Thank you Gratis, six minutes now past 11. And good morning. Welcome to midday on Minnesota Public Radio. I'm Gary. I can glad you could join us. It is possible that by this time next week NATO forces that would include u.s. Military forces will be attacking Serbian military targets for 7 months. Serbian forces have been trying to crush a rebellion in the Constable region of Serbia Rebellion by the Constable Liberation Army. The KLA says the Constable should be granted independence from Serbia since 90% of Serbia's kosovo's population are in fact ethnic albanians. Serbia has refused to Grant the region independence of his brand of the KLA terrorist. The fighting has killed hundreds and driven hundreds of thousands of people from their homes last week the United Nations approved the resolution demanding that Serbian present Slobodan milosevic to order a cease-fire in place of all. Pull out his troops and begin serious negotiations on a ton of me for cost about next week un secretary-general. Kofi. Annan is scheduled to report on whether Serbia has in fact complied with that resolution and NATO says it's ready to take military action to enforce the resolution later today at the UN Security Council will be meeting to discuss the situation further specifically. The Security Council is expected to focus on reports a weekend atrocities and possible. Also top Clinton administration officials will be briefing US senators on what military action is. In fact being contemplated joining us this morning to bring us up-to-date on what is behind this conflict how we got to where we are and what we might expect to happen is Thomas Emerick history professor at the Stables Adolphus College in St. Peter. He specializes in the Balkans. He's writing a book on the history of Serbia is part of a Stanford University series. We invite you to join our Conversation as well. This is a complicated subject but one which could very well end up in the headlines very very shortly. If you've got a question about the situation possible and now the possible US military action against Serbia. Give us a call or Twin City area number is 227-6002. 276 Thousand Oaks add the Twin Cities 1-800 to +422-828-227-6000 or one 800-242-2828 Professor. Thanks for joining us this morning the CliffsNotes version of some geography and history for those of us who aren't all that familiar with the region aren't all that familiar with. This conflict quotes about is part of Serbia not an independent nation, correct. It's a region in the southern part of Serbia and essentially has been a part of Serbia ever since of the Balkan Wars right before World War 1. And it became a part of Serbia in the creation of Yugoslavia 1918. Memory memory serves their Circle costabile plays an important Central role in the history of Serbia. Does it not work particularly in the sort of historical consciousness or mythology of through than their sense of themselves and what is important in their own history? It was if a territory that is actually been greatly the Undisputed between serves and albanians throughout history it and particularly as they view the past today, but in the medieval. Serbia was the center of the label Serbian Kingdom and eventually up for a short time after getting Empire that controlled much of the Balkans and when it was lost as the ottoman Turks came into Europe when the serves lost that territory, they vowed to get it back one day that this was their greatest Legacy of of their medieval experience and they would not be complete until they had it back one day. So, it's Route 500 years living under Turkish control. The serbs viewed postable as you might call it their Jerusalem and once they had it again, which they have I said they gained in 1912. They were whole once again and that in a sense. They saw themselves as the Jews of the New Testament. This is some of the part of their own mythology and regaining Kosovo as their Jerusalem was part of this great mythology, and they said they would never let it go. Once they regained it. Unfortunately for them over the Five Hundred Years of Turkish rule serves left. The region is very volatile region and albanians started to move in from the hills above which is in Albanian Albanian territory proper and a gradually by the time they took back the territory 1912. There was already up certainly a slight majority of albanians living there rather than serves the people who live in Kosovo primarily the ethnic albanians are they until recently anyway where they satisfied with being part of Serbia difficult question when the suit me just how you be very brief again for the in this cliff notes for the twentieth century after World War II role of this. Once again, it was great discrimination against the Albanian population a lot of albanians moved out or fled a Serbian cuz you could file government dominated by a Serbian King had as its policy to resettle Coastal with large Serbian population. So they try to get serves to move into to Kosovo to Sutter redress the population balance there. and then after World War II when the Albie's when they coastal region with Again part of the new socialist Yugoslavia, there was an effort to rebuild this region 2 to invest into the money industry there because it was one of the poorest regions in Europe not alone. Alone the poorest region Yugoslavia and given the fact that I'll be Nia itself Hardline communist Albania with no friends in the world right isolated in the During the period the Cold War was an economic basketcase. You're relatively speaking the albanians in Kosovo preferred being in Yugoslavia than to being a part of Albania. But in 1981 your year after the death of Tito they begin to demonstrate for more and more autonomy and even for Independence or at least for the establishment of Kosovo as a independent republic within Yugoslavia feeling that they were always living under under a basic Serbian repression. And then for 10 years since 81 the military moved in to try to keep the peace in that region and place the Albanian population virtually under martial law. Well now it's been almost 17 years, so If it's a relative thing at times they have wish to be a part of Albania time, especially during socialist. Yugoslavia was probably better to be in Yugoslavia. Now both Albania and Kosovo are very backward economic regions, but increasing numbers of all of Kosovo albanians feel that it would be at least better to unite all albanians in one state and try to see what the future holds for them. It's an independent stage when all of them are living the common territory. Now as I understand it the United States western powers in general do not support the albanians call for Independence know what they want some kind of autonomy within Serbia. Is that right Tito constitution of 1974 granted the region of Kosovo virtual autonomy almost equal to the status that the individual republics of Yugoslavia had that autonomy gave You are new rights to the Albanian population and they they could study in the universities in their own language. And there were more Albanian police force to the number to Serbian police force this kind of thing. And one of the things that negotiate you did in coming to power was to abrogate that autonomy 1989. He simply took away the autonomy of coastal and placed that region directly under under Serbia and under Soviet control. During the 90s is what war was going on in Croatia. And then more importantly in Bosnia the leadership of the albanians or domestic leadership name of Ibrahim rugova advocated a policy of of peaceful noncompliance. They simply refused to have anything to do with Serbian authorities students wouldn't go to Serbian school. They set up a sort of parallel system of agencies and government and schools and homes in this kind of things for the albanians would not have to comply with Serbian authorities and all the time saying we want our autonomy back. This was a sort of passive resistance that was peaceful and it worked fairly well, but increasingly more and more or larger numbers of of Albanians were Radical lies and believe that Rubio Buzz policy was getting them nowhere and that's the only answer would be complete Independence. And this is tied also what was happening Albania because of 1992 in the Communist were overthrown in Albania, Sali berisha is Democratic party won a majority and slavery. So it was a gig that there is little beans in how many yards are two major group The gigs in the north and tops in the South and the gangs are very much aligned with the albanians in Kosovo. And the leader of the new Albanian had is his objective. One of the jack is unifying all the albanians in Europe tour in the borders of Albania into one state and he really gave a lot of encouragement for the first time to the Kosovo albanians. He was defeated in 1997 and the current Premier prime minister of Albania does not support this policy now. Alicia has been wanting to get back into power and he promises and getting back into power to come back. Go back to this and nutritional policy or does his policy of trying to unify all albanians in one state. He and his forces have been supplying a lot of the arms to the so-called total Liberation Army and encouraging them. So there is a real relationship between what's happening in Albania itself. And this last year of release 7 months of unrest in Kosovo increasing numbers of Kosovo albanians are dissatisfied with any kind of policy of peaceful resistance and believe it only an armed Uprising can gain them the independence they want and that the West will support them when they see how much they are suffering but the West will not support this because it goes against the whole principles of international diplomacy and law that that we should Interfere in the basically Internal Affairs of a Sovereign Nation in this is a part of sovereign Serbia, which makes it very different in the situation. We saw in Bosnia were bothering it already proclaimed itself independent state. So, how is it then that we find ourselves today on the verge of what appears to be military strikes against Serbia located it in it's some it's complicated. Both both in terms of international law is complicated in terms of what we hope to achieve their Is there is always in the suggestion that if we do strike leaving strategically in Serbia, or at Serbian forces in Kosovo, which is very difficult because I'm sure there'd be some civilian casualties given where the Serbian forces are in Coatesville. If we do that then we are potentially encouraging further encouraging the Kosovo Liberation Army, even though we say we are doing this only to tell me which that he must stop the the actions and Kosovo Retreat and work towards a peaceful solution to this which means the granting of autonomy to them but one cannot deny the fact that they Quizlet Liberation Army leaders certainly want this action. They've been wanting it for a long time because they hope that eventually it will lead to help lead to their independence day, which is exactly what we don't want that to happen. We don't want the independence for a couple of reasons one. We do have this we do respect the idea that this is a Sovereign Nation that the more importantly perhaps the independence of Kosovo is not the final objective. It would also be inevitably Thirty 35% of the population is Albanian living along the borders. You know, what men Macedonia with with Albania itself. There are albanians in Greece. If if Macedonia eruption conflict is also possibly to Bulgaria would move in which traditionally had in size on that. Territory. Greece will not stand by if Greece became involved is the real possibility that the other Turkish the other NATO Ally in the Mediterranean there of turkey would become involved. So we don't want independence for Kosovo, which would probably lead to Union with Albania because it was only trigger further unrest in the greater bulk. It sounds like an extraordinary really complicated. Almost unintelligible Quagmire definitely is and I'm sure I'm sure that what they are considering is a very limited. Very limited, but painful at the same time very limited strike perhaps against to Serbian. Maybe you were five territories self some of the defenses and with the hope that mid-ocean ridge as always looks like we'll get very scared and say okay we're going to be a little drawer troops will ask for some some some advisers are or monitor is from the UN or from NATO and we will sit down to achieve talk that lead to autonomy unfortunately knows what's happened in the last 7 months and so antagonize the Albania population that it's seems very unlikely that these two peoples will find a way to live together very peacefully, although population. There is a very small today history professor at Gustavus an expert on the Balkans and he's in the process. No writing a book on the history of Serbia part of a Stanford University series, and we thought today would be a good day to file. No more about what exactly is happening and cost of all there is talk that US forces military forces might be used against Serbia as a result of conflict in Kosovo. The UN Security Council is meeting later today to talk about alleged atrocities in the area. NATO is gearing up. Apparently, it's moved the next step up the ladder in terms of military preparations. NATO is now proved what calls an activation request allowing Allied Nations to formally commit war planes and other forces for an eventual campaign against the serbs all of this could come to a head next week. And we talked to him we would find out more about what in the world is going on you like to join our conversation. Give us a call. 227-6002 276 thousand. I'll try the Twin Cities 1 800 to +422-828-227-6000 or one 800-242-2828 Scott go ahead please play finding religion is playing this whole conflict here. If there's any plays some role, I think it's fair that there if they're at all times because the Albanian population is almost 95% of the human population, of course is orthodox and that has the actual conflict itself is not religious, but the differences between the people and the storical animosity that existed at times has often been couched in religious terms and and the culture is based upon in part of these religious differences. So religion is is it is an important part of it, but certainly not always at the Forefront as we look at the political crisis in the cave the KLA to go to Liberation Army is it Did not see if they'll fit in any way is primarily up a Muslim Force. For example, I just got word From the Rough Riders wire that Albania has issued an official statement now saying that the killing of 30 civilians and cost of all over the weekend and backed up accusations that the serbs were carrying out genocide against the ethnic Albanian majority long statement going on. No to criticize the serbs. It sounds to an outsider as if Albania is laying the groundwork for some kind of direct intervention. Is that a danger? Well, I as I mentioned earlier can be a danger in part because it could also rekindle the Civil War in in Albania itself because the forces of boresha who is as I said was ousted is Premiere in 97 are eager to get their power back and they are a very different Force energy from group of people than those who are in power right now would usually our forces under Nana who is represents. The southern tribes of Albania witches are a different group all together so that could be more unrest in Albania itself is not a little success by itself against the serbs. So I don't think that is a realistic threat to Serbia itself. I think this whole issue of of atrocities is a difficult one ended, you know over the centuries. This region has been the scene of some terrible atrocities. They were terrible atrocities in 1920s. They were terrible atrocities during World War one side of the other there have been some terrible atrocities in the last 7 months against serbs by Albanian Liberation forces in Kosovo. I'm not this is not to underestimate the horror of what happened this weekend. And in fact this weekend, we something is a retaliation for the murder a few days earlier of 5 through being policemen. I'm in so sometimes the atrocities are awful and they seemed they really are our terrible. We we know nothing of it in our own experience perhaps although it is not unusual in this part of the world. Saying that I mean, it is interesting that it often takes one large atrocity because they seem to be happening every day and a small scale takes one large one to to get the attention of the of the western forces when I'm saying is that if we were going to do something we probably should have done something six months ago before 250,000 or 300,000 people had been made homeless and are now in real danger because the first snow is of this region come in late October weather going to go home to their homes have been totally burned if it's really a very great. Add your question place. My question is albanians are they Slavic peoples as the bulgarians and serves or are they basically non-slavic so I'll hang up. Yes, they're not they're not slob know. There are probably the remnants of the of the indigenous people of this region, even before the Romans took over and when Romans took over and when eventually the Flop came in love came into this region around 600 AD it is assumed that the remnants of what had to be indigenous Vulcan population fled into the Albion area mountains of the seas are the descendants of those people that are not slow as they claim they claim they have been there for living in the territory of Kosovo. For a very long time in fact in pre-christian time and that they've therefore if you talk about who is their first day with their first and therefore they deserve in the territory and that the Serbian argument that Serbia dominated the region in the medieval world if they 1200 to 1500 may be very well and true but that much much later than the original Albanian occupation. So if you talk about historical right, it's really The Obedience right to have it from an Albanian prospective professional. How in the world if if it's decided that some kind of military action against the serbs will be authorized how in the world will US officials be able to explain this to the American people in a way that will will make any sense. I'm sure I do not have an answer for that because I not sure that there is no easy answer. I think we will we will have to use Americans tend to understand. The need to protect innocent civilians just just from a sense of compassion Americans made by the argument that we have to go in there because there are terrible atrocities taking place in it that we have to protect we have to we have to pacify the regions for the we can do something with these three hundred thousand refugees who are huddling in the in the Hills waiting for winter to arrive. I mean, I think you'll understand that. If if they try to somehow rationalize how we are going to be attacking a Sovereign Nation was trying to supposed to take care of a terrorist group who is trying to achieve independence for one part of the region of its own country. I don't think they're going to have much success in giving that kind of rationalization because I don't usually there is a is it an option simply to focus purely on those refugees try to get them back to their homes or at least get them? Some foods are not advocating one thing or another here right now, but I'm not sure if a military strike is going to be very successful. But if it does somehow bring both sides to negotiating table to engineer some kind of ceasefire so that they can at least have some time to do something. Things I worry about however, is that it? No, we just had elections in in Bosnia. And now I have to go after more than two years of of NATO presence in Bosnia situation. This is not improved at all. But the people who wanted me election are hardliners, especially in the European region of Bosnia. They are against integration of the other former bars near or Bosnia. They they want to join with Serbia rooms are extremely nationalistic and a particular about Kosovo. And if we were to bomb now, I think it's only going to contribute in a way to the further destabilization of Bosnia just because serves will will feel themselves attacked once again and rally to the peanuts cause of their National cause Thomas Hammer. Is there I guess this hour and he has a history Professor Gustavus Adolphus College in St. Peter. He's writing a book on the history of Serbia. He's been studying the situation in the Balkans were some long while and is been going to have to join us today to talk about the crisis and possible. There is talk of a possible NATO that is to say at least in part US military action against Serbia as a result of the fighting in cost of all the UN Security Council holding an emergency meeting later today to discuss the situation and we thought it was time to find out more about just what's happening in possible find out a little bit more about the background of the conflict you like to join our conversation to 276 thousand Twin City area number to 276 thousand out side the Twin Cities 1 800 to +422-828-227-6000 or one 802-422-8280. Get some more colors in just a moment. Prairie Home Companion starts a new season this week with singer Ann Hampton Callaway from Scotland the tannahill Weavers the guys all star shoe band. And of course the news from Lake Wobegon. Listen for Prairie Home Companion Saturday afternoon at 5 on all NPR station. And again Sunday at noon on Minnesota Public Radio know FM 91.1 in the Twin Cities. Sure. Hope you can join us for the second hour of our mid-day program today at we're going off to Brainerd. Where are the three major party candidates for Governor are getting together for the first face-to-face debate of the gubernatorial campaign a skip Humphrey Norm Coleman. Jesse Ventura will all be on hand League of Women Voters is sponsoring the debate great opportunity to find out more about the where the candidates stand on the issues and hear the cabinets to interact with each other on the issues. So live coverage coming up over the noon hour the first campaign debate about the Oriole campaign season roster advisory is in effect for Northeastern in East Central Minnesota this evening this afternoon, we can look for a Sunday to partly sunny sky with highs mid-forties in the northeast of the mid-50s in Southwestern Minnesota, then denied clear and cold with lowest watt east of the upper 30s Tomorrow. There's a chance for rain at least in southern Minnesota Twin Cities Sunny this afternoon with a high in the mid-50s. Hi low tonight in the mid-thirties tomorrow 30% chance for some rain with a high in the mid to Upper 50s currently in the Twin Cities sunny and 52° the first hour of our mid-day program. We're talking about the situation impossible try to get more background information on just what's been happening in that region that part of Serbia, especially given the fact that NATO apparently is all set to go now and launch military strikes against the Serb targets the result of fighting between a Serb forces and the Kosovo Liberation Army the been reports of atrocities over the weekend of those reports course of gained International attention and have been roundly condemned by many many members of the UN Security Council security council meeting later this afternoon, but Professor Emirates Russia says, no military action will not authorize it does that mean I won't be any. Well, they said no military action in Bosnia too, and we went ahead and eventually bomb there. So I I don't think it will prevent this not being a part of NATO, of course you and may not fully thankfully not only will go It Alone Again. Power right now to do much about it in and it tends to want to continue show some support to its traditional Orthodox and swab Allied to serve. Well not feeling to criticize them when necessary that they should have been skinned Penny's last 5-6 years Lori your question place. They're planning to do some kind of attack on there. It seems to be this attack. That is too little too late are foreign policy seems to just be a show of tokenism which you know, it's accidentally-on-purpose is done too little too late because they are Muslim and because you don't approve of them and then we haven't done anything about Bosnia where people have been genocided and women have been raped and men have been buried alive and concentration camps. We talked about the genocide of hillocks. Well, that was worse. And what has the Western World done about that nothing that's not they said they were going to do what they're going to have trials and all that sort of thing and in Geneva. Oh, where was between the weather and nothing has been done. It's just a big lie and a big tokenism by the United States to prove that they're doing something after they're all dead and the buried it's too late for you. What would you like to see the US do or what should the US? They should have it Independence if these. They should allow them their freedom. Number one. Number two. They shouldn't put on a show like this a token is an after the people are dead, which we have been doing after 200,000 people to bother you with Kilz. I think that was not done without a conscience it was done with with full consciousness of what they were doing. It was too little too late. I'm not a Muslim by the way. I just wanted to say to you but I really think what's done is done deliberately by the Western Powers. This is not an accident because these people are Muslims deliberately you're interested in here obviously. Okay, we should have recognized the end of the road should recognize the independence now if possible anything else are you talking about? I'm bored. And I think it's just different definitely us of a tactic of the Republicans to keep the president's so embroiled in all this garbage that we've been with that has them spread apart of the American people do not want to keep him from being able to deal with these kinds of crises. That should have been dealt with a long time ago saying that we should have sat in the US forces a long time ago. Would we could we have done something here to prevent the suffering and the cost of o It's want me like $0.30 I empathize with callers frustration. I think most most people view the Balkans understand the Balkan those who are recently experts in the Balkans after covering the the war there than any of these fine journalist who left us many accounts offense that many find volumes of Journalism since the war started have agonized over the lack of response from the West. I think it is much too little too late. It was much too little too late in Bosnia sit. We could have we said that we should have put extraordinary pressure on the losiewicz 7 months ago two years ago. We should have been a part of the Dayton Peace Accords, but we wouldn't put that on there because we knew how critical Costo is to the serbs and we thought there was no way of that. We we assume there was no way of achieving any kind of a cord in the ocean which over Bosnia if we if we muddy the waters so to speak by putting Coastal on the table as well, but that sort of lack of will as well as the question is why I don't want to answer the question. What what can we do? What could we have done early enough short of any kind of military intervention. We put we put US troops. We put other NATO of observers in Macedonia, for example, because the Macedonian government recognizes the fragility of its Enterprise and even though there are only about 500 troops there most of Americans as observers. It's a presence we could never have which would never have accepted the presence of foreign troops that any Serbian soil. So that that would would not have been an option two years ago or even 7 months ago. We we've tried sanctions we could have increased the sanction. Maybe that should have been done but my experience I just been in Serbian June is that the people who suffer most her in Serbia from sanctions are innocent people who don't want much to do with this conflict anyway, so it's very difficult to know what we could do, especially in this situation. Where were dealing with a Sovereign Nation Army. It would have been easier since they had to Proclaim their independence and we could have been much harder on the serbs we could have we could have if we were air strikes were necessary. They could have been done. Two to three years before we ever finally made them and maybe it's saved some lives there. What about if we simply said the day? Yep, we recognize your Independence cuz of all I don't think I don't think we will do that. I don't think you can easily recognized the independence of a integral part of a Sovereign Nation because it it leads to me there are many other situations in the world where we would not want this to be happening. We don't want to give the message that this is how you get independence to places like chechnya and the 70-80 other autonomous regions within Russia, for example I mean we do have to deal with President here. I suppose that although that doesn't isn't much Solace to those suffering in Coatesville today. I think ironically what will happen is that if we can help to encourage a ceasefire very quickly try to get the situation under control and and read the return of Albanian a ton of Miracles of autonomy for the Albanian very quickly if we're going to have to Try to encourage the albanians from seceding. From Yugoslavia. Once they feel like they have the autonomy then we will this is where I find it ironic. Then there will be have to be at efforts to try to protect the Serbian population the small Serbian population from atrocities from Revenge. And what I think of it ultimately is going to happen is that the region of Kosovo will be largely given Independence and it will hopefully peacefully rejoin or join Albania itself, but then there has to be some autonomy inside Kosovo for the majority Serbian regions and for some of the most important Serbian religious sites that the religious sites the medieval monasteries and churches that are so important to Sears and at least eight fairly well settled Serbian region is about a quarter of Kosovo territory, and we may find yourself having to encourage some kind of negotiation where That part can be can be retained in Serbia itself while the rest of of a territory gets its independence and preps unified itself is the code so I can't imagine anything else happening down the line today. I mean the alternative would be a third Republic in the current use Flavia, but the current of the following is not the most stable institution in Springfield at these albanians. We're not going to want to live under or live with Serbia any longer teaches history of Gustavus Adolphus College in St. Peter. He's joined us the shower to try to give us the background on just what's happening in the Constable region. There is talk of a NATO that is to say in part at least US military strike against Serbia, probably sometime next week if there is such a strike as a way to punish Serbian president to slow down my loss of itch or failure to To agree to a UN resolution having to do with a ceasefire in Constable can zap joins us he teaches at Metro State morning then explaining the background here. And in fact, you might have understated the horrible conditions that the Albanian coast of ours lived under milosevic stands 1990 or 91 at its best characteristic characterized as a type of martial law where the albanians lost all official jobs in hospitals and other companies and so forth. However, one failure of our policy I think is to differentiate between the interest and needs of the serving people from that of the evil of milosevic. I carry no water for this person who is responsible for such tragedies. However, our government seems to somehow ignore the interest of the majority Serbian people in Serbia for this car. Sick too and I'd like to ask you to comment on that. The only way I see autonomy being re-established is if the West can somehow secure the border so that there's not a continuous flow of arms into Kosovo absent that there's not going to be any real a ton of me. That's the first point. I asked him to comment on. Secondly. I'm very concerned about a bombing of Serbian Physicians now because the two unintended consequences which would follow one would be further and bulding the the Kosovo Liberation Army, which is truly a terrorist organization and to every time we attack the serves unfortunately milosevic gets more support from the local people because he is their leader and they rally around him we need to do actions which separate the Serbian population from milosevic. Pressure while I couldn't agree more. I mean the first the first observation is very important. I mean if there's going to be some kind of ceasefire had the international assistance in creating 3D autonomy for a coat of Owen for the larger. Largely Albanian population that is going to have to be some way of securing the borders because the social Liberation Army has been emboldened largely by support from northern Albania and buy arm, then when the pyramid scheme failed and the Civil War in Sudan in Albania to remember a couple years ago 750,000 arms and he remembers Where are on We Stand of the population in a lot of that ended up in the North End eventually trickle over borders into into Albania and Serbia population has been harassed greatly as a result of that. So we have to ask your way of Sir finding that if you're going to keep Kosovo within their BF but also gaining ptonomy. It's going to also have to have some kind of secure border there. That's very true. As far as a Serbian population is concerned concerned that is the population in Serbia proper. I couldn't agree more as well. I mean certainly there still tends to support the motion. Which but there are there's a large Urban population that does not support him. We should do whatever we can to encourage Caribbean population increase the opposition with Pinot to get rid of this man Summit even argued that if that is the moderate leader of the coast of Albania as if he had encouraged, Compliance with the elections if the coast of Albania population almost 2 million albanians had voted they could have become a real presence in Parliament and actually perhaps help to achieve their own economy. That way it may be helped even get rid of the lotion. It's a little that's that's a big if but whatever we can do to encourage serving population, which is suffering greatly a large number of whom a large percentage of them did not support the motion which we need to do this and unfortunately balmy surname, if you bombed through be at self-defense institutions or whatever. It's it's really is going to embolden her or encourage through and population two. To Rally round the flag and certainly rally round the luxurious to a certain extent to that this this is inevitable and it's understandable, you know in the last couple of years and I've been in Belgrade to talk to sir. We can care less anymore about Kosovo. Yes, it's our historical Heartland to look what we've been suffering the economic deprivation. The number of service have died that I was seeing of all of our Serbian population from Croatia who are now refugees in Serbia proper. We've suffered too much. We can't we can't afford to even deal with Kosovo. It's hardly are there any longer anyway, but once they are attacked in Dubai International forces once they are attacked as a people once they are branded once again as the Enemy by the world is the Pariah unjust and justifiably in many cases certainly for this large population of have little to say about it, then they tend to Rally together to say, you know, Take anymore of this and rally together as a people and if that means also to Rally behind their leader, what do they like him or not? But that's very good points. And I agree with her to be concerned. We need to do what we can to separate service from the motion, which we are unfortunately about a time here, but let's get one more call Iran bread. Hi Gary, I time I just got a couple quick questions. My understanding is you know, that before World War II it was 90% serbians in Kosovo. And now it's only 10% Serbian to 90%. O'Banion. So what happened to Serbian people girl and also, why was it interesting United States in Germany to break for Yugoslavia? 1991 one day we'll live in the peace only Hut in the Biomat email for centuries, you know, I just can't understand. Why is American citizen away? That's why does it have to happen story ends and others who study population of of Kosovo really depends on whether you're Albanian or serve different greatly. I just looked for it. But it seems that when the serbs got Albania back in 1912 when so let's say right after World War 1 when they were beginning to menstruate Minister the area again. The populace is a Serbian population. It was still a plurality Aurora. It was probably not 90% probably 55% 60% at most and gradually especially during World War II a lot of serbs killed by then fled Varden refugees of the population transfer with grapes during that time. We have to remember that the Albanian population Coastal had the highest mortality rate in Europe in eight nine ten children. Well as their population tended to have two children, so just the demographics of all that dramatically changed the balance in in Coatesville, and then eventually specially in the 70s and 80s a lot of serves left partly for economic reasons an increasingly in the 80s because met them with her asked to leave by Albanian population has to the whole issue of Germany in 1991. And this is the argument that if If Germany had not insisted that the Western allies recognize a Bosnia first recognized Serbia, Croatia and Slovenia and then block his independence dates. We wouldn't have had all of this mess. We wouldn't have had the war. We would have worked to try to keep you the Fabia one. There is some validity in early the argument that early recognition helped bring about the demise of Yugoslavia, but that is not the main reason you could probably was was was was ruined was brought to its knees by By its very powerful new political leaders. And they did it to themselves the International Community cannot be cannot be made the scapegoat for what the fuck people have done and mainly their leaders have done to them. We're out of time here Professor. But if you'd put your get your crystal ball out to assuming the UN Security Council issues a report statement today condemning the atrocities. Can we expect the next week? The NATO planes will be in the air? Well, I think it said there's a real possibility of that. I think it's very likely I'll although I know most of it she is a very clever man. He's manipulated the west Western Powers whenever he could I expect to see some significant move on his part within the next few days like you very much for joining a cert. Thank you. I was my pleasure, who teaches history at Gustavus Adolphus College in St. Peter working on a book cover for Stanford University about the history of Serbia. This is midday coming to you on Minnesota Public Radio reminder that one of the nation's foremost authorities on the progress of welfare reform will be in the Twin Cities. You're invited to a lecture with Ladonna pavetti this Friday from noon to 1 at the Sabathani Community Center in Minneapolis, but that he is a senior researcher with Mathematica policy research in Washington DC. She'll be examining the welfare-to-work process in the United States and in Minnesota. The event is co-sponsored by the institute on race and poverty in Minnesota public radio's Civic journalism project for information call. 651-290-1212 6 minutes before 12 big bun tutorial debate coming up over the noon hour time now for The Writer's Almanac