his own feet. Someone and so that's why she heard all this because you're out there with the people and you develop and for the audience when I was active. I mean I could actually I would know certain lines that would go with with with an audience that the speech writer couldn't relate to and it just takes a while. I listen to Hubert and I worked with him and he was Sensational. Sometimes he would have it fail and it take awhile. They complained about his long speeches. But sometimes you talk for 10 15 minutes before he get hit and then you'd have them but I'm in a speech writers are helpful, but that the candidate the office holder it has to do with most of it mean you dream you could reach back 30 years and confessed the one of the great shots of your young life when your dad read a speech without that you wrote without checking it first. Parker's opportunity that was true. Sometimes the speechwriters helping once in awhile. I get you into deep weeds. And I remember the speech. Most people do is my most memorable. All right, very briefly Highway 35 was going to go around Hinckley. So Hinckley was going to really have trouble sustaining. We thought before gambling their economy. My dad said whole team up to Hinckley and nobody showed up to Economic Development there. So then he's the next week. He's going to give a speech down in Mankato, but I'm still mad at Hinckley for not showing up to my dance music. So I write the speech about rural development in there. I give the line that unless we cooperate regionally unless we develop this way some small towns made a and some Should all right. We're just about out of time here. But you know since we're talking job description that inevitably it comes down when people are applying for jobs. And so on the pay Peyton Governor's pay you too much $120,000 if they get lots more, is it about right? What's your what's your thought? I never worried about the pay and so I wouldn't I wouldn't Minnesota when I was governor had the third-highest pay of any governor in the Union at that time and I liked the pay when I started it was was not there at my feeling is the pay should be 50% one half of the football coach at the University of Minnesota automatic. No matter what the play level is it the terrible job and thousands of people will want it every time it's open. Is this a job that people should actually expire to or given our climate is political climate shut his got to the point where it's just better to go be a CEO of a company. I don't I don't I don't like and part of it is it is the big packs and the high cost of Eva campaigning but put it put that aside. I think the people with the skills and the ability to try for that job in a run. I've got to say that it was a marvelous four years of my life. I would do it again. Yeah, I think that first of all I can't think of a better position in America than to be governor of a state like Minnesota because you can solve problems. You got a great constituency this get to learn about this. Fantastic stay tonight. I think if you look at the candidates on both sides, it's a very very talented feel. I mean just delete. These are people that feel very strongly about public service. I love the job at the great job. We are better off with a good Governor than a for governor. Thanks so much for joining us today our guest this our former Minnesota Governor's Al quie and Wendell Anderson and former Chiefs of Staff Jean levander King and Kurt Johnson. Thanks to all of you for joining us a reminder that holds are open till 8 tonight at 8 tonight special election coverage begins here on Minnesota Public Radio. It's 5 minutes now before 12 and time now for The Writer's Almanac