Hackberry 6 minutes past 11 programming on Minnesota Public Radio is supported by Dayton's oriental rug departments in downtown Minneapolis Saint Paul and at the Southdale Brookdale and Rosedale home stores. And good morning. Welcome to mid-day on Minnesota Public Radio. I'm Gary. I can glad you could join us. Well, it looks like Minnesota legislators will be able to go home as scheduled at the end of the day or deal was worked out late last night between the governor and dfl legislative leaders that apparently clears the way for passage of the big tax bill complete with the 20% property tax rebates the bonding Bill including money for St. Pauls hockey arena and the major education belt for a while this weekend look like all of those measures could fall victim to Arne Carlson SV topan, but as often happens last minute agreements have apparently save the day as Perry was reporting the one big issue still to resolve is the health and human services bill, which has stalled over to abortion-related amendments legislators will be trying to break that impasse today. Most of the media attention of course is focused on the tax bill and the hockey arena almost lost in the shuffle was the decision to launch Minnesota's first light rail Transit line for years. 10 years advocates in opponents have been arguing the merits of building Light Rail transit in the Twin Cities. The issue has been studied forever. But now for the first time the governor and the legislature have agreed to actually spend some money to build a light rail Transit line. The 400 million dollar line would run along Hiawatha Avenue from Downtown Minneapolis to the airport and then on to the Mall of America under the legislation the state will appropriate 50 million dollars at the start with plus another 50 million in the future of the federal government is expected to contribute 200 million for construction with the rest of the money coming from local government. The line is scheduled to be up and running in about 5 years or so joining this joining us this hour to I discuss the project is Hennepin County Commissioner Peter McLaughlin who has been one of the leading advocate for light rail in the Twin Cities and art Leahy is whether she's the general manager of Metro Transit the agency that operates the Twin Cities bus system and we'll be operating this new light rail Transit line. And we also invite you to join our conversation great opportunity here to learn a little bit more about what apparently will be our first light rail Transit line. Give us a call Twin City area number is 227-6002 276 thousand on side the Twin Cities. You can reach us toll-free and that number is one 802-422-8281 morning morning Peter McLaughlin. First of all, any major hurdles real hurdles left to go or is it pretty much all systems go now. Well Gary my wife's the Boston Red Sox fan and there were Red Sox fans who had their champagne bottles out in in 86 Bill still has to pass with the the extraordinary majority both the Senate in the house and then the governor's got to sign it but it is moving along and I think your characterization of the the end of the session is finished with my sensor. What's going on in very good shape and we just got a couple more LabCorp in the night then in here for sure. Is there any danger that you won't get the federal money? Well, the federal money we're authorized in the new bestie legislation which sets the framework for National Transportation policy for the next six years were in both the Senate and the house bills and they are I spoke to Curtis mobile service office this morning and they are going to get the they're going to go into conference committee. As soon as their spring break is over there going to have that bill ready to go May first and then it goes to the Appropriations process and congressmen. Say Bose the ranking member of the Appropriations Committee in the house. He is ready to go to advocate for funding for a Fiscal Federal fiscal 99 and we got support from both Senators grams and that well, so I think we're in good shape there too. So we're looking at very very good shape. Lahey five years. Is that the pretty good guesstimate as to when this line would actually start operating. I think it's a safe. Guess I have to account for Final planning and design engineering work in construction somewhere around 2003 is a very good Target as the man who needs to operate this system. I what do you see as the the major benefit here? Well rail brings a whole new level of service and capacity to any City on places like San Diego and Portland and Sacramento and many other cities around the nation rail has brought Mobility Economic Development and improve quality-of-life two cities if we imagined San Diego today or San Francisco or the commission's capital we can almost not imagine those cities working if they didn't have their rail systems what their back ground bus Network in place moving people around high-speed high-capacity Transit service is attractive because it begins to offer a very high-quality level of level of service and that serves to bring the discretionary Rider into a transit system and Enhance Mobility over all this is particularly important because with the population growth that have occurred in the Twin Cities, we can't afford to build free ways to maintain that Mobility. Therefore we got to look for ways to supplement and enhance what we currently have today. Is it primarily a way to ease congestion or to do all these other things? Well, I think it serves a variety of purposes people have looked at congestion or reduced air emissions reduce pollution access to jobs for folks who don't have access to automobile how it it does add Mobility Mobility directly contributes to economic vitality and quality-of-life issues. So I think there's a multiplicity of purpose of an automobile. By the way. If someone said, why do you have a car will you you do it to get around but you as a multiple of a number of reasons why you would have that car to go to work to go to school to church Ascending apply to Transit LRT as the Silver Bullet. This is LRT as a component of an effort to really raise the whole transit system up. We've got to do something. What are the reasons this bill passed this year. I believe is that congestion started to get on people's nerves. I mean it is being noticed and sell people think we've got to try something new something different and Light Rail will be a part of what what will be at and improve transit system throughout the region. I mean we're looking at but we're busways are going to be built by the by the MTC they're going to be looking to look at commuter rail as well. So this is an effort to really raise the whole transit system up as a way of keeping this economy moving and allowing people and goods to move smoothly. Why Hiawatha Avenue now if you were to a lot of people say well why not build a peanut bail just one line to start with why not build it from say Minneapolis to st. Paul downtown areas where there's a lot of traffic already or perhaps down. 35W where again? There's a huge amount of traffic presumably to get a little more congestion relief that way both of those have been discussed as as lines was a lot of attention paid to both of those and we are the political Coalition and the support far could never happen 35W, you know, there was a taco a 1.8 billion dollar Improvement to 35W that included light rail plus Highway fix up. The light rail was about an 800 million dollar component and the highway was going to be over a billion that could have sort of fell of its own weight and there wasn't enough there enough resources to get that the Minneapolis-Saint Paul connection people that well for you can prove the the bus service which is a pretty good there. Maybe we can get that done Congressman Sable help to get us some money that's going to be used to improve that bus or so Hiawatha then comes to the fore because you've got Downtown Minneapolis the Metrodome the University of Minnesota the VA Hospital the Airport and the Mall of America all on that line. Those are all huge generators of trips and it it becomes a line that can can be free-standing. We think it's going to be the beginning of a broader system but it will it will work on its own because there are so many so many jobs and so many so much interest in going to this location. Is there enough money to operate this this train without draining running away from the bus system what time goes on chords but we need to do is to make sure that we will enhance our bus system as well. As our real component Westmead the cost of this line of with Ray to be in the same ballpark as a similar level of service using buses. So whether this is a busway or a Transit way that we don't expect the cost differential to be significant. Just the construction cost. That's that's higher and after that at all. It's about the same rate frankly at low levels of service buses are cheaper but a higher levels of service. I'm worth. Frequent service with more seats or more people. In other words are kind of service Stabilitrak passengers at a certain point you reach a break-even point with rail or even though you can save some money at Brea high levels of service was being discussed right now is the construction cost though. We're off several years before we be are pretty in that when we do open the line. We would seek federal funds to cover the first two or three years of operation is a capital expenditure Federal rules to permit that to happen serve a catalyst the federal government wants to jump start these things. So they're going to help out around the capitol cause I want to go back Hiawatha Avenue was supposed to be an eight-lane freeway back in the early sixties. When they first plan that thing's going to be an eight-lane freeway just like 35W sunken. It was going to divide the neighborhood to the neighborhood in the City of Minneapolis and no we don't want that. So this is a transitional Carter that's what evolved from an eight-lane freeway very expensive to a four-lane major arterial with lots of turning. Install out the through traffic to move quickly. So there's there's Ben tens of millions of dollars that have been saved on Capital cost in this corridor already by downsizing the road component from an eight-lane freeway down to this arterial, but the compliment to it was supposed to be light rail. That's the plan. So now we're kind of coming through with the second piece of the capital investment in this car door. So we saved a bunch of dough already it in this Carter. We're talking a shower about what to looks to be Minnesota's first light rail Transit line. There is money included in the legislature is bonding Bill. Apparently the governor has signed off on the bill legislative leadership is signed off and if everything goes according to plan, I'm going to start at the end up with its first light rail Transit line in about five years running along Hiawatha Avenue in Minneapolis great opportunity today to find out a little bit more about this line or what it will accomplish how it will operate. I'd like to join our conversation. Give us a call to 276 thousand is our Twin City area number to 276 thousand outside the Twin Cities one. 800-242-2828 our guests this our art Leahy general manager at Metro Transit the agency that operates the the transit system in the Twin Cities in Hennepin County Commissioner. Peter McLaughlin is with us. He has been one of the leading advocates for light rail Transit again to 276 thousand or one 800-242-2828 Dan your question, please increase funding and support for for transit in the Twin Cities. I say congratulations and it's about time. I've been a strong supporter of transit for a long time. And and right now I depend on it entirely and that's mostly by choice. Not not by necessity. My concern is the the The corridor that they're planning on putting the light rail Transit into I've been involved someone with the or just kept up-to-date with with the plan for the Highway 55 reroute issue and it concerned me first of all that Transit and anti-urban trawler environmentalists or whatever. We're putting together a pitted against each other in this whole debate where I think that Transit and environmental should have been able to the rally together for light rail Transit against the end in rally against the highway and automobile group the cell makes my first question is where exactly if if there is a definite spots, but where exactly will this light rail Transit Go Wilco on the existing Corridor or will it go through the oak Savannah and along the Mississippi River? Uprooting all the trees and then putting a highway through there and then and then finally I also just wanted to point out that I do think that it is a great thing that we will finally have light rail Transit. I hope that in and out from wondering where the next place is if they've been planned yet. So first of all, the threatened or actual lawsuits about the realignment that there would be presumably require the alignment for the light rail stays essentially as you get south of 50/52, it stays essentially in the existing the road right away. So it stays to the West Highway is what the end of breaking off to the east. So the light rail is not the not the issue resolved the dispute over going through the park land in this these Indian mounds or whatever that none of that's involved with the Light Rail Project. It is not it is not the right away is is is essentially in the existing. Road right away for Light Rail. And is this line just the first in a series of lines or should we think about this more as kind of a demonstration project to trial project to see how it works. Well, a lot of cities have began begun Light Rail systems. Some of them have stopped at one some of them have added. I think we have to have a line and we I think we have one which makes sense. If we don't do any more at the same time if it works and I believe it will and people find it to be an unattractive service that may well be additional lines, but I don't think that's necessary for this to be successful beauty of getting a system up and started and why it's appropriate that the federal government is helping us to jump-start. This is there are some special costs associated with the first line to build the yards and shops set up the electronic systems in the like the incremental cost the extra cost for building a second second line or third line will actually be less than that this first lines going to cost because we'll have that basic infrastructure in place with a system how many additional people will use this as opposed to people who are riding on the bus now? The current estimates so show initial ridership in the area of 22000 passengers per day with estimate that with buses on that same Corridor. We be carrying approximately 14000 per day. I believe those numbers are are realistic for the initial years of service. What will happen when this Line opens. It looks like what happens when a freeway opens. It will change patterns of development and where people live in where they work until overtime while happens. I didn't close ridership numbers will be excited but early on it sounds like there is a the effect on any kind of freeway congestion is minimal at best well. That Corridor was designed to have two lanes of traffic in each Direction + Light Rail. That's what that that's what the engineer said was needed for that car. So we need the capacity if this if this roadway is going to function into the future 20. Mm Riders a day is almost 10% of the current ridership of the whole bus system on a daily basis almost 10% So this is not a trivial number of riders Indigo from 14 to 20 mm a day that's left more than more than 50% increase in the number. So I mean, this is not a trivial amount of what's happening. Now, that's just out of the Chute and we're talking about the University of Minnesota where you've got arguably the worst your second worst set of parking problems in the whole region the airport which has argue away first of their kind of debate when the witches were fighting from the Mall of America wait where there's you know, the biggest tourist attraction North America, so we have no solid ride generators here. So that's why this is going I mean you think about avoiding Park parking spaces in a ramp cost 10 to $12,000 a pop 10 to $12,000 a space. That's all at the airport to get this kind of service. So the people aren't driving to the airport and parking is going to save the airports commission money. That's all there's all there's all sorts of ways that this is going to make sense Dennis your question regarding. Light Rail vs. Commuter trains and whether or not we couldn't utilize some of the infrastructure that exists in the form of underused railway lines coming into the city. I don't I kind of jumped your nut on your discussion if it's only limited to the song to Hiawatha quarter, I apologize but as I think about that, even there are quite a few RealTracs running alongside Hiawatha, is that possible in a quart to incorporate it into this type of thing at all. I want is the specific design in Hiawatha into the use of commuter rail in in other quarters, the bill that the legislature is going to be taking up today and likely to approve includes the study of use of those got real quarters into another a number of areas. They're looking at Duck into going into a Young America and Carver County on existing rail up to Bethel and up in the northwest corner. Monticello Inn in through head up in and out into into Wright County is a look at on rail line commuter rail line the b n main line up to up to the Northtown Shopping Center in Anoka County and then on to St Cloud so they are going to be examined. Those studies are that those lines are not as as Roma Torre at they haven't been worked on as much as the Hiawatha quarter has but in fact they are going to be examined and there's a lot of enthusiasm for that it about the legislature in Washington Hiawatha Corridor specifically, there are Rail lines to the east of Hiawatha right now. They service the grain elevators there long Hiawatha. We have the it's a much the commuter rail trains don't start and stop as fast as Light Rail and you in an urban setting like the City of Minneapolis down to the airport in the mall. You want to have frequent stops. You want to have a stop at that Franklin Avenue in Lake Street in 38th. And the way you do that is to use a light rail train which starts and stops quickly commuter rail is not the appropriate. Analogy for that quarter. How long will it take to get to say from Minneapolis to the Mall of America Light Rail as opposed to driving right now. We're assuming trip time in the area of a 30 minutes for that trip. So I think that it's that's a good convenient travel time. I think we need to remember that. This is really investment for the future. We don't have the congestion today the other major cities have but we're on the same path if we received slowing freeway speeds already that's going to continue. We know that by the year 2020 is going to be 2/3 of a million additional people here. We know that those people are going to take about two and a half million trips a day and we know that we're not going to be building freeways and Roads to provide the mobility required by those people and by us the inevitable conclusion is what's going Results from that is congestion in the store freeway speeds that's happened all over the country that's going to happen here. We've got to do is make an investment in Mobility so that we can still move people at the jobs into services and two schools even with this population growth. So one of them is going to happen is overtime is the travel times on on buses and train are going to improve I wanted automobiles long-term catch up with a travel time of the car to take 5 years to build this five years in which congestions going to get worse than the people going to be pouring across the Mendota Bridge from Dakota County in Downtown Minneapolis. It's going to it's going to jam that wrote up all the projections say that when you're making infrastructure investment, you can't be just thinking in terms of a 2-3 year time frame. You need to be thinking at 20 and 30 years out into the future and that's really what this light rail Investments about. It's about a transportation. System for the future and if we don't do something like this and we try to do it with roads were going to bankrupt ourselves and we're going to get paralyzed besides and we can't get our way out of this with road too long Scott your next guy. Good morning. I'm just going to touch on my question or possibly the definition of Light Rail transit route. Okay. Thank you Light Rail trains typically run at high levels of service that is every five or six or seven minutes during the rush hour. They typically have stations that are half a mile to 1 mile apart and they typically are between 10 and 15 miles long. And that's inside. The Hiawatha line is is a classic Light Rail Corridor that you would see all over the country Commuter Rail lines tend to be longer sometimes. 75 miles long. They tend to have stations that are far apart. Sometimes as far apart is 10 miles. So in a heavy Urban environment like like the Twin Cities Light Rail is certainly an appropriate technology that Scholars from Burnsville Dory. 20 years out and how does this fit together? And what are the various Depots in destinations that you might have in mind and does this allowed for open space in between some identities are very pretty and livable because they have garden centers for me in between and it would be interesting to see population centers linking to the city center and green farms in between places where people could bike It's me question the history of real investment. Both commuter rail in LRT is the development tend to center around the stops because people want to be able to get to the stops quickly whether to park and ride that they would drive to or whether it's a date. They take a bus to the stop and then get on the train. So in terms of long-term land use in terms of preservation of Green Space, which is I think what the story was talking about. Investment in rail Transit really does make sense and it is an effective anti sprawl technique if it's one of the lines are in the right place and to land use is coordinated with until there's got to be a lot of work done on land use around these lines if we're going to get the maximum benefit out of them in terms of her question about our plan overall plan the yeah, as I said before the legislation includes a number of studies of additional Carter's one from St.Paul down into town to Hastings, for example as when I didn't mention before and the Riverview Carter from Nate NC from the mall in the airport into downtown Saint Paul, so there are other quarters that are going to be studied and that will once that evaluation is done. Then what the the next most logical quarters for development of those will emerge Join, the 30 year history of not building Light Rail. We've got opportunistically pick out one line and try to do that other times. We've done the grand plan and they've all failed in the past. Sometimes the grand plans fall of Their Own Way cover thing. Oh my goodness. It's too much money. So I think this this time we're going to build the line that makes the most sense and then we're going to be looking very systematically at what the next lines out of me. So I think that's a prudent way to proceed in the face of the the need for some kind of investment. Drink critics have suggested that this is kind of a camel under their camel's nose Under the Tent thing that and that as soon as you get this bill or you'll say well it would work. It's working real fine, but it would work even better. If we just if we spend another hundred million here in a hundred million there in the front page of the Star Tribune last week was a a map that showed the six most Troublesome maintenance projects that were going to be pursued this year in the Medtronic for roads. They were part of life. 50 maintenance projects are going to be pursued the six most Troublesome projects. We're going to cost seventy-five million bucks just for maintenance. The whole total package was going to cost like 250 million and we don't really we don't even blink at that. So we're talking about large amounts of money, but we spend large amounts of money on roads already. And so what we're talking about here trying to change the transportation system and we need to try to change the way in which were investing in the metro area. What do you as a you've been working on this for a long time? Make sure you see is a is a realistically what do you see Happening Here down the role of that but as soon as this one is built that bridge we made to build some more people go along with that or I think so because I think people are going to see that it isn't cost effective efficient desirable way to move around and people want to be able to move around to their job to there recreational activities shopping whatever and they're going to see that this makes sense as a part of the transportation strategy. About to the new light rail Transit line that apparently is going to be built in the Twin Cities. This would be Minnesota's first touchline. There's a legislation at the capital which a pretty much everybody signed off on now which would provide 250 million dollars and state money to get the project started Federal money would be added to the mix local money. And we thought today would be a great opportunity to find out a little bit more about what it is that will be getting five years down the road. If you'd like to join our conversation. Give us a call 227-6002 to 76 thousand outside the Twin Cities 1 800 to +422-828-227-6000 or one 800-242-2828 or guess this hour and up in county commissioner Peter McLaughlin and art Lahey who's the general manager of Metro Transit more calls in a moment. If you have trouble finding the time to manage your money, here's an idea TuneIn the Sean money this weekend and see what a difference just one hour can make Bob Potter here Chris Farrell and Erica whittling. Eric will be on hand with answers to all your personal finance and investment questions and Financial Consultant Ruth Hayden will tell us when enough is enough that sound like a Saturday morning at 10 again Sunday afternoon at 5 on Minnesota Public Radio, Canada. What do FM 91.1 in the Twin Cities? Invitation to join us over the noon hour. We're going off to the National Press Club Mack McLarty top Clinton advisor for Lo these many years is now a special Envoy to the Americas and he's speaking at the Press Club update previewing the president's upcoming trip to South America live coverage over the noon hour today sunny to partly sunny skies are forecast for the state today with eyes ranging from the upper 40s to the upper 50s and should be nice tomorrow as well Saturday supposed to be dry to Twin City forecast partly cloudy today with a high near 55 right now. It's 46 and it's cloudy or talking to sour about the new light rail Transit line that apparently is coming to Minnesota. And again, if you'd like to join our conversation to 276 thousand or outside the Twin Cities one 800-242-2828 and we should correct ourselves. We've been talking about 50 million dollars in state funding to get things started actually. I guess it's closer to 40 million right commissioner in here 10 million there, you know a jar your question please and there and right at 35th and Iowa and I'm a little concerned about when we start seeing the traffic moving through that area of people traffic that there's going to be degradation of the neighborhood kind of like along 35W, you know with all the traffic and my other question is Lake Street bridge this great new bridge that's gone up is that now was that in vain with the nude Light Rail Transit? You know that question that will that was designed into to work in conjunction with the light rail. So there's there's no conflict there. There's not convenient waste of those resources. So that'll that'll work. Just fine. In terms of the degradation. I need to go back again to the history history was It was supposed to be a classic freeway like 35W and it has become an arterial with trees along along it with a with a bike path and then they'll be the the light rail transit to the West as he gets off the Lake Street that in other communities that has not in fact led the degradation of that fact has been an enhancer to the environment. So the comparisons got to be to a to the freeway and that really that did cause problems I represent the area on both sides of 35W and it and you can see the problems that a freeway causes. This was designed by The Neighborhood by the community in conjunction with them in. In the city to text Leigh work with the neighbor and I think it's a great improvement over Old Road design stuff for free art Leahy. Are these Light Rail Transit lines? Are they safe? I mean, I assume if you got on and on the thing and during a rush hour with a thousand. The other people be be fine. But if you wanted to take this in the middle of the night, would you be safe doing so no. Absolutely. I think people have sometimes they may be the Onion Creek View of a light rail station or train. These are in fact desirable places to be they are sources of Mobility to access to the places to go to jobs and so forth. So people use them and living around the station. In fact, it's an attractive place to be it's an advantage to have the rail service not a disadvantage in terms of safety are all over the country some of the worst neighborhoods around the country Light Rail service runs today and it runs safely today. I can cite one example in Los Angeles is very difficult community area, but the folks used to service and it works great. Now white Wheel cars are equipped with Communications two police officers. There will be police officers. Riding the trains there will be intercoms to get to the operator. So I think this is going to be a very attractive and very safe service system. They put a park and ride major park and ride that some people were very skeptical about think that people would be afraid of the neighborhood in which was located. Nobody would use it that lot was full day one when they open the system and they've had to expand it. So I think that that the track record again on a system that well operated with with good Links communication links with the police and Dada with the transit system operators. I think it's a it's a system that'll be fine. I think they'll be people will feel safe and I want to write Jack you're next about the specific physical configuration will as an example will it will the wind be elevated at street-level subgrade also? Will it be able to express and local train sets? And then one more question what about downtown will will it make a loop or just houses address the whole area of downtown art Leahy, you have to run this behavior in system and I'm excited about the prospect light rail cars are unique because they can run on surface streets. They can run on what's called semi exclusive rights away or an exclusive rights away such as an elevated. Most of this line is going to be at grade in downtown and then the longer the cord or these cars will most likely be what's called a low floor car. So the stations are really a platforms much like sidewalks. The line will run from downtown in the area of downtown Minneapolis down, of course to the airport in the Mall of America current plan is to go under the airport in a Subway mode that's unique thing about light rail cars is that kind of configuration just makes a whole lot of sense. You know what your rent your car is at the airport now down there in the in the basement level the train that we're discussing a design where the train would actually pull right in there where you're into cars you jump off the train you got your suit bag in your computer. If you're going on at on a business trip, you take the escalator up to floor to floors and you're you're on your plane. That's the kind of service that that's a really unique feature here, which is high quality service at the airport which it which is important. It's going to attract Riders is also going to be in in Minnehaha Park when you have to go by the creek is actually going to be a tunnel dug there to get get past the creek and then that's going to be for the road and for the Light Rail and then over top of the tunnel. There's going to be a grass grass plant until that where there's actually go to be a connection. If you know what it's like down there you can go right from the Pavilion area Minnehaha Park over to the little Lagoon to the west and then Soul and that's really virtually unused right now until there's actually going to be the creation of Parkland down there in that quarter right around the creek. I think that's a good solution right there at that spot Leonard. Hello. Thank you a Peter or art have a few questions quickly won't you be taking business out of downtown and shifting it to the Mall of America, which is a business Southdale could say why don't you run it out here Ridgedale could say the same thing as far as the airport goes who would be coming and going to the airport with two three and four bags and trying to hop onto a light rail train. And my first question is that probably Hiawatha is not one of the heaviest travels traffic areas in the Twin Cities. And why should it be running right down here on the tracks and a to the Hiawatha Court? I'll listen. First of all, I ship so much business out to the Mall of America. Well, I will tell you that the downtown Council in Minneapolis doesn't believe that that's the case the the merchants the other business people in Downtown Minneapolis want to be connected by a high-speed rail line with the largest tourist attraction in North America the Mall of America. They think people will come in go to the mall jump on the train and come downtown and spend are going to go out to dinner go to the theater in downtown. So the the downtown Merchants the ones who know their business, but better than I are saying this is a huge Plus for them and there's not going to drain business from them. They think they'll use it with the Mall of America and others to promote. This region is a place to visit that use it in promoting and is at convention site and they think it's going to help their business not her. I realistically what about the concept of the traveler bogged down with three or four suitcases and stuff trying to get on this train. Is that realistic or alive? Set myself in Philadelphia and Cleveland in Los Angeles. In other cities. These cars are low platform car. So they are easy to get in and out of the fair is going to be unbeatable plays Fair as a dollar and a quarter on a Metro Transit bus when one imagined to Metro Transit train run from downtown out to that airport that you can get to the airport for a dollar and a quarter and then be delivered right by the terminals. I think people are going to ride that. I didn't matter. What would I have taken the train to the airport? I've just put the suitcase on the floor. I really never had a problem with it. I think one thing that gets overlooked to is an awful lot of employees who work at the airport will take the surface. So it's not only tourist. I think if you got three bags, you're probably get somebody to drive you to take a cab realistically, but if you're traveling lightly and a lots of people who do Take this is perfect. I mean it. I've done it in Washington when I go there. I have my my suit bag and I've got my computer or briefcase and that works just fine. Once you get Beyond two bags or three that it gets to be a problem. I think you lose those Riders but there are plenty of people who are traveling late on business Earl of the like another thing. So, I think those people who want you one question mark back to the router itself. If you fellows had your druthers forget about all the politics and the the delays and the and the rigmarole involve. Is this the first line that you would select of all the possible Light Rail lines. I think this is a classic light rail line. It's a it's certainly an excellent place to start service that's going to Spurs and development out there. I think it's a great place to start better than 9435 W. I think there's a lot of issues with 35W. That would be real hard to overcome. Scott your question, please. My question is that I'm the city administrator in Northfield and we have had our eye on one of the lines one of the six other lines that are under consideration. That is the line that says connecting Northfield with Downtown Minneapolis and guess you've talked about this a little bit but I'd like you to especially mr. Lady to speculate a little bit more on what kind of impact General overall impact could we expect in our community at the community of 16,000 small college town? What kind of like this connecting our town to downtown Minneapolis and second. Could you give a little bit more detail on what kinds of cost-share Arrangements you're making with your with the communities that are going to be connected with a line that's being proposed and I'll have my men how much those communities have to pay right away or what and I'll take my answer. If a line were built in Northfield, how would that affect Northfield Commuter Rail line up there? We'd expect to see what's happened in other cities, which is folks would who have business in Downtown Minneapolis would take that train rather than driving their automobile for sure and Crips that makes a whole lot of sense that sort of application actually is a classic Transit Village that used to spring up all around the country before the automobile become popular. What would happen is it I mean increased access to jobs and people take advantage of that. I think what an enhanced quality of life and in that area increased Mobility is good for cities. It's good for the economy is good for quality of life business. Local governments are supposed to contribute. What's 70 million + 2 this 70 million. It's at and then the governor is concerned that if there if it turns out that operating costs would be significantly higher you have to come up with that money. Two and a local bases. Well, it's we should split split on operating a capital a capital side. The federal government's going to pay for half of it. That's the point in the state were asking for a quarter of it over for you. This is the first this is the first 40% of that in this legislative session. And then another quarter of it from local sources total cost going to be about 400 million. We've already invested 30 million dollars in right of way and and bridges and things most of which was a local money that the Hennepin County Regional railroad Authority put together so that local share the local cash needed now is 70 million and I would anticipate that that would come from Hennepin County Regional railroad Authority which which has that which is the entire County. That's the tax base for that. We have some money accumulated already that we would be investing in this there would be a request made. I believe we're even going to be in discussions with the airports commission. Once this gets a green light from the legislature and the governor because they're going to be getting high quality service and they can they can we think they should be making a contribution to that and then there can be development districts in the like where some of the development would that be making a contribution if they're special stop to things like that put in place. So it's a it's a mix of sources that would be used from the local level primary responsibility goes back to the rail Authority, but the airports commission clear I think should have a role as well if they're not interested them are airports commission or some of these other sources of funding. What's the plan Jesus drop it or do you raise the property tax are hot dogs at the regional rail Authority as I said has a substantial sum of money in the bank right now that would be used as a as a down payment and then there could be Local property tax levy that could that would be imposed by the by the rail Authority across Hennepin County. That's not that I don't think that that's a by any means a sure bet. I think in fact, it's if it's a 50-50 chance at best and I think there are any other other sources of funding that are going to be available. I think at the local level we can put together a place. Okay. I I guess I am a well-loved Minnehaha Park and I'm just wondering how it's going to impact their I mean, there's enough traffic and they've just read landscape that whole thing. And I think it would be a shame if I really do and there's theater where it's and that's where the originals who was down in the valley there between Theodore Wirth and Minnehaha Park, that's one of my favorite parks, and I'm so close to it here in St. Paul. So and why can't you go underground? But the whole thing underground at the creek and as I said before that will be a grass Bridge put over the top so that X is going to be more Park land created by the by this light rail tunnel and and roadway tunnel there. So I actually think it's going to enhance the park. But remember the original discussion was for an eight-lane freeway. This is an alternative that going to be sleep quiet non-polluting rail vehicle that's going to be providing service to the park and then through that Corridor. So I think that it's a great Improvement and it'll be designed in a way that's going to be neighborhood participation in the design will be designed in a way that enhances the part. I love the part 2 I. I live ten blocks from the park myself until it's important to me as well. And there's been a lot of investment down there recently that's really made it wonderful let you know first major investment in that Park since WPA day, very quick question. Questions concerning the personal rapid transit in is that completely dead and then what were the reasons for deciding against that system our lady first of all 15 second explanation of what is personal Rapid Transit? Well, it's an attempt to have Mobility provide like a rapid transit line, but on it for in small cars have been trying a few places very expensive is far from clear that it all is economic. Would it be worth trying though since since you're you're you're talking about the future here at the long-range plan and if this is the kind of thing that might be a real alternative to the automobile as opposed to kind of a supplement will typically such a system is that is that as one might see in Detroit today really provide downtown circulation? It's just awfully expensive without adding in my view at least a significantly to the amount of Transportation available. I think you get more bang for your buck. With a high-speed high-capacity transitway or Railway. John Marty is argued that if you simply spend a tenth of them out of money, you're talking about you could reduce bus fares to a quarter double the bus ridership and get a lot more people off the highway. So is he all wet for the track record on bus ridership in this region is is dismal we've gone from 90 million Riders a year to go to just over 60 million Riders a years in the last 20 years have people been talking about busways and metered ramps and all this and that to get people out of the bus studies around the country of showing people prefer to ride on a train like it or not. They prefer to ride on the train that a customer preference for that. This is a this is about being a catalyst for the whole transit system is going to be a lot more bus service and better bus service along with this Light Rail lines up. It's not light rail as the solution to all of our problems is light rail is a catalyst to raise the whole transit system up and that's what I think we've got to do in this region and that's why I'm so excited about Happening at the legislature this year 5 years down the road before it starts operating but after it's open and running and and going how long do we how long should we give it to decide whether or not it's been a success. I think we're going to find it's a success on day one and it'll become a greater success as time goes on. I like to get to know here that are in Metro Transit ridership has dropped has begun to climb now and we have ridership today higher than places like Cleveland and Seattle and Portland. So you got a good base here to build on and that's going to be manifested in Hiawatha court or when does Metro Transit trains are going down high-speed high-capacity. Thanks a lot for coming by today. Thanks. Appreciate it. I guess that's our Peter McLaughlin who is Hennepin County Commissioner when a leading advocates in the Twin Cities for light rail transit in art Leahy general manager of Metro Transit the agency that operates the bus system and we'll be operating what apparently will be real light rail Transit. Apparently all systems go now or pretty close to it and operation along the highway Hiawatha Corridor is expected to begin in about 5 years will continue with midday in just a month. Hi, this is John Raby with word of a special mid-morning broadcast on the way. Friday will be live at the union Presbyterian Church in St. Peter will be talking about how and why we turned our faith in times of turmoil and how your family's Diaries scrapbooks photos and so on are part of your communities history of special mid-morning live from St. Peter at 9 Friday morning midmorning 9 to 11 weekdays on Minnesota Public Radio, Canada, W FM 91.1 in the Twin Cities 5 minutes now before 12 and time for The Writer's Almanac.