Thank you. A 6 minutes past 11 programming on Minnesota Public Radio is supported by Dayton's oriental rug departments in downtown Minneapolis Saint Paul and at the Southdale Brookdale and Rosedale home stores. And good morning. Welcome to midday here on Minnesota Public Radio. I'm very active glad you could join us guns could play a key role in this Fall's gubernatorial campaign. Now, it's not that the candidates are going to be meeting at High Noon or anything. But already many of the candidates have come out with plans to change the state's gun laws, John Marty, for example, once all gun owners licensed and all guns registered Ted. Mondale wants to require trigger locks on guns. Mike Freeman says, he supports a 30 year prison sentence for people who sell guns to minors on the other side of the issue Doug Johnson and Norm Coleman, so it should be easier for minnesotans to get a permit to carry a concealed weapon. Meanwhile, while the candidates for Governor here in Minnesota are staking out their positions on gun laws. A debate is broiling in Washington over the Brady handgun control off this fall. The laws scheduled undergo a major change right now in a person wants to buy a gun. They have to wait 5 days while authorities run a background check to make sure they're eligible to buy the weapon in December that way in. Will be replaced by an instant computerized background check gun control Advocates are trying to convince Congress at the waiting. Should remain part of the process Our Guest today. Bob Walker is actively involved in this ongoing debate over guns Walker is the national president of handgun Control Incorporated and its affiliate the center to prevent handgun violence. He's in Minnesota this week to meet with representatives of Minnesota heels of violence prevention organization. Bob Walker of handgun Control Incorporated has stopped by our Studios today to discuss guns and gun control and we invite you to join our conversation as well. Give us a call or Twin City area number is 2 276 thousand to 276 thousand if you're calling from outside the Twin Cities, you can reach his toll-free and that number is 1 800 to +422-828-227-6802 for 22828. Bob Walker. Welcome to Minnesota. Thanks for coming by today. Thank you. Very if you had your druthers. All things being equal would you just as soon see all guns in the United States band or at least handguns know I grew up in in Northern Illinois and I grew up in a household a gun is my father was a state policeman and I how did the great deal when I was a child and the number of my friends took me to the shooting range. And so I'm not unfamiliar with guns and I certainly don't that this light comes what is concerned about is obviously gun violence and what we can do and in our general philosophy is that we ought to regulate guns likely regulate cars just as we issue driver's license, we all have a license if you want to own a gun assembly if you transfer your car you have a deed registration receipt that goes with that car with a girl to be registration of firearms. I want to Firearms transfer. There's a record of that the transfer we also believe that that just as we made our car safer in recent years, we can do a lot more to make guns safer. It's just a matter of Common Sense really want How to regulate guns in the interest of Public Safety we don't take away anybody's firearm that's not the purpose of this the purpose here is to reduce gun deaths. Are you primarily concerned with People are criminals who I get their hands on guns are otherwise law-abiding people who get hurt by an accident so I can write increasingly the promise children the average age of a person arrested for homicide his country's dropped dramatically in the last decade. What we're seeing is is really that more and more of the gun crimes that used to be committed by adults that are being committed by children. When I go to major cities these days I talk to police chase and often times. I say that sort of the operative new age at which a gun be at which time a child begins to handle a gun is now by 12 so that you don't pick up in 11 year old children with guns in the streets, but increasingly you pick up 12 year old children, that's a crime we can do something about that problem at the access to Children enjoy this country and enjoy the guns in this country is a problem that we can address and will not be taking action against where do they get the guns? Well in a very large percentage of the cases children get their guns from home. We know that about 1/4 of all children can the ages of 10 and 17 in this country have access to a loaded unlocked firearm in their home. So it's easy for a lot of children to paint guns right there at home some children to paint guns from theft. That's when the homes of friends right now app work on this if they're not properly stored again, I can fall into the hands of a child. So there are other ways of children gun some children by guns in the street. Some of those are stolen guns again from private residences. Some of them are from Interstate gun traffickers and localized gun traffickers were buying guns legally from gun stores that selling them illegally on the streets the children we have to take steps aimed at all those different Avenues by which children can access to guns. You are a talking initially about licensing registration making the weapon itself the gun itself safer How would I would any of that address 12 year old kids getting their hands on a gun and Blasting away well for so if if gun owners are license and they receive proper safety training to become aware of the fact that the gun in the home is also a potential danger to the family and the community and that one of the principal responsibilities of pet ownership is making sure that the weapon is properly stored. That means that when you take a gun in the home that you unload the gun that you store the 8th and lock up the ammunition separately and then you lock up the gun. If you do that, you don't have a perfect security system, but the odds are greatly reduce that a child and that home or some other unauthorized user will gain access to that firearm. So licensing is is it as a means of helping first of all to ensure that the people who don't do own firearms are lawfully tables are lawfully qualified to do so, but it's also means of providing some training for gun owners make sure that they're aware of their responsibilities of gun owners expect to to registration firearms. New transfers when the Great decals we have in terms of going after the gun traffickers a kit that people are selling guns to our kids. Is a toponym step of prosecute that we don't know where the guns are coming from. We find a gun in the hands of a child that got his Trace Trace back to a gun store, but oftentimes trail goes cold at that point and we don't know from there where the gun went after the first original purchase. If you have laws requiring that all subsequent sales of a firearm must be recorded must be reported to the police at least do a much better job of tracking down that firearm determining who was actually sold the gun to the child in the street. Would that in any way you think affect the criminal element that would think they would simply bypass those kinds of procedures? Well, the purpose here is to be able to identify and prosecute those criminals who are selling guns to children. We think that can be done in some cases place like Massachusetts been done really quite effectively, Massachusetts began a process of tracing all firearms about 5 years ago in an effort to identify who in the state of Maine. Juices for selling guns to children and it weighs a very vigorous campaign to arrest and prosecute those were selling guns to children and Massachusetts to report a great success Boston went through a period recently a 30 months or not one child was murdered with a handgun which was a dramatic drop in the homicide rate for juveniles in that city. So we believe that there are answers out there and the answer is is going after an identifying how children are painting guns and shutting off those sources of Supply Our Guest this hours by Walker. He's the president of handgun Control Incorporated and he stopped by today to talk about gun control issues. If you'd like to join our conversation to 276 thousand to 276 thousand outside the Twin Cities one 802-422-8284 colors from St. Louis Park Charlie. Go ahead face comment. That guns don't kill. People kill people and there's there's a belief in some foreign countries like England to order to pan that the weight of gun violence is not is not to have guns and I'm wondering if you could just kind of sort of the American psyche behind guns and weather is guns and kill people or people that kill people I'll take enter offline. Well, there's no question that Americans have a love affair with guns. I have many friends who certainly fall into that category of people who really absolutely love their guns and we're not going to ruin this country pass a law Banning the possession of handguns or even the manufacturer of handguns, but fortunately for us, I don't think we have to take that type of steps in order to see a very very significant reduction in gun violence rates in this country. And what we need to focus on that was the problem and the problem with children is access to Firearms right now Congress has legislation pending it was Buy represent of Colin McCarthy of New York and Senator, Edward, Kennedy of Massachusetts. That would address this whole issue of access to guns. First of all, we require manufacturers that they make safe for guns right now in America many many children are killed unintentionally each year by Playmates who are handling guns. One of the stories are always breaks my heart and it comes in about once a week is a story about how some child takes a father's gun a pistol remove the magazine from the gun. Now thinking of the gun is empty points a gun at a Playmates head pulls the trigger and kills the playmate not knowing that there was a bullet in the chamber. There's a little 50 Cent part called a magazine disconnect safety that could correct that problem and prevent that gun from having been fired would save a lot of lives. But unfortunately firearms in America, they are the only unregulated consumer product. As a result, there are no consumer regulations on Firearms today and manufacturers are not required to do even the most basic things a lot of people soon for example, but there's always a manual safety on a Gun. There's no such requirement for domestic play you manufacture firearms in this country. There are no safety requirements and guns if we made safer guns there be far fewer or unintentional shootings involving very young children 2 days ago in Florida, a two-year-old child picked up a pistol in the backseat of car aimed it at his mother and shot his mother through the neck fortunately. She survived but a two-year-old child is capable of firing a pistol today because of trigger resistance and pistols is so low there any number of steps that we could take to make them safer to make them more resistant to children and that's one of the things of this legislation would do the other than this legislation that we do what we talked about earlier his hold parents responsible for the safe storage of a firearm Minnesota right now is one of 15 states that have laws call child access prevention laws. That whole parents responsible. If a child a young child of paint access to a loaded firearm and carries it into a public place or uses that to enter themselves or another child. So that type of thing we think is very important the key here is responsibility. We all have a responsibility for keeping guns out of the hands of children manufacturers have a responsibility gun owners have responsibilities parents have a responsibility schools have responsibilities. We all have to do our part if we're going to reduce gun violence in particular as it relates to our children hiding your comment, comment. Everyone the Brady Bill it seems that since the Brady Bill was enacted. It's easier to make legislation like this on gun. I think in the future will see a trend with gun legislation and whiskers gun owners like myself because it is easier to make legislation like this. And where is it going next? My next comment is about legislation versus education. You were talking about educating gun holders and how does legislation can do that? Has it ever been discussed or I'm thinking kind of holiday drug campaign went in the 80s how there was a huge government national campaign on drug education. And has anything like that ever been discussed where it comes to guns instead of Pennywise and done order while biting guns at a gun owner educating them. And I think that's what you were talking about this legislation. Would you educate gun owners and instead of penalizing them? Can we just issue a national campaign? And I think was that you were talking about gun manufacturers and how they're there are no standards. I think if you educate the people still require a bill after next actors, like any any product that would be on the market. They would ask manufacturers to give us those standards. And without the key here is brown Springfield. I've done a lot of traveling and I talked to very large number of gun owners in America today and they've all talked about in the same turn. They talked about it in terms of responsibility safety and education. The Gun Owners of America they recognize that that it is in fact, their problem is it is all of every America's problem and that we all have to do our part that gun owners have to be responsible. They have to properly store their weapons and the gun manufacturers have to make safer more child-resistant guns. So there is an awful lot like me done and end as you indicated really education is a critical part of that and one of the reasons why I've come to Minnesota today is really help educate Americans across the country about the importance of responsible gun ownership. What about the question that Heidi raises fan of the slippery slope argument, undoubtedly many many people get very nervous whenever the subject comes up because I think they ultimately believe that Somebody is going to confiscate all the guns in this country. I think the greatest danger to gun ownership in America is the intransigence of the gun lobby. If we take the reason we're responsible steps of Licensing and registration other measures that are designed to regulate guns with a very dangerous product that they are we can reduce gun deaths in America. But if we ignore this problem if we allow this problem to continue the faster and more school shootings in and the problem gets worse in the in the killing involves the younger and younger children. There's a real possibility of be a backlash from aux the American people against our traditional love with girls guns and Americans will demand that Firearms be banned or the manufacture of guns be banned. I don't see that happening. I think we're going to find Solutions here. I think there are solutions. I think they're common sense and it was supported by the overwhelming majority of Americans including gun owners and if her quickly reaching a point just as we have with other things and cars to the back or other dangerous products for finding ways. To adjust to the very real threat still exist out there 30 years ago people didn't wear seatbelts, even if they had them in their cars. They didn't wear them today the vast majority of Americans wear seatbelts. We need to do something much better job here of of adjusting to the reality that we have 220 million firearms in America today and that whatever we do with the Spectre no laws. We have to ensure that gun owners do the responsible thing and that is make sure that their guns are unloaded and locked up and out of the reach of children. Is there any reason in your mind why people would go to keep a handgun for example at home at this point other than for target shooting practice in terms of self-defense lot of people have guns for self-defense. But if you have the thing unloaded and locked away and ammunition stored separately and so on is pretty useless for that for that purpose. I would think some of the devices that are out there in the market can be activated very very quickly in the lock can be unlocked with a matter of Lu III 5 seconds for people who are keeping a gun for self-defense, but I think the important thing for gun owners recognize is that a gun in the home is 43 times more likely to kill someone in the home. Then it is to kill an intruder in self-defense for people who are buying a gun to protect their families. They have to recognize and come to grips with the very real threat that the gun poses to the people right there in the home weather be the case of unintentional shootings suicides domestic disputes or child carrying a gun to school guns in the home do pose a danger. And if you do make a decision to own a gun, and I'm not recommended to people do obviously, but if you do make a decision own a gun you have a responsibility to make sure that is properly stored will your question. Please make a recommendation come to the iron World Discovery Center in Chisholm, Minnesota on August 8th their Professor Mamie cylinder. And dr. Sandstrom will give talks on what happens to a people when they have no guns at home to protect themselves from take over by a deranged individual or individuals like happened in Germany. And in Russia. I come from an ethnic group that possibly lost from 14 to 40 million. I'm neurotic and as you people know when the secret police who are behind Lenin took over Russia namely jarzynski and then Shuffle line dance mother's you know any way they talk people out from their homes and brought them a little ways out of the communities and shot him in the back of the head dump them in the woods. What about the idea that we ultimately need to keep our weapons to protect ourselves from from the government essentially, but I think we'll misses. The point. The point is not hear about the right to keep and bear arms. This is not about taking guns away from people the legislation they were talking about is one that would help him Force responsibility that gun owners owe to their family and their communities it would be easier though. If everybody was licensed all the guns were registered it would make it a lot easier for the government at some point in the future to confiscate. All those weapons would have done. Well, I really don't think that's going to happen. I didn't I don't think the vast majority American people believe that's a feasible alternative for anywhere and in the foreseeable future in America. That have absolute fans on Firearms including now, Japan and Great Britain there many countries today including France and Italy and and most of the major industrialized countries who do have a system of of Licensing and registration for firearms and yet those those nations are not totalitarian States. This nation has a great history of democracy and participation and I think our nation be quite safe with laws that do imposed Central regulations on Firearms without taking Firearms out of the hands of abiding citizens esposo. Again people who are worried about this would say for example who could have imagined 20 years ago the kind of mold say, let's say and he's smoking regulations that are now commonplace Across America and I guess they would do worry that the ultimately if you have these lists somebody will come and take their weapons away from it despite the enormous. So anti-smoking campaign is going on. No real serious debate in America by Banning tobacco. There has been talk about regulating secondhand smoke. There's been talk about regulating the marketing for back with the children. But the debate about tobacco in America today is not about efforts to Simply Banh tobacco. I don't think anyone seriously suggesting that and I don't think very many people today are seriously suggesting that that we are to confiscate all the firearms in America. Today is something not going to happen. I think it's a very very unrealistic fear and what we oughta be concerned about is a very real fact that every year in America or 5,000 children are killed with Firearms. That's a fact that's not some speculation. That's the other reality of it and we have to deal with that and we can deal with it to some very common sense Solutions Lorraine your question, please yes, I wanted to ask mr. Walker if he would explain to the public but the handgun control interpretation is of the Second Amendment is being used by the NRA to say everyone. Listen to Child of God. Please clarify this for us. Thanks a lot. Mister Parker. Goodbye. It's very clear that the Second Amendment does not give American citizens as private citizens the right to own firearms. The second amendment was draft with the intention of protecting the right of state militias well-regulated state militias. In fact that you look the language of the Second Amendment. That's what you see reference to the necessity to maintain a well regulated militia, but don't take my word for it. All you have to do is take a look at the Court decisions. No federal court has ever overturned a gun law on the basis of the Second Amendment, but don't even take the words of the courts. All you have to do is take a look at the actions of the National Rifle Association. The National Rifle Association has challenged the constitutionality both the Brady Bill and the assault weapon ban in federal court and in both cases the pleadings never even mention the Second Amendment the challenges to both those laws were. Another grounds, they could very easily have it have added in a challenge in the base of second and they refused to do so and the reason why is they knew that they went to the Spring Court? They would lose that battle because their interpretation of the Second Amendment as former Chief Justice Warren Burger said as one of the greatest fraud perpetrated on the American people, but the Second Amendment really is not the issue here. Again, this is not an issue about taking guns away from people. This is about how do we live with guns in our society? What do we do is as responsible citizens were Ventus Kearney just goes on in our streets 14 children today killed like a x what do we do about that? I think the answer is we have to deal with the issue of access to guns and we have to ensure that gun owners are responsible gun manufacturers are responsible that we do everything in our power to ensure the guns do not fall into the wrong hands where the hands of a child or the hands of a criminal a New Jersey congresswoman. Whose Name Escapes me right now parently was pushing legislation or is pushing legislation to require manufacturers to make child-proof guns. Is there such a thing? What is so what's that all about? Well, their number of new technologies own marketing and accidents mold Technologies in a market. They could be used to make what are call child-proof comes this is an issue that first of all start out of spec alarm for my dad was a was a state policeman for many years and and like many police officers in the line of duty. He was shot with his own weapon. And but the greater problem here is is not police officer that's hardly a concern of mine and ankles hurting other people as it's a fact that children have unauthorized access to guns and can there be technologies that are available to stop children doing that? And there are there are fingerprint Technologies of radiofrequency Technologies. There's even a simple combination lock which of the following to come all the way you would be designed to render the gun useless to anyone who's not authorized to use it some guns and fired employee weather some really exotic Technologies, but Colt manufacturing was the oldest manufacturing companies in the country. Today's is just released a second prototype of a so-called child-proof gun involving radio frequency. So there are means to make them safer to make them less accessible to unauthorized users including children at we very strongly support efforts in New Jersey right now, that would say that they had guns manufactured New Jersey within the next four years must have employee one of those type of Technologies when there's one of the simple technology one more exotic Technologies, but since the technology exists without insurance that manufactures are doing their best here to keep guns out of the hands of an authorized users. Bob Walker is our guests the shower he is the national president of handgun Control Incorporated and a stop by I need to talk about the gun issues. If you'd like to join our conversation to 276 thousand in the Twin City metropolitan area to 276 thousand outside the Twin Cities. You can reach us toll-free. And that number is one 802-422-8028. By the way reminder. Today's programming is made possible in part by The Advocates of Minnesota Public Radio contributors include 3 a.m. And its subsidiary Eastern Heights bank and the Honeywell Foundation providing the benefits of control worldwide the weather forecast for the state of Minnesota sunny and humid through the afternoon, and there's a chance for some thunderstorms, especially in northern. Minnesota high is today upper 70s in the north mid 80s in the South tonight good chance for showers and thunder showers all across the state may be some severe weather more showers and thunder showers possible in southern Minnesota tomorrow. And then as we move into the weekend on the 4th of July and Sunday for that matter partly cloudy and relatively mild high is 75 to 85. Twin Cities partly cloudy and humid this afternoon with a high in the mid-80s tonight showers and thunder showers in the 50-50 chance for thunderstorms in the Twin Cities tomorrow as well currently around the area. St. Cloud. Is it cloudy skies? 77 Rochester partly cloudy 77 Fargo partly cloudy 76 Sioux Falls with a partly cloudy skies 68 Duluth sunny and 76. The temperature is 78 and skies are cloudy. We're talkin to shower with Bob Walker president of handgun Control Incorporated and John is on the line with a question. Go ahead sir. Well, my answer my question. I am rather pleased to hear you focusing more on the responsibility of parents and things like that. I just read a recent poll on the internet that showed an incredible number of Americans like 90% of opposed to things like blaming manufacturers for for gun deaths in that sort of thing. So I am very pleased to hear that the general tone of your approach today. But the one thing that I have a very strong problem with handgun Hank is their opposing my right to carry a concealed weapon and based on the way. The laws have been going in the states around the nation more and more states are adopting such laws. I've done quite a bit of research myself on them and with 31 out of the 50 states having adopted them and and the research indicating overwhelmingly and I mean research not opinion poll, but hard research indicating that they're basically very successful at with very little change is not a drop and accidental deaths. I'm I'm kind of still a bit skeptical of handgun ink when it comes to the flip side and that is my right forget the Second Amendment just my general right is human being to defend myself. What about a concealed to carry basically in and ask him Steve's would these laws make it easier much easier for people to get a permit to carry a concealed weapon 31 states have such laws now. Minnesota does not although there is talk about the passing such a lot here in Minnesota carry were very concerned about these laws. I am aware of some of the research that's out there but I've taken very close look at the research and and so have a lot of the leading criminologist in this country and we don't believe that the research is is findings are all supported by the research wheel gets very clear that the public safety is endangered when more people are carrying guns on the streets and there's a lot of research. I was a contract which supports that conclusion. I think it's just a matter of Common Sense. We don't need more firearms on a street. That's not the answer and we are very very concerned about a we've we've seen the evidence in a mini to stay to the top of his laws of a many shootings including homicides were people who have concealed weapon. Commence who then in a moment of anger use that weapon to solve a dispute and I will Thomas Lee deadly consequences. What's the what's the average person to make of these dueling statistics in dueling studies? Because it all out on each side claims that by golly they have proof positive that either this these laws definitely improve safety or make life more dangerous. And of course for people who aren't face of these as you called him Julie statistic, I think he will have to rely upon their intuition and I think people's intuition is correct. The answer is not to put more guns on the streets given the increasing incidence of road rage in the country. I don't think we want more motorists carrying firearms. I don't think that's the answer and in addition in addition to intuition if you want to listen to law enforcement whenever you talk to Major long Improve so they're very concerned about these laws right now in Minnesota laws that give police some discretion in issuing these permits and I think that's the way the system on a work when you remove all discretion from police. That means that as long as you don't have a felony conviction in your in your criminal history somewhere. Basically, you get the gum that means a lot of people who despite having demonstrated that they really not probably good candidates to carry a gun never listen to obtain a permit to carry one and that's dangerous to the public safety Rodger question place to all these people that have been refused guns and I think the latest number I saw was 69069 thousand lice curious to find what they were all about. How many of those people were prosecuted going to be my number one question? The second one is I read some disturbing articles about Australia and how people in Australia started along the same path about gun registration, etc. Etc. And all of a sudden Australia is now almost gunless for all of the law-abiding or peace-loving citizens. Third thing I have to ask is about children. You keep mentioning that 5000 children are murdered or or shot killed by a handgun or a gun. What's the age range of those children? And how are they involved in gangs or is it are you talking about 5,000 kids being shot by their own dad or mom's gone. I'll hang up and listen. I see first of all the Fallon so come in to try I buy a gun and are rejected under the Brady Bill are they then swooped up and arrested because it is illegal for them to do that. Well, one of the great sort of Untold success stories, the Brady law has been that a lot of the people who are wanted an outstanding arrest warrants fugitives from Justice have attempted to buy firearms and Lily hundreds of fugitives have been arrested as a result of their attempts to buy a firearm at a gun store when the background check was done there have not been to what the caller was referring to. Turn up a lot of prosecution's in cases of criminals who fill out the sheet and then are told that there's a background check is going to be conducted in the gun. They beat a hasty Retreat out of the gun store and don't come back to get their gun many times because they realize that they could face possible criminal prosecution. But the Brady Bunch has been very successful in keeping guns from being sold, That was the original intent of the law. Are there any statistics on what happens to those people who are turned away in terms of their ability to get guns illegally in any kind of Statistics like well, it's very hard to 2. Am. I the problem we certainly are concerned about the fact that in some states women's now returning to gun shows where in gun shows as opposed to a store at a gun show at the convention center often times. You have license dealers who required to administer the Brady background track. I know you have an unlicensed dealers who are under no requirement whatsoever. They don't even have to have you fill out a Former even ask a question. They simply sell you a gun without any questions asked to sort of cash and carry the answer there is not to repeal the Brady Law. The answer is to to regulate gun shows in and we're working right now in Florida on a public referendum, which we think we'll pass over Wellington the small which will give Congress the authority to regulate those gun show. So it's it it's a serious problem in one week to be addressed by some additional legislation second part of his question had to do with the situation Australia where apparently guns were registered and so on and now he says most guns and private owners are being Are disappearing they're being confiscated. Well, first of all what Australian move to do in the wake of a very horrible shooting Hobart was to ban all semi-automatic Firearms. They have not been off arms revolvers for example are still legal to own in in Australia. And there are there hunting weapons that are perfectly legal to own in Australia not all firearms have been confiscated in Australia, but I think what happened in Hobart illustrates what can happen to a country that is truly outraged by a shooting and that are for those Americans who think that there really is a slippery slope that we're sending a ban on Firearms. Well probably best question to do is to do absolutely nothing and just let these are gun laws continue the way they are and wait for the next major shooting to a car and get a public reaction that so terrific that they take extreme actions. I think the better course here is to prevent future tragedy from occurring in the first place to response. Gun laws the last part of this question had to do with the children who are being killed and injured by Firearms. How many of those children are involved in gang activities? Are they getting hurt because of gang activity in the like as opposed to the where they pick up a gun from their fathers e5002 refers to Children the age of 19 and it includes unintentional shootings suicides as well as homicides and I can tell you that are these shootings do involve course Gang Related activities are not a lot of children in America today perfectly innocent children who are killed as result of drive-by shootings. I've talked to the mothers of many victims of lost children because of a drive-by shooting but the key here is is are we starting get to a point where saying will some of these children lives really don't count. I hope we're not gay. To that point. I hope we're at a point where you agree that that every child's life counts and that we ought to do something about reducing this enormous a carnivorous takes place every year in America Eduardo. Go ahead Place coming in and I will sell reach a by the support that may or call him and I'll give to to passing a bill introduced a bill to to allow people in Minnesota to to carry a concealed weapon. I think that that will just increase the risk of violence in our society. We already have enough that's in homicides in in our society and culture that give him This opportunity to be able to carry concealed weapons will increase remember us as human beings we have in a different settings according to psychological environment and I was so listen to walking say that the road rage issue how many people will be carrying concealed weapons will be out on the street on the roads in for just a simple traffic incident will become violent accident. I was just that was my coming. Obviously you and he agrees with your position on this is absolutely correct. There's no question in my mind that passing a law that would allow more citizens here to carry concealed weapons is an invitation to disaster and tragedy and I'm very very disappointed by the mayor's suggestion that the state out of pursue that course. Again, I talk to law enforcement officials all across this country and we fought battle after battle and I want to say that that was in the past two years have been no additional states to adopt the type of law has been proposed here by the mayor and I think that's because more more states are coming to their senses realizing that the that the experiences of States like Virginia and Texas another state to adopt these laws that is not as advertised. In fact, a lot of problems associated with these laws that you find a lot of people are getting permits to carry weapons. I really shouldn't have them a lot Merle later revoked a lot of the shooting incidents involve the people with these permits. So I think I was completely correct bill here next to get owners be required to carry liability insurance for owning them to cover any consequential damages of that ownership. It seems to me that if the guns were safer or had safety features Child-proof herb and you could show Proper Storage their insurance rates would be lower. This wouldn't courage people to have a monetary incentive to responsibly handle their guns. And it also course there's never any adequate payment for a death, but there is serious injury. Obviously there would be some way to compensate the victims Bill a suggestion made many times. It's it's not a position has been taken by organization. But certainly if you make the analogy the cars just as we have insurance to drive a car there people suggest Berube Insurance liability insurance for for gun owners. That's something I think we would be happy to take a look at it. But I think the more critical task at the moment is really educating gun owners about the responsibilities that they have and making sure that that gun owners are required by law to keep guns out of the hands of children and not simply because he may fear hiring I failed to do so at this point. If a person were not bought a gun do they have to get any kind of training whatsoever to buy that gun or just buy the gun. There's no requirement for person who wishes to Simply buy a gun. Now, there are many states now have pasta requirement that there be safety training to carry a concealed weapon on the street and there are few States three states. Now that have law which requires some elements safety training before you purchase a firearm. We think that the safety training is is very very critical to important thing that can be done to enhance and improve I responsible gun ownership Steve your next. I have had pretty good gun training. I'm not a gun owner. But I've had good training. I had good training from the citizens Police Academy here in St. Paul, which I recommend seeing your listeners to take that part of the classes on they'd they have a video while I call you a video game that you used to learn how to use a handgun that was interesting but I probably got more education from my eleven-year-old son who has unfortunately or fortunately purchased a double O7 Nintendo 64 game and what surprising to me is that you learn about through this game you want about all these different kinds of guns like a Glock and a dust devil, which I wouldn't have even known their name six months ago, but you learn in a which situation to use these guns and all kinds of things and you think about the education of the game like that can do and I'm wondering If I your speaker has any studies on I'm mad. I think they're definitely needs to be if there isn't no hang up. And listen. I'm very concerned about our children and our children are learning a lot about guns that you say a lot more than adults. You talked to major city police chase and they can tell you to pick up 10 11 12 year old kids who can tell you all about guns tell you all about the assault weapons and they use he's in the AK-47 so you can identify guns better than the police. Can I think that's frightening. I think we really have to do much better job of mobilizing our children in the fight against gun violence. When I want to make note of here in the program today is that for the past two years of the country has observed was called a national day of concern to see any other day of national concern where students sign a pledge not to bring a gun to school a pledge not to use a gun to settle dispute and pledged to use their influence with her friends to keep their friends from using guns to settle disputes. And I can tell you that in the wake of the shootings in Jonesboro and Springfield. We've been flooded with calls from students and and teachers and administrators and schools all across America who want to do something to fight back against this epidemic of gun violence in schools. And this October 8th throughout the country there be schools which organ observe the state of national concern students will sign pledges but also anticipate a lot of schools will use this is a day of reflection to teach kids about the promise schools who helped give them the skills. They need to avoid situations potentially involving Firearms possibly to hold rallies at the school. I think it's going to be very very exciting day and I'm an opportunity for the nation to really reflect upon these recent school shootings and really begin to call ask in a strategy in an effort to fight back against this epidemic. So I'm looking forward to her hoping that the present will endorse is national day of concerned. We're hoping that Congress will pass a resolution support of it. I already know that the Mary Louis grow here. Cycling has been working on this effort. She's been doing a tremendous job in terms of immobilizing schools all across the country participate in this exercise in the meanwhile given the fact that we've had these horrendous shootings in schools are there are some people who suggests that teachers should arm themselves or at least somebody at the school should should be harmed so that if something does happen, they would be in a better position to stop the stop the Carnage before it gets too bad. Course. I think that's insane that that wreck of those recommendations are coming from the very same people who are out there telling us that we ought to have Karen concealed weapon laws that allow more people carry guns on the street. I'm sorry. The answer is not more guns on the street. It's not more guns in the school's the answer is to disarm our children that we don't need our children carrying weapons and an additional in addition to the whole debate about whether it it adds to the public safety to have more adults carrying guns on the street. I think there's a broader philosophical question. Question is what kind of message are we sending to her children? If adults are saying more adults need to be carrying guns on the street more adults need be carrying guns to work more adults may be carrying guns to church and in the schools in or ever what kind of mess is that send to our children. How can we talk to our children about the need to avoid carrying firearms in situations involving Firearms when adults are actively encouraging other adults to carry firearms. I'm very disturbed about this ain't going to go beyond the debate about carrying concealed weapons. I think it goes into a broader philosophical debate in this country about whether our future is the future that involve more Firearms or regulated Firearms. We believe it out of the case of regulated firearms and not simply encouraging more people to carry more weapons we have time for at least one more call Phil. That would be you'll go ahead much. I've been listening to all this and I keep going back in my mind that the constitutional right to bear arms and everything else and probably every signer of the Constitution. Mission in the Declaration of Independence and so forth did carry firearms. I think we are to follow their line and put Flintlock Flintlock and everybody's hands. Victoria gun but if you know at that time, it was a necessity and the guns that they were advocating to carry where you'll flintlocks in this type of thing. So everybody should be able to have a Flintlock at home and and the Sportsman or the people I want the automatics and all that type of stuff. That's what we should have. That's what they had at the time and be a lot safer Advocate all kidding aside now or facetiousness society. Would you Advocate that? We essentially banned guns in this country. Okay, thanks. You're welcome for you to call isn't that Bob Walker the open part of the part of the issue here with people who get so nervous when they hear people like yourself talking about gun control laws Phil obviously would like to see all these guns ban there. There are oddly enough about 30 years ago that about 60% of American public would have supported a complete ban on the manufacture of possession of handguns that percentage now is drop well below 40% on the other hand support for the type of laws that we've been talking about earlier about registration and Licensing and more comprehensive laws support for that is today almost overwhelming seventy-five 80% of the American people support laws that would regulate guns like cars. So I think if you're looking to the Future what's going to happen in this country, I think it's inevitable that were to go to a system of Licensing and registration A10 efforts to promote responsible gun ownership, and I think that's the way we were Couple of quick questions before we wrap up when the Brady Bill Parts with sunset at this fall in the change comes in with the instant checks and so on so forth hunting rifles will also be covered now under the new version of the Brady Bill you expect the Uproar over that well enough that I did was first proposed by the National Rifle Association as they were attempting to defeat the Brady Bill several years ago. They're offering alternative call. This instant computerized track and Lily are going to be made from this and computerized track was that well, there's no waiting. Then there should be no objection to also doing a background check that I'm long guns meaning rifles and shotguns. So this was their idea. We certainly support doing background checks on Long guns and particulate air, isn't it? Send check capability. So it's our hope the Congress this year in the in the winning days of this Congress before it leaves in October will in fact extend the waiting. And to make further improve his love of my life. Last picture and that is going back to shoot children and guns. I would hope that the citizens of Minnesota with her as I've had so many other times in the past really help to be a leader hair and and lead on the issue of children and gun owners are represented in Congress to support this very vital piece of legislation. Thank you, sir for coming in today. Thank U Verry Bob Walker who is National president of handgun Control Incorporated. This is Bill Clinton, president, Minnesota Public Radio, June 30th, Mark the close of a very successful year for MPR with your help. We met our membership projections reaching the goal of enrolling 85,000 supporting members. We ended our fiscal year with a balanced budget and we completed the year when our programming was stronger than ever NPR success is your success your interest and support as what