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GARY EICHTEN: You're listening to Minnesota Public Radio. We have a sunny sky, 11 degrees above at KNOW FM 91.1 Minneapolis and Saint Paul. Should be sunny all afternoon-- temperatures about as warm as they're going to get. 30% chance for snow in the cities tonight with temperatures rising into the 20s and then partly cloudy and mild tomorrow, almost warm tomorrow with a high near 40 degrees.

KORVA COLEMAN: From NPR News in Washington, I'm Korva Coleman. Indian representatives have started to negotiate with the hijackers of an Indian Airlines plane now in Kandahar, Afghanistan. The Indian government sent the negotiators after the hijackers threatened to start killing more passengers.

A spokesman for the ruling Afghan junta, the Taliban, says conditions are bad inside the jet. The passengers are tired and tense, and the hijackers are agitated. The pilot has reportedly pleaded for help from the international community. The hijackers have demanded the Indian government release militant prisoners from Kashmir. That province is fighting to separate from Indian and Hindu control.

Russia's prime minister says the military offensive to take over the Chechen capital, Grozny, is going as planned. But Russian forces are meeting fierce resistance on the ground. NPR'S Michele Kelemen reports.

MICHELE KELEMEN: Russian forces, for a third straight day, were trying to push toward the center of Grozny. Commanders have explained they're moving neighborhood by neighborhood, trying to minimize Russian losses. And Prime Minister Vladimir Putin told reporters everything is going as planned.

A pro-Moscow militia leader, Beslan Gantamirov, claims federal forces captured a district of the city today, but sources close to Gantamirov told the Interfax News Agency that Chechen rebels are putting up fierce resistance and that there have been losses on both sides. Gantamirov, who was in prison for embezzlement before President Boris Yeltsin pardoned him, had been predicting Grozny would be captured by new year's, but some of his volunteers are now expressing doubts. Chechnya's president, meantime, is vowing to fight to the end. Michele Kelemen, NPR News Moscow.

KORVA COLEMAN: The Reform Party is moving its headquarters out of Dallas to the Florida home of the incoming party chairman. Supporters of Reform Party founder Ross Perot say this means the founder has lost power. But the incoming chairman, Jack Gargan, says this isn't true.

The astronauts aboard the space shuttle Discovery are preparing for landing today at the NASA Kennedy Space Center in Florida. Forecasters are watching winds around the landing strip, which could delay touchdown. From member station WMFE, Pat Duggins reports.

PAT DUGGINS: The space shuttle makes its landing without engine power in a steep approach, like a dive bomber run. The speed and direction of the winds around the landing strip are critical, since the shuttle can't loop around for a second try.

The current forecast calls for winds out of the west at 17 miles an hour, which is acceptable for landing. Astronaut Curt Brown will be at the control stick during today's landing attempt. He says if he gets a choice, he wants to bring the shuttle down to Kennedy.

CURT BROWN: That's what the orbiter should be doing. It should be landing where we took off so they can get back into processing and get ready for the next flight.

PAT DUGGINS: Ground controllers continue to check out the new parts on the Hubble Space Telescope. The observatory could start working again within two weeks. For NPR News, I'm Pat Duggins in Orlando.

KORVA COLEMAN: On Wall Street, The Dow Jones Industrials are up nearly 20 points at 11,425. Trading is light. This is NPR.

SPEAKER 1: Support for National Public Radio comes from the Corporation for Public Broadcasting and the Geraldine R. Dodge Foundation for reporting on biological resource issues.

GRETA CUNNINGHAM: With news from Minnesota Public Radio, I'm Greta Cunningham. About 95,000 Minnesota families can access welfare benefits through ATM machines earlier than usual this week because of concerns over Y2K problems. The State Department of Human Services has been preparing for the year 2000 rollover since 1996, and officials are confident it will go smoothly and not disrupt aid payments.

But Kate Wolfe, director of the computer system that issues payments for welfare and food stamps says just in case there are problems, families that get benefits through ATM machines can access them by Wednesday, instead of waiting until closer to the new year.

KATE WOLFE: We have a number of different power companies in the state and different telephone companies, and there's always a possibility that one may have problems. So just to be on the safe side, we're issuing benefits-- making the benefits available earlier.

GRETA CUNNINGHAM: Wolfe says computer technicians have examined every inch of the DHS computer system, and three federal agencies have given it their best rating. Minnesota officials say they're prepared for the possibility that members of the state's second-largest employees union may go on strike this week. Negotiators for Minnesota's Association of Professional Employees and the state returned to the bargaining table today.

MAPE, whose members include parole officers, computer technicians, and food inspectors, could go on strike as early as tomorrow at midnight if the talks fail. Minnesota's Commissioner of Administration says if MAPE members walk off the job, the state has lined up other state employees and independent contractors to provide critical state functions.

Checking conditions around the region, mostly sunny skies reported in. Rochester reports sunshine and 10 above. It's sunny in St. Cloud and 7 above. Duluth reports sunshine and 4 above. And in the Twin Cities, mostly sunny skies, a temperature of 11 degrees. That's the news update. I'm Greta Cunningham.

GARY EICHTEN: Thanks, Greta. 6 minutes past 12:00.

[MUSIC PLAYING]

Good afternoon. Welcome back to Midday on Minnesota Public Radio. I'm Gary Eichten. Glad you could join us. Well, during this hour of Midday, we're going to meet Saint Paul actor and vocalist Joe Carter. Mr. Carter will be the master of ceremonies for this Thursday's big first STAR Capital New Year celebration in Saint Paul.

He's perhaps best known, though, for his stage work in Penumbra Theater's Black Nativity. Joe Carter has been traveling the world singing, teaching others to sing, and telling stories. He's a very popular performer in Russia. He's just returned from Brazil. And next month, he'll be performing in Nigeria.

When he was young, Mr. Carter began his world travels working in Haiti as a missionary. Well, Joe Carter stopped by our studios recently, along with accompanist Roland Wilson to talk about his life-- part of our Voices of Minnesota series. Carter told Minnesota Public Radio's Dan Olson that the eight Carter children were raised by their parents in Cambridge, Massachusetts.

Was it a good time for the family? Was the Carter family able to make ends meet, and life was good?

JOE CARTER: You know something? It was some years later I had a scholarship to the New England Conservatory, which was something that was really a desire of mine. And at the same time, I got the interest and the call to do something different.

And I came home one day and told my mother, I said, I'm not going to the Conservatory. She looked at me. I'm going to Haiti to help the poor. And the look on her face was as if to say, child, don't you know you're poor? You need to help yourself.

Well, I didn't know we were poor because there was love in the house. And Mama and Daddy were always there. And I didn't know how hard they had to work to make ends meet. My mother worked a full-time job. And often, she was cleaning the house of some of my wealthy schoolmates-- their parents' homes. And my father worked as a laborer. But we were rich.

DAN OLSON: Where did the inspiration to go to Haiti come from?

JOE CARTER: That's a hard thing to describe. I think the-- people often hear about this idea of calling. And there are a lot of different reasons why we do things. Sometimes we do things because we want adventure or because we want to try something interesting or new.

And then there's another reason, and that's when one has something so seared into their consciousness that you cannot not do it. You have to go and do it. And somehow, I had heard about Haiti. And through a series of very interesting and unusual stories which I won't tell now, I knew I was supposed to go.

DAN OLSON: What work did you end up doing in Haiti? Did you make it?

JOE CARTER: I was a missionary. And I wasn't sent by a church or by an organization. I went on my own. And everyone thought I was crazy-- my family, my church. And I suppose I was crazy, in a sense, but it was a good crazy because it turned out that it was the best thing that I ever did in my life.

DAN OLSON: Why is that? What did it leave with you?

JOE CARTER: I saw people living together in small communities and sharing everything in common. I saw people who were full of faith, people who were full of kindness. Even though they were the poorest people in the Western Hemisphere, they were very rich in many other ways.

And so part of my job there was to encourage them-- to encourage them to believe that they could do the things they wanted to do. I started schools. I had six elementary and primary schools by the time I was 23.

DAN OLSON: And you were not in danger as a self-appointed American missionary? I forget, was it the Duvalier regime that was in power at this time?

JOE CARTER: Yes, it was. And I was in danger. I didn't know it at the beginning. And one day, I got arrested by the Tonton Macoute, the sort of Gestapo for Duvalier. And I was taken to Duvalier's palace at gunpoint and was put in a room in the middle of the palace with soldiers surrounding me. And I had a rifle at both temples.

And I say now that I went through a mock execution. Of course, I know they could have killed me if they had really intended to. But I was being accused of trying to overthrow Duvalier because I could get huge crowds of people together at short notice.

It was a miracle that I really got out of the palace alive. That's the way I feel now. But of course, I know, as I say, if they wanted to kill me, they could have. But I was on the first plane out of the country the next morning.

And at the airport, I told some Haitians-- I said, I'm going to Washington, DC, and I'm going to demand an apology from the Haitian government for treating me this way. And someone spoke to me very quietly and said, Monsieur Carter, if you go to Washington, please do not speak of this thing because if you speak of it, then you will really have trouble, if you know what I mean. So go home and forget.

And I didn't tell anybody when I went home what had happened because I was afraid they would try to prevent me from going back to Haiti. And three weeks later, I was back. I kept calling their bluff. And eventually they found out I wasn't trying to overthrow Duvalier. Now, let me tell you, if you had delusions of grandeur, and you wanted to be the ruler of a country, would you choose the poorest country in the Western Hemisphere? I think not.

When I first went to Haiti in 1968, I was the only African-American man who was living in Haiti as a missionary at that time. And most of the missionaries were white Southerners, and some of them had problems. Some of them were racist, unfortunately, which I discovered.

And one of the things that they did was they took the culture of the people away. They took all of the African-sounding songs-- anything with rhythm, anything with drums-- and they replaced them with French songs and American songs. And I was outraged by that because I loved the African music. I loved the music, the real Haitian music. And so I encouraged the people to sing their own songs. And then I started learning to sing the songs with them.

[SINGING IN FRENCH]

Oh, I hear

A voice a-calling me

Oh, I hear

A voice a-calling me

That voice is the voice of the Lord

That voice is the voice of the Lord

[SINGING IN FRENCH]

That voice is the voice of the Lord

That voice is the voice of the Lord

DAN OLSON: What was your first public performance as a vocalist?

JOE CARTER: John Hancock Hall in Boston. It was a convocation for the school that I was going to at the time. And I remember Goldie Korenberg, who was my choral director-- she wanted me to sing a solo that the chorus was singing.

And we went into this 2,500-seat auditorium, and I said, but Mrs. Korenberg, where is the microphone? She said, my dear, the microphone is inside you. That's the only microphone you will see. And I said, how can I sing to this big, huge place? She said, little women who are 5 feet tall stand at the Metropolitan Opera in front of 5,000 people and sing above an orchestra of 110 pieces. If they can do it, you can, too, and I'm going to teach you how to breathe.

And I'll never forget the night that that event took place, and I came out in a choir robe, and the song that they had me sing was "Sometimes I Feel Like a Motherless Child." And I remember how scared I was walking out on that stage. Could I do it? Could I do it?

And when the first note left my mouth, I could feel it. It felt like it was just tumbling, tumbling all the way through the auditorium, all the way to the back. And then it reverberated and came back to me. I was electrified. And my mother and father were in the audience that day. That's the only time my father ever heard me sing.

["SOMETIMES I FEEL LIKE A MOTHERLESS CHILD" PLAYING]

Sometimes I feel

Like a motherless child

Sometimes I feel

Like a motherless child

Oh, Lord, sometimes

I feel like a motherless child

a long way from home

A long way from my home

Sometimes I feel

Like I'm almost done

Sometimes I feel

Like I'm almost done

Oh, Lord, sometimes

I feel like I'm almost done

And a long way from home

A long way from home

True, true believers

A long way from my home

DAN OLSON: We're pleased to have in the studio Joe Carter and Roland Wilson-- our Voices of Minnesota conversation. When was your first trip to Russia, and why did you go?

JOE CARTER: My first trip to Russia was in 1989. I had the great fortune of being able to portray Paul Robeson in a musical that was written for me, and I did so in San Francisco. It was a few days before opening. The person who was going to be the accompanist somehow disappeared, and there I was three days before opening in San Francisco. I had 20-something songs in the show and no accompanist.

And someone called me up, and they said, I heard that you're having problems with the accompanist. He said, I'd be very glad to help. I know Mr. Robeson's repertoire. And this very stately, kind, generous gentleman in his 70s appeared, and he was Paul Robeson's accompanist in his final Carnegie Hall concerts, William Duncan Allen, who was the accompanist of Todd Duncan for many years.

And as a result of his playing for me, I met lots of Paul Robeson's old friends and so on. And during that period of time, I came to know and to love who this man was and what he represented. And it was through him that I developed an interest in Russia because he was constantly talking about the great Russian people. And he sang Russian songs, as he sang songs of the peoples of many nations.

And the seed was planted then. And it wasn't until five years later or so here in Minneapolis I decided, I want to go to Russia, but I don't know quite how to do it. And I got a telephone call, and it was from a minister of a big church in Minneapolis. And he wanted me to come to the church and sing at some point.

And we just started talking, and he talked about being involved in this cultural exchange organization going to Russia. I sang at his church, and two women came running out of the audience and hugged me, and they said, oh, Mr. Carter, would you ever be willing to come to Russia and do just what you did here this morning? I thought, twist my arm. And they were with the Sister City Project, going to Novosibirsk in Siberia.

The front rows of this auditorium were filled with Communist Party leaders. I tried to end the concert. Each time I tried to end, someone would send a note up wanting me to sing yet another song. And finally, they sent a note up wanting "We Shall Overcome."

And the Russians stood up spontaneously, began to hold hands all throughout this auditorium of about 1,000 people, began to sway back and forth singing "We Shall Overcome" in Russian. Some were singing it in English. And I was just totally amazed because I was not making them do any of this. I mean, this was all spontaneous.

And then I noticed there was a group of people on the main floor who were circling another group of people. They were in this circle, and they were singing and swaying. And there were people getting up at certain places, hugging one another. There were people who were crying. I'm like, goodness.

Well, I found out later that the people who were being circled on that main floor were a group of mayors from Minnesota who just happened to be in Siberia that night. And they were supposed to go to the ballet, and they heard this man from Saint Paul, Joe Carter, was going to be-- so they showed up at my concert. But the people were circling them-- they were saying, we want you to go home and tell your people, we don't want war. We want to be friends.

And from that point on, I thought, I can stand on any stage, any place in the world. I know those people because they're just like me. I know them. They're not significantly different.

They've got the same needs, the same desires, the same hopes, the same fears. And I can talk to them. I can use my culture and what I know, but I can get to those universal ideas that everyone responds to.

And that was the beginning of a love affair with me and people in Russia. And my most recent trip was two years ago, and we did a production of Porgy and Bess. And I brought the great singer from the Twin Cities, Faye Washington, a wonderful soprano.

And we did the jazz version, which was done by Louis Armstrong and Ella Fitzgerald. My neighbors see me taking off my suitcase. They have no idea what I'm doing and what I do for a living. My neighbor said, where are you going this time, Joe? I said, Siberia. She said, my god, you must be nuts. This was in the middle of January.

And the newspaper in Novosibirsk-- the headline said, "Summertime in Siberia." Well, it was 30 degrees below zero in Siberia the night of that concert. And I found out it was 35 below in Saint Paul, so there it goes.

["SUMMERTIME PLAYING"]

Summertime and the livin' is easy

Fish are jumpin'

And the cotton is high

Oh, your daddy is rich

And your ma, she's good-lookin'

So hush, little baby

Don't you cry

One of these mornings,

You're going to rise up singin'

Then you'll spread your wings

And you'll take to the sky

But 'ti, 'til that morning

There's a-nothing can harm you

With Daddy and Mammy standing by

Summertime and the livin' is easy

Fish are jumpin'

And the cotton is high

Oh, yes, oh, your daddy is rich

And your Ma, she's good-lookin'

So hush, little baby

Don't you cry

So hush, little baby

Don't you cry

So hush, little baby

Don't you cry

DAN OLSON: Joe Carter, and Roland Wilson at the keyboard. Joe Carter, you're just back from Brazil, among other places. What in the world--

JOE CARTER: From Brazil.

DAN OLSON: What in the world were you doing in Brazil?

JOE CARTER: Well, I was attending a Conference on the Americas for an organization called Moral Re-Armament which is basically a peacemaking organization. And this was a conference of people from all over South America and Central America, Latin America to talk about the issues of their countries and what initiatives are being done to make positive change in various communities.

And North America had to be represented, so I went representing the United States and was part of the conference, part of the discussions, raising issues, and also did some concerts for them, and in addition, had a chance to visit some of the favelas in the big cities. The favelas are the slums.

And we were in Salvador in Bahia. Bahia is one of the great states of Brazil. And this was the area where the slaves were brought. And today, the African population is very large, and the culture has remained in the art and the music.

That's where all the good music from Brazil comes from-- Bahia. And actually, the people were very similar to the Haitian people in their history. Some of the culture from the Yoruba culture that exists in Haiti also exists in Brazil.

Anyway, part of the joy was being able to go to some of the favelas and to find out who was making positive change in those communities, who was building the schools, who was working with the children. And I had a chance to meet lots of the kids and to sing with them, and for them, and to them and to talk to them about their dreams-- about hope and about the possibilities that lay before them.

DAN OLSON: When you're talking with kids and teaching them music, what do you teach them? What kind of songs do you teach them?

JOE CARTER: Well, usually, when I go to schools, wherever I go, I tell the story of the African-American sojourn through the music of my ancestors, the spirituals. And so many of these songs are known around the world. Children every place sing them. For example, in Russia, the children knew "Joshua Fit the Battle of Jericho." In Brazil, the children knew "Swing Low, Sweet Chariot," and "Kumbaya," and all of those songs, so I would sing those sort of songs with them.

I remember a group of teenage boys who had-- they had a singing group and were in Salvador in one of the slums. And they had heard that I was a singer. They saw me when I was coming, so they grabbed me and said, sing a song for us. And I said, well, I don't do pop music. They said, what do you do? Do you do reggae?

I said, well, no. I've got some songs, though, that I think Bob Marley probably listened to. He listened to the songs of my people, the spirituals-- and his people and your people. This is all our music. And I started singing this song.

(SINGING) Didn't my Lord deliver Daniel

Deliver Daniel

Deliver Daniel?

Didn't my Lord deliver Daniel?

Why not everyone?

He delivered Daniel from the lion's den

Jonah from the belly of the whale

The Hebrew children from the fiery furnace.

Why not every one?

Didn't my Lord deliver Daniel?

And those kids were clapping. They were-- and afterwards, they said, we like that music. We like that music. We want to learn that. They felt something about that. They knew it was real. This is folk music. This is music that came up through the communities of people through generations and generations.

And the music has sort of a purity to it, and they recognize that. They said, we want to learn some of these songs. And they were clapping and singing with me.

(SINGING) Didn't my Lord deliver Daniel

Deliver Daniel

Deliver Daniel?

Didn't my Lord deliver Daniel?

Why not every man?

Oh, didn't my Lord deliver Daniel, Daniel

Deliver Daniel?

Didn't my Lord deliver Daniel?

Why not every man?

He delivered Daniel from the lion's den

Jonah from the belly of the whale

The Hebrew children from the fiery furnace.

Why not every man?

Oh, didn't my Lord deliver Daniel

Deliver Daniel

Deliver Daniel?

Didn't my Lord deliver Daniel?

Why not every man?

The moon runs down in a purple stream

The sun refused to shine

And every star did disappear

Jesus shall be mine

Oh, didn't my Lord deliver Daniel

Deliver Daniel

Deliver Daniel?

Oh, didn't my Lord deliver Daniel?

Why not every man?

Why not every man?

Why not every man?

DAN OLSON: Joe Carter, and Roland Wilson at the keyboard. Among your other travels, the word is, in January, you're headed over to Africa. Where will you be, and what will you be doing?

JOE CARTER: Well, I hope it happens in January. With the Y2K, I don't know what my travel plans are right now. But I've been-- well, this summer, I was in Switzerland at a peace conference.

And this is a conference of this organization, MRA, which has been going on for 50 years, and they've got this wonderful mountain-top palace, which is a center for reconciliation. And every summer, people come from all over the world, from every nation, every religion, every background. And they come for one thing-- to talk about and to deal, how can we make changes in our communities and in our lives?

So this summer, I was thrilled to find out that the Emir of Kano would be there, a great traditional king from Africa. And of course, as someone of African descent born in America, I was really very anxious just to get a look at the great king and to find out something about what his world was like.

Well, I had an opportunity to have a private dinner with the Emir. And all the Nigerians told me-- they told me what to say, and what not to say, and what to ask him. And they said, when you have dinner with the Emir, you ask him about the Durbar. And I said, what's that?

They said, well, there's this ceremonial occasion twice a year when Kings of Africa-- or within the nation of Nigeria-- you see, they had ancient kingdoms. The boundaries have been changed through colonialism and so on, but they still respect these ancient boundaries. So Kano is one of the ancient states, and the Emir of Kano is the King of 15.5 million people.

So twice a year, kings and chiefs from all over-- they come to present themselves before the Emir. And they do it in a ceremonial occasion with Arabian horses and camels. And they say there's more gold displayed on that day than you would see anyplace in the world. So they said, ask the Emir-- tell the Emir you want to go to the Durbar.

And so I asked him about the Durbar, and he began to tell me-- he said, you must come. And I thought, well, before I leave the table, I'd like, really, a real invitation. And at the end of the dinner, I said, Your Highness, well, how will I receive an invitation to the Durbar? And he snapped his fingers, and his aide came and gave me his card. And he said, you write me, and I will write you.

Well, a couple of nights later, the queen was in my concert, and she had a good time. And at the end of the concert, I gave her my flowers. And she said, when are you coming to Kano? When are you coming to Kano? I said, well, in January, if I receive the invitation from His Highness. She said, you will have it.

She said, may I ask you, Mr. Carter, are you married yet? And I said, no, not yet. She said, oh, praise be to Allah, we will find you a wife when you come to Kano. You will come to Kano one, and you will go away two. And when you come back again, you will be three.

[LAUGHTER]

DAN OLSON: Big plans, Joe. There are big plans for you.

JOE CARTER: Oh, that part scared me.

["MA CURLY HEADED BABY" PLAYING]

Oh, my baby

My curly-headed baby

I'll sing you fast to sleep

and love you so as I sing

Ohm my baby

My curly-headed baby

Just tuck your head like little bird

Beneath it's Mammy's wing

So la-la, la-la, la-la lullaby-by

Does you want the stars to play with

Or the moon to run away with?

They'll come if you don't cry

So la-la, la-la, la-la lullaby-by

Into Mammy's arms be creepin'

And soon you'll be a-sleeping'

La-la, la-la, la-la, la-la, la, lullaby

DAN OLSON: Joe Carter, we know you among other things, from Black Nativity. You were one of the original cast members. This is the--

JOE CARTER: A long time ago.

DAN OLSON: A long time ago. Well--

JOE CARTER: Well, I did it for 11 years.

DAN OLSON: Yeah. The Langston Hughes story of the Nativity. It's a gospel song-fest built around the story of the Nativity. What was the reaction when Minnesotans first saw it?

JOE CARTER: It was an experience for them because they were having the chance to experience a part of African-American culture that they hadn't known before-- the way we express our spirituality. And from the very beginning, it was a joyous celebration for the audiences.

DAN OLSON: It's gone on-- it's now popular around the country, apparently, in lots of different productions and has become a mainstay, in face.

JOE CARTER: I think the Penumbra production is certainly one of the finest.

DAN OLSON: Yeah, yeah. You are the great-grandson of African-American slaves. Is that right?

JOE CARTER: Yes.

DAN OLSON: And you know them how?

JOE CARTER: Well, I remember my grandparents, at least three of them. And my father's father, Henry William Carter, was born in 1870. And that was just five years after slavery. So all of the parents of my grandparents were born in slavery.

DAN OLSON: You were born in Massachusetts. Your parents left the South to escape discrimination. What was their life like?

JOE CARTER: Well, I'd heard the stories all of my life about the tremendous racism in South Carolina. But at the same time, they did not want us to be wounded and damaged in the way that they were. And so they told us that prejudice was evil.

They didn't simply say racism. They said, prejudice of any kind is evil. It hurts people. Don't let it be found in you.

And my mother used to say, when you kids go out into the world, first of all, realize this. There's nobody anywhere in the world who's any better than you are. And then never get it in your big head that you're any better than anybody else.

And then she would tell us, you'll meet all kinds of people as you travel along the way. And some of them will be racist. Some of them will be ignorant people, and they'll say unkind and cruel things.

Realize they've got a problem. Don't let it become yours. Feel sorry for them. Forgive them if-- help them if you can. But there was this concept that we had to rise above to move to a higher place. So I learned about forgiveness.

And I learned, as a child, that if someone did something to me, and if I was angry and held resentment for a long period of time, I was tied to that person with that resentment. And when I forgave them, I was setting myself free and being able to go on to the next level in my life.

And I think I learned that early on. It became a much larger idea as I grew, and as I traveled, and as I met other people who were peacemakers. My mother was a person who was outraged about indignity. My father was, too, but my father was more quiet about it. But my mother was very vocal.

And she had seven children at the time. I was the eighth child, the seventh son born in Massachusetts. But things were getting pretty bad. And I think, one day, one of my older brothers got into a fight with a white child down the street. And the child's mother slapped my brother, and my brother said, I'm going to go home and tell my ma.

And the lady said, well, you tell your ma, she come down here, she'll get some of the same. Well, you didn't talk that way to my mother. And it turned out to be a big thing. My mother went down the road and said, I won't trespass on your property, but if you step outside this gate, I'll mop the road up with you.

Well, the Sheriff came, everything-- and my father was at work during all of this. And my sister remembers. She said, they were hiding under the house because they saw the Sheriff, and they thought the Sheriff was going to kill them all or burn the house down. And my mother came out on the front porch, and the Sheriff said, Mrs. Carter, is it true that you threatened this woman, Ms. So-and-so?

And my mother put her hand on her hip, and she said, Mr. Sheriff or whoever you are, if the president of the United States threatens my children, he'd better look out. And she said, if somebody hits me, you better look out because, when I get up, I'm going to be fighting. And those were dangerous words for Black people in those days.

And one day, my mother said to my father, she said, Fred-- my father's name was Frederick Douglas Carter-- we've got to leave this place. He said, Lily, this is our home. Where would we go? She said, if anybody touches one of my children, they're going to have to kill me. We've got to leave this place.

And she said, if you don't want to go, I'll get on the road and take the seven children, and we'll walk until we get to the Mason-Dixon line. She would have done it. And it turned out there was a man in their village who had moved to Cambridge, Massachusetts. And they said he was rich. And of course, he wasn't, but that was their perception of him.

And my mother said, you go find Mr. Thames, and he'll help you. He'll help you find a job. And don't come back. As long as it takes, we'll wait for you. Then you send for us.

And all of my life, I've heard the story of the great train ride from South Carolina to Boston. It was like going to the Promised Land. And I remember my mother talking about the train rumbling through the black, smoky cities.

And one interesting thing-- I remember she said that they were supposed to ride in the colored car, which was an uncomfortable place on the train. But there was a very sympathetic and kind white conductor who saw my mother in all of these children. He said, miss, he said, I ain't going to make you ride in the colored car. He said, you wait a minute. And he smuggled her and the children into an empty car that was for white people.

And when they got to Washington, DC, my Aunt Maggie was there with boxed lunches waiting for them all. Then they got on another train, which was filled with African-American soldiers coming back from World War II. And my mother said the soldiers adopted all of the children and took care of them and so on.

And so all my life, I've heard the story. And then when they finally arrived in Boston, and my mother looked out the window and saw garbage in the streets, and clamor, and just all kinds of craziness, she said, Lord, is this the Promised Land? If it is, give me strength. And that was the beginning of our family's sojourn in Massachusetts.

["I GOT PLENTY O' NUTTIN'" PLAYING]

Oh, I got plenty of nothing

And nothing's plenty for me

I got no car

I got no mule

I got no misery

The folks with plenty of plenty

Got a lock on their door

Afraid somebody's going to rob them

While they's out making more

What for?

I got no lock on my door

That's the way to be

They could steal the rug from the floor

That's OK with me because the things that I prize

Like the stars in the skies

Are all free

Oh, I've got plenty of nothing

And nothing's plenty for me

I got my gal

I got my Lord

Got heaven the whole day long

I've got my gal

I've got my Lord

I've got my song

DAN OLSON: Roland Wilson at the piano with Joe Carter. Our Voices of Minnesota interview with actor, vocalist, and storyteller Joe Carter ends with recognition of the 100th anniversary this year of the birth of Duke Ellington. Joe Carter sings Ellington's "Come Sunday." Then to end our session, Joe reads a poem he wrote to remember his father, Frederick Douglas Carter, who died recently.

["COME SUNDAY" PLAYING]

Dear Lord

Dear Lord above

God Almighty

God of love

Please look down

And see my people through

Dear Lord

Dear lord above

God Almighty

God of love

Please look down

And see my people through

I believe that God

Put sun and moon up in the sky

I don't mind the gray skies

'Cause they're just clouds passing by

Dear Lord

Dear Lord above

God Almighty

God of love

Please look down

And see my people through

I believe that God

Put sun and moon up in the sky

I don't mind the gray skies

'Cause they're just clouds passing by

Dear Lord

Dear Lord above

God Almighty

God of love

Please look down

And see my people through

At dawn, when the first light is breaking, and mist settles into dew on the green grass, the voice of the father who has long been laboring in the fields calls in a wind-swept song, arise, my son, arise. The weary night has passed and gone. The dark clouds are rolled away like the stone from Lazarus' tomb. Let all fear and trembling be done, for a great, new day has come.

I tell you that weeping may endure for a night, but joy comes in the morning. Joy comes in the morning. Hear my voice. Listen quietly to your heart. A song from within is born.

Oh, my son, how can I show you? How can I teach you? Rise, shine, for your light has come. Sing, now, your own song. Sing your own song.

As the sure-footed cattle know their path on the mountain side, and their bells do ring, follow the path of heart, and you shall surely sing. Each one awakens to a different sound. Each one waits for their moment to come. You must go forth with silver tongue. Call your brothers and say, we are one.

Oh, my son, I see what you have not seen. I see you in me and me in you. Oh, my son, my light is yours, and yours is mine. Our song is one. One song, one song.

A thousand years shall come and go. Your brothers, your children, your mothers shall know. The sound that awakens all to love and life is one song. Oh, my son, arise and sing.

[PIANO MUSIC]

When my father passed away, I was driving down 94, and I heard a song drifting in my mind-- a little bit of an old spiritual. And I don't even know the real words to it. I just put my own words.

And this is a song that I'd like to sing not only for my father today, who lived a good life, as did my mother, but for all of those of you who want to make a difference in the world with your life. And when you leave this world, you don't need a whole lot of flowers. You don't need big celebrations. This song for my father tells you and me what we need.

(SINGING) Let the work that I've done speak for me

Let the work that I've done,

Lord, speak for me

When I come to the end of this road

And I lay down this heavy load

Let the work that I've done

Speak for me

Let the life that I've lived speak

Speak for me

Let the life that I lived

Lord, let it speak

Let it speak for me

Oh, yes

When I've done the very best that I can

And if my friends, if they don't understand

Let the life that I've lived

Oh, Lord, let it speak for me

My dad's life spoke for him

(SINGING) And let the love that I've shared

Oh, let it speak

Let it speak for me

Let the love that I've shared

Lord, let it speak

Let it speak for me

Oh, yes, let it speak for me

Well, when I come

When I come to the end of this row

And I lay down

This old, heavy load

Let the love that I've shared

Let the work that I've done

Let the peace that I've made

Lord, let it speak for me

Oh, well, well, well, let it speak for me

Oh, yes, let it speak for me

Oh, let it speak for me

GARY EICHTEN: Joe Carter with accompanist Roland Wilson. Mr. Carter talked with Minnesota Public Radio's Dan Olson as part of our Voices of Minnesota series. Our thanks to Tom Mudge from the Maud Moon Weyerhaeuser Studio staff for his help with preparing this program.

And another reminder, Joe Carter is performing at the Saint Paul Family New Year's Party this Thursday afternoon at the Landmark Center, so don't miss it this Thursday. Well, that does it for our Midday program today. Now, tomorrow should be an excellent program. I sure hope you can join us for both hours.

11:00 tomorrow, Governor Jesse Ventura will be joining us. The governor will be here to take your questions. We'll be talking about, really, whatever it is you'd like to chat with the governor about. So that's at 11:00 tomorrow-- Governor Jesse Ventura in our studios.

At noon tomorrow, Chris Farrell will be making his annual end-of-the-year visit to Midday. Every year for the last few years, Chris has come by to review the year in terms of the economic news of the year and look ahead to the next year. We always get him to go on record as to predicting where he thinks the stock market will end the year. And yes, we'll remind Chris of his predictions last year. He wasn't too far off.

But anyway, you'll learn more about that tomorrow at noon. So Governor Jesse Ventura at 11:00, Chris Farrell on the economy coming up at noon. And I hope you can join us for both hours tomorrow. Gary Eichten here. Thanks for tuning in to Midday today.

SPEAKER: On Monday's All Things--