With news from Minnesota Public Radio. I'm going to Cunningham the attorney representing a state lawmaker booked on suspicion of drunken driving. It says it dfl Representative. Bob Layton of Austin will undergo chemical dependency evaluation Layton apologize yesterday to fellow legislators on the floor of the house for his drunk driving arrests Tuesday Lane accepted a ride home from one of his campaign staffers who hit two parked cars. His attorney says Layton was behind the wheel because the woman driving the car had been injured in the crash Layton was arrested early yesterday morning League of Women Voters and Friends of the Minneapolis public library or meeting tonight to discuss plans for a new Downtown Minneapolis public library is still have to try to find a site and raise money for the building Bob Roth is former director of the Hennepin County Library. He's been a consultant for more than 300 libraries in the US Canada and Europe Minneapolis. Library board has hired him to help plan the proposed new library also has many City's build their libraries in the 1960s and they've been forced to remodel or build new building to serve today's Library.Most of the new buildings have a private study rooms. They have a coffee shops special facilities for the handicapped assistive technology. These are all showing up in the new newer buildings dealing with retrofitting. It's downtown library. He says Seattle Phoenix to Salt Lake City and Denver has I'll go through the same kind of planning process and rebuilding go to venture is working half a day today before heading out on an extended weekend. His staff won't reveal where he's going. Some lawmakers had hoped Mentor would take a more visible role in end-of-session discussions right now in Duluth report a fair Skies a temperature of 57 in the Twin Cities partly cloudy skies and 62. That's a news update. I'm going to Cunningham programming on NPR is supported in part by news radio 1330 w m n n providing quick news weather and traffic updates at 1330 AM complimenting the end up.News and Analysis on NPR 6 minutes and I'll past 11. Good morning, and welcome back to welcome to mid-day rather on Minnesota Public Radio. I'm Gary Knighton this week. We are marking a day that a good many Americans and Vietnamese for that matter thought would never arrive at the end of the Vietnam War or the American War as it's called in Vietnam, 25 years ago this week Victorious North Vietnamese forces rolled into Saigon bringing it into a war for the US a drag on for the better part of 15 years. 58,000 Americans died in that War 3 million served in the military Vietnam war is the only War America ever lost Minnesota public radio's documentary unit American radio works has prepared to special programs marking the end of the war yesterday. We heard our one which took a look at how the war affected America today over the noon hour. We're going to broadcast the second hour of that special. It's called Vietnam a nation not a war and it takes us back to Vietnam 25. Later to see how the war affected the Vietnamese also as part of the project American radio works to set up a website where folks have been sharing their personal thoughts on the War. I would have affected them and continues to affect them and it's that part of the story that we're going to focus on during this first Arbor. Midday program American radio works corresponde a John biewen who produced one of the reports for the project is coming by today to report on some of the comments that have already been posted in the online Vietnam scrapbook. And we invite you to add your thoughts to are audio scrapbook this morning. How the manly The aftermath of the war is affected you it was called here are Twin City area number is 651-227-6006 51227 6,000 if you're calling from outside the Twin Cities, you can reach us toll-free at 1-800 +242-282-865-1227 6000 or 1 802-422-8281 of the more wrenching events in American history of the Vietnam War interested in how it's affected you 651-227-6000 or one 800-242-2828 John thanks for coming in this morning. Happy to be here Gary. First of all, I'm curious what kind of a response if you got in on the website to the project. It's really been remarkable and I would encourage people to go to the website American radio works. Org and look we've gotten about a hundred responses from all over the country and very very powerful stuff. About half for a little bit more than half of the people who posted their own thoughts and Reflections are Vietnam veterans the other half a wide variety of people people the self-described Vietnam widows people whose fathers were killed in Vietnam War who served in Vietnam and came back very much affected by it Vietnamese people now living in America and on and on and most people with very direct personal stories that in many cases are very anguished and and Powerful I'd encourage people to take a look. I mentioned that about half of them have been from veterans themselves. I would say the majority of those a strong majority of those have been I have had sort of a sense of sadness in a sense of loss about them about the experience just to read one example, this is from Joseph Cohen of Palo Alto, California PC starts out. I was so idealistic. I joined for the very highest two reasons patriotism sounds foolish now expressed by some wild-eyed zelle it out to kill commies for Christ. He goes on a little further down even though I had heard Bob Dylan songs over there. I figure it out by myself that the war was so very stupid and wasteful when I got out of the service. I felt like I had to compensate for having participated in that War. I join the Vietnam veterans against the war and marched against the war here and in the May Day Parade in Paris, then I joined up with a minute takeover of Wounded Knee still trying to do some kind of penance for Vietnam guilt and shame replaced pride and patriotism for so many years that's fairly typical of a lot of the postings we've gotten from vets there have been others that A very different position to sense of pride a sense of anger about those who opposed the war but this is been more typical I was going to say I was just wondering whether or not the postings less far in any way reflect the huge Rift that developed in this country. Sure. Yeah. It's it it's how it would be hard to overstate how profound the divisions were then and really still are just too there was one other one. This is from a veteran in Florida Richard redhill who serve with the 2nd Battalion 9th Marines in Vietnam in 68 and 69. I just turned 18 when I took what I call my high school senior trip to that country spent nineteen months with the finest bunch of Marines I've ever served in the core when I came back boy had things change. It was hard hats and long hairs. I was Torn Between Two Worlds unbeknownst to me at that time. I went into a world of my own took me 14 years to discover that it was 1984. When I stumbled Upon A Vietnam veterans group my life opened up. He goes on to describe now having become very much involved with Vietnam veterans that that's he's really restore the sense of Pride about his role and he ends his is posting this way says how has Vietnam changed me. Well, it changed me when I got there and I'm still there looking for and linking together old buddies who haven't seen or talked to one another in over 30 years and you know what, I wouldn't change anything Semper Fi Brothers hoorah, and then yawns PS I might forgive Jane Fonda when the Jews forgive Hitler. So a couple of samples from here from the online posting, so I have to reckon radio works live Vietnam scrapbook this how are those of you listening to this program would like to have you make your contribution to what amounts to are audio scrapbook get your thoughts and how this war affected you and perhaps still continues to affect to 651-227-6065 1227 6000 outside the Twin Cities. You can reach his toll free at 1-800. +242-282-865-1227 6001 800-242-2828. That's on the line for Minneapolis morning Pat your comment this morning, like the first person's comment that your red. I had set and idealism in in the other way. I was conscientious objector enjoying the anti-war movement my Cynicism McGrew when I discovered that the number of the people who were encouraging people like me not to apply for conscientious objector status, but to burn their draft cards were people who is it ended up really had no danger of being a draft that they were older or had some sort of deferment that that kept them out and that's what is cynicism didn't change my view of the war but it certainly changed. My view is some of the people in the movement and just a quick comment on how it's affecting. My family and I are close family friend just died the other day. He'd had a mental illness that you know how I wonder if he may or may not have had had he not gone to Vietnam been exposed to drugs and to some horrible things in the war and I view him as even though he died within the last week and still a victim of that war is a conscientious objector. What what did you have to do Pat about for my that my beliefs were true and I wasn't trying to evade the draft but I had several. I was refused at the board level. I appeal to the board was refused to that. I killed him state board was turned down there and made my choice seem to be to either resist the draft going to jail. Country because I wasn't going to head trailer wasn't going to go inside of talking to an attorney that the board had issued and he said to me that I seem like a sincere young man and he was going to get me the deferment or give give me the conscientious objector status and he ended up going to the board. There was no clear process to do that with but his voice step funeral held Sway, and so I ended up working for two years as a up in order later. Nursing home. Thanks for call Pat. Thank you move on to another caller who's on the line for Minneapolis a good morning. Rick switch. I don't have never equated to being a Vietnam veteran because small amount of danger we were in but I have office with a gentleman that was a war protester during that same time for last 20 years. And so we obviously had some interesting conversations over the years. I never took any big political stance when I came back on this. I just I was young and at that point too and it just kind of went by I noticed it, but I wasn't an anti-war protester. I didn't join any other groups that were prologue. I've often wondered over the years. I've heard one. One thing I have frequently heard is how the anti-war protesters would spit on or somehow scorn Vietnam veterans when they came back and but as I've watched films and documentaries and heard people call in. I've never actually heard any specific instance of that night was I've always wondered if that's just a myth John of you that you would would say that there's a whip. There's a book out called the spitting image that that takes on that very question and gentlemen. Jerry Lemke from the sociologist at Holy Cross and a Vietnam vet wrote the book and a he argues that he can't find a single instance of a of a veteran literally being spit upon of any news account or any specific account. Everybody can kind of see a while. I've heard I heard about you know that my cousin sister's husband was spit on but nobody seems to be able to come up to a singer with a single instance of it. Clearly there were vets. Who and I've spoken with some who had to had experiences of being called baby killers who certainly felt look down upon by some people and not to minimize that that that that was a reality but but there's some support for lemke's argument that this has been overstated in it and it and that it's been one of those images that sort of calcified over the years and it may be some people have have magnified for the purposes whatever those purposes maybe if you look at a Harris poll, it was taken in 1971. That's themselves were asked do you feel for one thing I'd do you feel that you are welcomed back warmly and that sort of thing overwhelmingly. They said they were and they they were asked to do you Do you agree with the statement that anti-war protesters often blame the men and women who fought in the War for the war and 75% said no, they did not feel that so it's interesting to seems to be an image that has grown over the years from what it was even at the time and I'm not sure what to make of that but it is it is an interesting. Thing I said there would be some debate about it. I'm sure John biewen is with us correspondent for American radio works American radio works is put together a 2 hours of Special programming to Mark the 25th anniversary of the end of the war. We heard our one yesterday and which focused primarily on how the war affected America and Americans over the noon hour today hour to comes up but we go back to Vietnam to find out how the war played out in Vietnam. And what's happening in Vietnam these days this hour, we are collecting your thoughts on how the war affected you and how perhaps it continues to affect. Your John has been looking through the online scrapbook that that's being collected people's Recollections and would like you to add your Recollections to are audio scrapbook here. 651-227-6006 51227 6000 outside the Twin Cities 1 800 242. 282-865-1227 6001 800-242-2828 Marco had place my situation similar to the previous call of yours is Pat and that my family is from the south and during the Vietnam War. I filed as a conscientious objector and it won't say that I thought no pun intended with my draft board for 2 years to gain the CEO of status but I did I was one of the first of CO2 be granted that status on moral and philosophical grounds because I saw the church to which I belong to that time with a fundamentalist church and had no statement on pacifism with my family having a Navy tradition. I was pretty much vanished and family and I didn't speak for more than six years until after the war was well over and even to this day it's unfortunate, but at the time that we never talked about so when you say that the war Add repercussions at the time the days of unrest it still has a ripple effect you from today? What was the reason your family was upset with you? I don't want to say that they felt it was a treasonous act but they sell that there was a very much politics that you were out the side of good and that anyone who was supposed that's necessarily was part of the enemy and it was a long process that I am a Quaker now and actually became a Quaker in the early seventies and my family will discuss the pacifism are non-violent issues within that Quaker context of it still that the feelings that we talked about back there in the early seventies that they they still wouldn't do not wish to rest today. Thanks Marc Broussard. An observation I grew up in Columbus Ohio for 25th reunions and found out not one person from our class served in nam even served in nam school about 5 miles from us about the same size. It was a working-class. You know school has approximately 25 killed out of the same class. I like that shows just who asked about the war. I remember reading some place which a senator or Congressman son was not killed. And I think that just shows you who actually thought they were ways out of it. If you had enough money, you can buy your your way out of all right, I wonder what the feeling is of most of its for is Jane the Jane Fonda. I know Jane had the time with her seems to think she's been quite a bit of work with that said I just wonder what the Common, sorry if any of you get any sense of what the feeling is towards. I think you'd have to take a poll of veterans to a tempered really answer that question. Obviously, there is a wide wide range of of use and and write a comment from from from a veteran of a few minutes ago compared to Hitler certainly there are some vets who who still very much resent the position. She took at the time of the war. There are others who who I've spoken with two who said in the broad sense that they did not resent the anti-war movement. And for that matter, they didn't particularly Harbor any ill feelings toward Jane Fonda then or now obviously is a wide range and I just don't know if you took a survey how it would break down. Did you have you ever seen many comments you have online about this this division within the draft. Isabel males at that time that the discharge that in fact, the only people are for the most part the only people who ended up in Vietnam were poor medication minorities, right? It's it hasn't been something that's been addressed a lot online. It is something I spent a little time looking at in my research and it has been documented that there were lots of people who were able to get out of the draft because of the their family ties and things like that. I think that that there's also been some recent scholarship that suggest that's been a little bit overstated that there was in fact a pretty broad range of of people and some of the Vets I talked to were middle class college kids who got their college degrees and then we're drafted or enlisted but they're there was one striking number I so I can't remember the exact figure but the number of Harvard graduates who were killed Just to serve isolators was kind of a symbolic thing in Vietnam. It was under 20, I think and in in World War II it has been many hundreds. So it suggests that there was maybe a little bit more opportunity to to evade this war with social ties than there had been previously and maybe more of a tendency to try to do Gary your comment place. I normally don't call in line ever call into radio talk shows. But today I'm in I'm going to make an exception. I am a veteran I served over there for March of 69 to October of seventy. And as far as a Jane Fonda issue goes I wouldn't give her the time of day now or never I want thing. I may be like to set straight Vietnam was not a war. It was a conflict. It was never declared war and I I guess I guess. I hear people talk every now and then about the Vietnam war with it while there was no such thing. It was a conflict and I I wanted to I want it I guess maybe I'm the exception to the to the rule. I was I was one of the guys and I know there were more than just me who was spit on and it happened when I came back in October 70 walking through the airport at Oakland, California. I remember the I remember like it was yesterday. two guys and a girl two males and I was probably. The epitome of of the Vietnam veteran because most or all of us when we were sent back we were flown back and her jungle fatigues are closed and I happened at the time to be caring award trophy of a rifle that I obtained while I was in Cambodia. So here I was walking through Oakland airport with and jungle fatigues carrying a SKS rifle. So I was an easy target and external let me have it. So I'm probably the exception but it did happen and I'm one of the guys at happened to other than that the incident Gary how would you characterize your reception when you came back? I don't. Social I guess I guess I was I never broadcast the fact to anybody that I was there. I guess after I came back and then 70 I stayed home here in in St. Cloud for about a month and then I went to Fort Carson for 9 month in Colorado. So I guess maybe by buy it by that time I had to Maybe I won't the word is I I kind of shrugged off or paid little attention to what people thought of me because I was still in the service when I when I came back but overall. overall, I think people would have looked on a man and that they probably still do I don't broadcast the fact that I was there for that amount of time. I'm only calling in today just to make a couple of points that you guys have talked about appreciate the news headlines. Let's see who would be next to Jenny. Go ahead place. I'm 18 years old. I'm I am so thankful that my dad did not end up going to the war. He wrote. He just started college and they let you know what to do. If you was born they stay there. I've seen a guy yelling and I mean it just ruined his life and I mean it there's nothing that he can do about it anymore. You know what the time is over with her 25 years, but he can't you can't block it out of his mind because it was so horrible. Thanks, Jenny. I appreciate the call much talk about that in the online scrapbook John. Yeah, we've gotten some really interesting letters from people about the the widespread effects. Here's one from Elizabeth Worden of Minneapolis. This is my story isn't mine at all. It's the story of my brilliant young cousin who dropped out of m. I, t was quickly drafted to Vietnam and returned a heroin addict now he struggles to live on his own. It's a story of so many guys at my college safe with high lottery numbers drowning and acid pot and beer there anxiety anxiety for friends over there. They're guilty at relief for not being there themselves their grief for being for each friend lost and she goes on at the story of Gerald that high-energy redheaded neighborhood kid who enlisted went to Vietnam and came back changed. He lived at home with his parents. It was as if he couldn't shake the horror from inside his head. There are more stories to tell the war goes on in a different way the years slipped by but what has changed This is midday coming to you on Minnesota Public Radio John biewen correspondent for American radio works. Just come by today to share some of the postings that are appearing in the Vietnam scrapbook that American radio works is set up part of the special project that they've created to Mark the 25th anniversary of the end of the war all over the noon hour today our two of their special documentary Series today. We're going back to Vietnam find out how the war's effect of the Vietnamese. This all red mid day. We'd like your comments like to add your comments to are audio scrapbook how the war affected you perhaps it still does 651-227-6006 51227 6,000 if you're calling from outside the Twin Cities, give us a call toll-free at 1-800 +242-282-865-1227 6000 or 1 800-242-2828 will get to see more colors here in just a couple of minutes program on NPR supported by. Guthrie Theater Performing Sean o'casey's Masterpiece the plough in the Stars directed by Joe Dowling tickets available. Crime is a quiet violence in some cases even a prompt police response can take an hour. Maybe they should be locking their doors and that very active locking your doors means that you're not safe some experts say there are signs urban crime is quietly moving to rural areas as drug traffickers. Look for places where police are scarce join us for a special Main Street radio series a quiet violence at 7:20 and 5:50 this week on Minnesota Public Radio Canada, W FM 91.1 in the Twin Cities couple of other reminders here before we get to the news. First of all, Juan Williams is bringing the Talk of the Nation program National Public Radio stock of nation program to Minnesota today today. They're going to be broadcasting from Washburn High School over in Minneapolis, and it's free to get in and open to the public. So I'm there be talking about the kids and the new generation so I'm should be an interesting conversation 1 2 3 this afternoon at Washburn then of course tonight Catherine land for his lecture tour. Comes to a comes to a close or she speaking tonight at the College of Saint Catherine St. Paul at Whitby Hall 7 in again free and open to the public news headlines now here is good morning Gary New York city mayor Rudolph Giuliani says, he has prostate cancer. He says it's treatable in Muscat very early and they are says a decision on whether to continue his Senate campaign against Hillary Rodham Clinton will depend somewhat course of treatment he chooses to take his top priority. He says is to choose a treatment that has the best chance of success the prosecution in the Pan Am flight 103 bombing trial won't be getting any extra time to prepare its case of Scottish Court in the Netherlands has rejected a prosecution request for postponement in the trial start date due to get underway in less than a week prosecutors. Ask for the delay after the defense last week submitted a new list of more than one hundred Witnesses plus some additional evidence. The trial was originally to begin last June and has been delayed twice to live Ian's are facing murder charges in the death of the 270 people. When flight 103 blew up over Lockerbie Scotland in 1988, the National Park Service has been the recreational use of snowmobiles at nearly all of the national park recreational areas and monuments. The agency says snowmobiles have had significant adverse environmental effect on the park system. The only exception to the banner parks in Alaska and the voyageurs national park in Minnesota or congress specifically allowed to use of snowmobiles that applies to 12 national parks and includes Yellowstone Park in Wyoming in Regional news. St. Paul companies is reporting a 3% decrease in earnings for its first quarter D. St. Paul bass Insurance, 150 million dollars or $0.63 a share down from almost 154 million dollars in the same period a year ago the results fell short of analyst forecast on higher-than-expected claimed and inadequate pricing of older policies the forecast for Minnesota today calls for cloudy Sky Statewide was scattered showers in the north and west high temperatures today mainly The sixties at this hour st. Cloud before it's cloudy skies and 60°. It's fair in Rochester and 61 Duluth reports Fair skies and 57 and in the Twin Cities partly cloudy skies a temperature of 64 degrees Gary. That's a check on the latest news 24 minutes now before noon, this is midday coming to you on Minnesota Public Radio, and this hour or the program. We're talking about the Vietnam War how it affected you and how perhaps it continues to affect. You would like you to give us a call here and add your comments to are audio scrapbook on the Vietnam War 651-227-6000 or one 800-242-2828. Merican radio works correspond. A John biewen has joined us. He's been looking through some of the postings in the online Vietnam scrapbook and sharing some some comments from the Scrapbook as well. Go back to the phone's Ellen's on the line from Shakopee. Good morning Ellen. For taking my call. I'd like to just make a few comments about my experience my family experience with the War. I remember at a very young age 11 and 12 of hearing over the radio like at five 6 at night the Grim reports of people the young men coming back and body bags and my father was very much and anti-war activist and he took one of my four brothers and me to South Dakota when we were eleven or twelve and we campaign for McCarthy against the war and we were chased off of people's Lawns by their dogs and everything else and Now these areas outside of Sioux Falls have turned around change the different demographics political point of view. But for a long time there was nothing written about the war except perhaps for David halberstam the Pulitzer Prize both the best and the brightest and there was such a gap in what was written and now finally it's getting talked about but I also recall that my uncle my father's brother was CIA military and he was very early on over in Vietnam. And of course he couldn't talk about it. But I remember one of those summer times he and my father having a furious debate out on the patio about what was right and what was wrong with the war and his point of view and My father's anti-war work with Eugene McCarthy. And it's it's Creador the rift that I don't think was ever resolved and then one of my brothers was a conscientious objector in that process was really quite something. He recalls going down to the draft board and sitting waiting for his appointment in the appalling realization turn up the secretaries sitting there typing away people's lives and he lost a lot of quote on quote friends Pandora key to understand what friendship mean it was it was quite a and experience for him and for all my brothers. It was a constant fear of having them sent over to a war that was being awesome. It seemed largely by the Ortiz in the Poor Ellen move on to another call or after but thanks for your comments. There is some recent work that that does debunk pretty much the idea that that that minorities were vastly more that disproportionately went to Vietnam and died in Vietnam. In fact, it's it's it's not really true very only slightly above their proportion in the population of something like 13% of the soldiers killed in Vietnam were African-American 87%. We're where wear white or Hispanic and that's pretty close to what the proportion was in the population at the time David. Thanks for calling in this morning. You're coming. Thank you so much for the chance to keep processing this Vietnam thing. It's it's real important to some of us. I was in North Vietnamese interpreter with Air Force intelligence. Kind of a long do the National Security Agency toward the end of the war and going to Southeast Asia. We had heard the names of the enemy, you know, Google can shank and Charlie and zip and to have those kinds of names without getting to know the personal people makes it easier to do what you have to do. And that's that's what the military people were trained that way for a reason, but I got to know the Vietnamese and kind of an unusual way. We were radio intercept specialist and and we we would hear the propaganda and the military reports are coming across with what they thought were secure secure Communications and but then after those reports were done and after we heard the cruelty and the propaganda and some of that stuff, we also heard the radio operator start just chatting just normal stuff, you know who's sleeping with whom and we ran out of rice last week, and we've asked the villagers but none of them will give us and so one of us went off. Find a bicycle and and try trying to get rice from somewhere and we got a personal glimpse of the people. That was that Jane Fonda did not get that really almost no Americans did and I remember thinking when Saigon fell and we were over there monitoring that I remember thinking. It's going to be a very long while before we get to know the Vietnamese people personally and maybe at the 25-year Marcus would be at a nice time to let the stereotypes kind of drop and and get to know people personally. Alright. Thanks David. Well, we should get a better idea of what actually is going on in Vietnam over the noon hour today with that second part of the American radio works documentary project David's on the line now another David from St. Louis Park the morning David. I just wanted to add a different perspective and that's of the huge Vietnamese and Monday Aspera that was created because of you get mono more. I worked with refugees in Hong Kong back in the early eighties and saw the terrible conditions that thousands hundreds of thousands of people lived in following that war and then the pain of Separation in the difficulty of starting Life Anew in another country be at the United States or one of dozens of countries around the world. I think we forget that we focused on on our payment and that's understandable, but we forget the pain of many many millions of other people who were displaced by this war one of John picked up anything in his in the scrapbooks regarding that. Yes. In fact, we've got some postings from Vietnamese Americans and Vietnamese Living in America. We got some very moving descriptions by Vietnamese. Bye bye American Vietnam Vets about about really painful descriptions of of seeing Vietnamese people suffering a Dying and it was one just absolutely wrenching description of a young woman. Who was The Prostitute Vietnamese who was killed by an American Soldier just murdered senselessly because he got drunk and but here's a posting from a vietnamese-american be a new n in Fairfax. Virginia says I was there witnessed all the ugly human suffering from both side to me as well. As two most Vietnamese people living overseas the wounds cannot be healed the nightmares cannot be stopped. Although I always feel that I'm one of the luckiest ones who have been able to enjoy all freedoms from the most beautiful country in the world that the world can offer. I'm still suffering the wounds mentally and physically and he had the political note. Please do not make another mistake about the Vietnam Vietnamese communist. They are the worst in are thousands of years long history and must be destroyed to build a real democracy society and be Back to the phone's Bruce is on the line from Minneapolis with some comments on the war by Bruce is burning laws in 1972 three years before they're coming to cover allows and my father was one of many moments were recruited by the CIA to fight for their I've lost her I'm going with my and he was captured by the enemy send it was never returned and I just want to say that I'm just a lot of people and it confused who I have many different questions. Like what is your best guess David has mentioned and I might think they're dumb that's something that we got to keep an open mind and something that should be talked about with the refugees in the Twin Cities in the states. And with many other people who do not have a chance to come to the United States war in Laos or in Thailand and Philippines. Bruce before you go. I'm curious. What can you characterize what the general thinking is among the Hmong people was that a war that was worth fighting field. Like American did not care if they break their promise and they have promised certain things that they would help me regardless of what the result would be in after the last nineteen seventy-five. I was born into somebody to as I said earlier and that times supposed to higher mountains a blouse and if you need me to come and fight the more people you might know I have been killed after leaving the Americans last so there's a consensus telling me that they feel like American do what they're supposed to do. FAU car is initially may have been okay, but we didn't follow through on our promises to the month St. Louis Park morning, Kim and graduated from high school in 86 and I have to educational experience at about Vietnam one was that a first grade teacher should have made us pray for a plane that was shot down full of refugee children had no idea what we are doing or why and the other is my mom when I was in high school questioning, you know, what did I learn about Vietnam? Cuz I had some questions for her that time and help all she was when she looked in my history book that we are using so this would have been in about 85 had nothing at all about it. I mean just absolutely nothing and she was just so Set aside by that and of course, I didn't know you know, and really I like programs like this because I this is my education on it. But I feel like in 132 I was born during the war and grew up and went to live when it ended but no really nothing about it have no experience. No family was in it and just it's this kind of mysterious thing to me and I think there's probably a lot of people out there like that, along those lines John at the pier on the online. Yes. Well, it is interesting that we've got a number of postings from young people. Actually most of them have more direct experiences, for example of father who served Ora parents who were active in the antiwar movement, but it is something that that interest interested us when we started looking at this because it was you could start out with looking at a project like this and say Olivia at Nam War we all we all kind of know The basic fact of the Vietnam War and then you remember that we is that those of us who are close to forty or above and and there's a heck of a lot of people who for whom it's almost ancient history certainly history and it is a reminder of how useful it is to go back in and take a look and remind people what actually happened. So there's always this ongoing debate about the lessons of Vietnam and and more fundamental of course is a lot of people don't even know what we have now they tax were and then obviously then you even if you just going to State what the facts were then then then there's a lot of debate about that too, but it's it's worth a try anyway. Tom's on the line from Lutsen. Good morning, Good morning. I'm curious to know if there's any documentation or any evidence that would show that the draft resistance movement had any effect at all in in shortening shortening. The War II was a draft resister involved in the Twin City draft information center and went through that process and felt that I was in some way doing my duty to my country in that I was resisting and trying to stop the draft and get our country out of that Conflict by resisting and not breaking the law but using the the draft law as a way to slow the system down and at but I I have no idea if if they have that my effort or all of those people who did the I kind of took the route that I did had any effect at all. I'm not sure I think historians would debate how much the opposition to the war expressed by people who would have been drafted or were drafted or Rest by soldiers in the field and all of that how much that actually had an effect on on the government deciding to get out but it is clear that there was a report written in 1971 by a military Colonel called the collapse of the Armed Forces and he was talking about incredibly low morale among the forces in Vietnam who just didn't want to be there didn't believe in the effort anymore at that point also because there was supposedly a gradual withdrawal didn't think didn't believe they were there to win the war and so just felt they were risking their lives for something that that the Country Wasn't committed to end the end the anti-war movement at home and I heard one figure historian told me and I don't remember remember exactly what the time frame was, but at a certain Frame for the end of the war there were more conscientious objectors than there were people drafted it really at toward the end of the war. They were having trouble getting anybody who to go in anybody who is interested in going and interested in fighting once they got there and I do think that may have played some role in the government saying, you know even to preserve the Armed Forces we need to we need to end this this thing. When are your comment, please? Wanted to tell you about that. I felt it was Jane Fonda was in. Incredibly Brave to go to Vietnam when she did the North Vietnam. During the war because actresses depend on popularity. And clearly this was not a popular thing to do but it was a horrible thing for major industrialized country of the world to it and do it terrible things that we did in Vietnam. and I was very much a person who Was against the war and protested the war and continue to produce the people who were in Vietnam draft information center. I sent them money, even though I was on a graduate school salary at the time as I was I was not a child. I was much older than most of the anti-war protesters. But I just thought it was really wrong. When are I'm going to have to cut you off but I appreciate your call. We're out of time here. But thanks so much for calling John B. Wonder if people want to add their their comments on the website. How do they how do they do that? The simple way to get there it is you can get there from the front page of the NPR cited mpr.org where you can go straight to the page at American radio works. All one word American radio works. Org by all means we invite everybody who would like to do. So te to come in right there, It's great the great project. Thanks for coming in the shower John. Thank U Verry correspondent John biewen. We're going to break here for The Writer's Almanac and then over the noon hour today second part of the American radio works project Vietnam a nation not a war. I'm Juan Williams on Thursday April 27th Talk of the Nation will be in Minneapolis youth is the focus of this month changing face of America. Siri will be talking about the new generation of Americans that summer crawling the Millennials and looking at their growing support for gay students in high school doing its April 27th from 1 to 3 at Washburn High School or listen on Minnesota Public Radio k n o w FM 91.1 in the Twin Cities. Yes, Minneapolis Washburn this afternoon at 1 it's free and open to the public. And here is The Writer's Almanac for Thursday. It's April 27th 2000. It's the anniversary of the Chinese student Uprising in Beijing China in square in 1989 students for more than 40 universities around China ignored the warnings of the government and marched on the Square to protest a communist party's newspaper editorial which accused of small handful of plotters of stirring up student unrest it's the birthday of August Wilson in Pittsburgh 1944. He dropped out of school at the age of 15 work a lot of odd jobs, but was drawn to the public library or he read books by Ralph Ellison. Langston Hughes Richard Wright. It was his inspiration to become a writer his first major play came out in 1984. It was ma rainey's black bottom. And it ran for 275 performances from this he went on to write fences which won a Tony Award and his first Pulitzer for drama the piano lesson learned him another it's the birthday of the poet and critic and also detective story writers C Day-Lewis born in volunteer group Ireland in 1904. Probably some twenty bucks reverse for novels and also some detective novels under the pseudonym Nicholas Blake. It's the birthday of Walter Lantz the cartoonist who created Woody Woodpecker born in New Rochelle, New York 1940 woodpecker made his first appearance laughing his machine gun laugh in a short called knock knock 1940 Lance's wife Grace supplied the voice. It's the birthday of Ulysses S Grant born in Point Pleasant, Ohio 1820 to attend West Point fought in the Mexican War distinguished himself there was censured by the Army for being drunk and resigned his commission but had a chance to redeem himself in the Civil War President Lincoln made him commander of the Union armies in 1864 after his successes in Eastern, Tennessee, and he brought about the Confederates surrender at Appomattox in 1865. And it's the birthday of the artist and inventor Samuel FB Morse born in Charlestown, Massachusetts 1791. He was an accomplished painter of historical portraits, but he was very curious about electricity and the possibility of transmitting information by Electric impulses. He thought up a code based on dots and dashes to send and receive messages which of course became known as the morse code and built the first Telegraph line between Baltimore and Washington in 18. 43 Here's a poem for today. Shakespeare's sonnet 75. So are you to my thoughts as food to life or a sweet season showers are to the ground and for the piece of you. I hold sex drive as twixt a miser and his wealth is found. Now proud as an enjoy Yer and a non doubting. The filching age will steal his treasure now counting best to be with you alone then bet that the world may see my pleasure. Sometime Off full with feasting on your side and by-and-by clean starved for a look possessing or pursuing nodal I save what is had or must from Yulee took us to buy pine and surfeit day by day or gluttoning on or all the way. Shakespeare Sonnet 75. So are you to my farts as food to Life That's The Writer's Almanac for Thursday, April 27th made possible by 21 North Main. Com for Book Lovers will find more than 10 million used rare and at aquarium books on the web at 21 North Main. Com be well do good work and keep in touch. Regional broadcast of The Writer's Almanac are supported by market Banks your community bank offering a broad range of financial services for your business and personal needs. news headlines are coming up next and then we'll get to that new documentary Vietnam a nation not a war on the next all things considered the war of words over walleye continuous between Minnesota and Ontario that story on the next All Things Considered weekdays at 3 on Minnesota Public Radio k n o w FM 91.1 You're listening to Minnesota Public Radio. We have a sunny Sky 64 degrees at care W FM 91.1 Minneapolis. And st. Paul partly cloudy through the afternoon with a high approaching 70° 40% chance for rain in the cities tonight with a low near 50 rain tomorrow as well. By the way those of you in Southwestern, Minnesota your tunic and SW in Worthington. From Minnesota Public Radio and National Public Radio. This is an American radio works Special Report Vietnam a nation. Not a war. I'm the abusing Burg to most Americans Vietnam is a nation Frozen in time and memory it seems a distant place where 58,000 Americans lost their lives in a war whose purpose seems even less clear today and when the war ended 25 years ago has killed a 900 wounded make He knows that he has met his master in the field. Unconditionally to the VA in this special report American radio works travels across today's Vietnam finding a complex Nation struggling to recover from its wartime past in the next hour Vietnam a nation not a war first the news.