Hey, good morning. The time is 6 minutes after 11. If you were listening to mid-day on Minnesota Public Radio Gary. I can his way today. I'm very smelly. Thanks for joining us so much programming on Minnesota Public Radio is supported by standard heating and air conditioning the Twin Cities Home Comfort Experts for 68 years featuring York Heating and Cooling products reports of an out-of-court settlement in the Minnesota. Tobacco. Trial continue as the case heads toward the jury the state and Blue Cross Blue Shield of Minnesota have sued cigarette makers for about one and three quarters of a billion dollars plus punitive damages for the cost of breeding smoking-related diseases. The state claims. Tobacco companies do fraud of the public and violated antitrust laws by suppressing Research into the health effects of smoking reports indicate. The deal on the table is for a 5 billion dollar settlement and a ban on marketing. Tobacco products to children or if the stakes are very high for both sides in the dispute. So this hour we're going to give listeners a chance to weigh.Turn on whether there should be a settlement or not be a good chance for you to advise the lawyers. Should they take a chance on a jury verdict or agree on terms to avoid going to the jury we're joined at the studio today by Ron Rosenbaum. St. Paul trial lawyer and host of the WCCO radio program holding Court. He is here to clarify legal matters and answer any questions that you might have about how settlement negotiations work and how they arrived at run. Welcome to the program. Thank you. Should be here with your comments or questions is to two that are the first of all the Twin Cities to 27 6000 to 276 thousand in the Twin Cities the toll free number for listeners outside the metro area one 802-422-8281 800-242-2828 again in the Twin Cities to 276 thousand outside the metro area one 800-242-2828 before we take your calls were joined by Minnesota Public Radio reporter Laura McCollum on a 2:00 ampReporters who have covered the tobacco trial since it began in January. She's at the federal courthouse in St. Paul where the trial is being held good morning Laura settlement. Have you heard of any more word on a settlement today? It seems the things have died down a little bit. I did hear from a couple of sources that it's possible if there were talks under way. They might have collapsed last night over a couple of items, but I can't get confirmation of that. The Attorney General's office is not confirming even that talks were underway, you know some of the sources I talked to said there were some sticking points. But as I said, the Attorney General's office won't confirm what those items were and you know, the mood at the courthouse is really one of anticipation we have about 20 media people sitting in the media room about 10 camera Crews outside and no word of settlement at this point or the major factors.The east side has to consider as you mentioned the stakes are very high for both sides. I think tobacco has tacitly acknowledge. There's a chance they could lose here and there they're very leery of risking that they said all along. They don't feel they can get a fair trial in Minnesota. They feel the judge is biased against them. And I think they sense that some of these jurors probably have some anti-tobacco views, but for the Stateside, you know, what you're a verdict is risky as well. The jury could come back with less than the reported 5 billion dollar settlement amount or the jury could find them the tobacco companies guilty on some counts, but not all possibly antitrust but not consumer protection so I can see why you know, there are these negotiations saying maybe a settlement is the best option but keep in mind I'll be real curious what listeners have to say because I've heard some people on talk shows saying why would there be a settlement this late in the trial and there might be some sort of a backlash among?Sentence of Minnesota if there's one at this point, I'll be curious what listeners have to say. She is so important. I wonder if you could give us a glimpse at the makeup of the jury and you've watched this trial may be a little bit about what you've observed about them during the trial jury to non-smokers and 7 former smokers history. We've jokingly called a poker face jury, either. They've been instructed by the judge or they're just so attentive. They really don't show their emotions at all. They they are extremely attentive. They take notes they come in each day with a big stick notebooks in and take notes about all the minutiae of details that have come out in this case, but we don't see much in the courtroom. Of course those of us who've been covering this all along we've developed little nicknames for the jurors because they seem like a pretty typical group of minnesotans. Most of them are about middle-aged a couple are younger a couple are older a dress casually most of them wear jeans each day orCasual clothes and most of them have pretty typical occupations. There's one who's a receptionist at the Minnesota Club. When's a cosmetologist one works for the u.s. Government on the Mississippi River and the only really indication we've seen of that the fact that they might be becoming kind of a close-knit jury is when you see them leaving the courtroom. Most of them are kind of joking and laughing with each other and you'd sense that they've gotten to know each other quite well over these past 15 weeks or observations this morning. Thanks, very Minnesota Public Radio the tobacco while since it began last January, and of course, I Minnesota Public Radio watching what's going on at the federal courthouse in the Saint Paul, very closely and monitoring possible settlement negotiations, and we will report to you just as soon as we hear any word at all what we're doing this hour is getting your thoughts about whether or not. There should be a settlement in this tobacco trial if you'd like to way and give us a call the Twin Cities number is 227-6002.276 thousand the toll free number is one 800-242-2828. I didn't mention a few moments ago. They were joined in the studio today by Ron Rosenbaum. He's a trial lawyer in the Saint Paul and the host of us radio program called holding court and WCCO radio again. Thanks for joining us from my pleasure. Ask you you have as a trial lawyer you've been involved in settlement negotiations before you're not involved at all on this particular case someone if you'd give us the benefit of your experience and kind of outline for us what's likely going on you've got a situation where both sides have to carefully assess what they have to gain and what they have to lose by settlement. I think Laura did a good job of laying it out. But I think in this case the tobacco companies have a lot more to lose than the state does that I think the general consensus is that this is going to be a plaintiff verdict on the richest state in Blue Cross break, but on the otherThe tobacco companies Maine chances in Washington DC. It's not in Minnesota Minnesota one of 50 maybe not 50 but close to fifty states who have sued him in the end there probably will be 50 states who have sued them in the deal here is that a giant verdict is going to cost them an absolute fortune and maybe Scuttle any chance that they have to get a deal in Washington, which is where they're at. And if they got to pay an extra couple billion dollars to get peace and Minnesota. I don't think there's going to be another trial Minnesota handle this case so much differently it so much better.Did any other state in the United States? I think the sum total of all the documents produced in all the tobacco cases in history might be less than 5 600 here. They they they got some around 3 million documents a neighborly open the treasure Trove of the Tobacco Company Secrets. Now everything is changed in the tobacco companies, but not what they want is they want peace all over the United States if you notice their stock in the last couple days went up dramatically with talk of settlement and what's going on in these lawyers. Mine is is is is balancing the ups and downs, but you also got a question who is making the decisions makes Reese's lead attorney but makes Reese's got a client and his clients can run for governor and and Skip Humphreys Got Away, not only the legal considerations, but the political considerations in that someone unusual in that case. You got fairly complex factors, but I'm still betting on settlement even if it looks like right now, there isn't going to be one Ron Rosenbaum a trial lawyer in St. Paul Our Guest today andWhat we want to do really is hear from you today your thoughts and comments and questions and and especially about whether or not there should be a settlement or not in this trial would like to hear from you Twin Cities number is 227-6002 276 thousand a toll-free number is one 800-242-2828 Henry from Apple Valley to the first color Go Ahead Tours Rosenbaum and perhaps I'd ask him to the perhaps discuss the difference between settlement vs. Waiting for a verdict which assuming that it's a plaintiff's verdict for a large amount of money. What effect would the possibility that the tobacco companies could file bankruptcy have on the negotiations are the question about whether or not to try to settle or wait for a big vertically wait and listen to the response what you think basement maybe and his answer what you think about the settler now, okay.There was an issue in Washington. If you remember going back about one of the reasons that settlement didn't go through as a question is who was going to sign at the tobacco companies are mostly owned by bigger companies in the question was who was going to be responsible for the payments. If you have a settlement here a 5 billion dollars over 20 years and it just bear in mind. I don't want to correct Laura but she talked about the planets may not get a verdict of five billion dollars. This is not a 5 billion dollar payment in the settlement. This is a 5 billion dollar payment over 20 years the present value may not be much more than 1.8 or 1.9 billion till you got to decide what number is actually a victory at verdict. But your question about bankruptcy. Everything is potentially negotiable in one of the things that could potentially be negotiable in a settlement is the inability or the that the agreement that the companies won't declare bankruptcy there that has been a tactic remembering the asbestos cases.In the dalkon shield with a h Robins some years ago these companies declare bankruptcy package going on right now with dowel in the breast implant cases. And if there was a verdict mean all bets are off is it companies could do whatever they wanted to do, but I'm sure that this thought in you and you're very you're very insightful even bring it up. I'm sure this thought has occurred to skip Humphrey that settling a case and all the sudden have in the car the company declare bankruptcy and have a trustee decide when payments are going to be made out would not be acceptable cuz you so you can assume these are very sophisticated investigator negotiators on the plane of sight and I've got to believe that that's something that they be willing and in maybe feel necessary to put on the table and there's a lot to consider if they answering to a settlement than it seems like a pretty decent settlement which would cover potential losses the state of Minnesota and then the healthcare industry of hat.Sounds like a good option. However, if in fact they let us go to verdict in the verdict isn't as big as they would like. I believe that would probably set a precedent for other states and it would probably get the tobacco industry a lot of other incentive them to take all the cases to trial rather than try to settle so I think perhaps settlement if the figures large enough is probably the best way to go to sleep not very close. But that's just in commuting to and from work and then I guess I'm not. I have no I don't follow it very closely. Thanks for calling Henry numbers to call here to a comment on whether they should be a settlement or not in the Minnesota. Tobacco. Try would like to hear from you. 227 6000 is the number in the Twin Cities to 276 thousand. The toll free number is one 802-422-8281 ask you about the effective punitive damages. This is a kind of the unknown state.Seeking 1.7 an actual damages punitive damages to tell something about the first of all give us the parameters. What can we be talking about and what effect of those damages have on whether a settlement where did they have a big effect? Because they they will govern the amount of money that makes Reese's going to be working with two of a trial or the amount. They collect in compensatory. What's your actual damages vs. Punitive damages? They don't care. It's still money in your pocket for the state of Minnesota. But you gotta understand what punitive damages are there an amount that the jury is entitled to award based on punishing that's where the word punitive comes from and what the jury gets to hear in this is really pretty incredible the jury gets to hear all of the profits that the tobacco companies have made in order to be able to properly assess an amount that punish an otherwise if they're making a billion dollars judges and then allow me to Ward 20 billion dollars in in. But this is a tremendously profitable industry and so the downside of humorDamages for the tobacco companies is massive. I mean, let's say for example these documents that the jury has seen so anger them which I think is a very real possibility of the tobacco companies have never paid one penny and damages in history, but their documents their dirty linen, if you will have never been revealed until this group of plants every the state of Minnesota led by Mike series, he spent four years trying to unearth those documents and did assuming and we haven't really seen all of them. But but assuming that the jury gets so angry and I think there's no question but that this jury is aware of their place in history. I I think they they do not want to be embarrassed. They want to come back with an intelligent brake. They want to be looked upon the way the OJ Simpson's jury wasn't this also factors into the tobacco companies were playing an away game. This is a Minnesota jury deciding what amount is going to go to the state of Minnesota, which they know is going to affect their own taxes. They can turn around and say, you know,We're going to send a message to the world matches the United States, which of the world we're going to ask 10 billion dollars 15 billion dollars. Now, the United States Supreme Court has basically said if punitive damages can't be unlimited. They have to bear some reasonable relationship to the amount of actual damages. But I think if this jury awarded five six, seven eight nine 10 billion dollars in punitive damages, I don't think the Judge would take it away and I'm not sure reviewing Court would I just think what a message that would send for all the other states in Congress? It's exactly why I think the tobacco companies need to sell a lot of want to get to know me just want to quickly ask. What were the jurors feel cheated by settlement? Yes. Absolutely. They will in no be angry and I'll be unhappy and I don't blame him and everybody I've talked to you. I've been up there a couple times Mysteries and unusually at end of jury, and I don't blame him.All right, very good Sandy from Minneapolis. Go ahead with your comment or question. I would just like to see the judicial process carry through we have put time and money into this and we should let it carry through any any other reason that means you maybe elaborate it's a bit about why you come to that confusing pretty pretty intent on that gets disgusted with all this behind the scene process going on the negotiations. We we put people through the process let it carry forth and let Justice Prevail in that manner.Do Ron to do settlement do settlements? Can can they cause people to wonder about whether or not there was Justice jerk in his case to go to the gym. I guarantee you the adrenaline in Mike's a Reese's veins every inch of him. I mean, it's like going to play in a championship basketball game. You don't want to quit in the third quarter. They want to get this thing and it but but you know it is it's a situation where when your color brings up a very good point she wants to see it go to Justice, but I really wonder how the people the state of Minnesota would feel at. This jury comes back and you never know what a jury is going to do with a zero verdict. I mean in that is it possible? I don't think it's a good possibility, but I'll tell you something never underestimate the ability of juries to surprise lawyers. Do usually the juries are a lot smarter than the lawyers. We're asking listeners today to comment on whether or not they should be a settlement in the Minnesota. Tobacco trial if you have a thought, not a question for mr. Rosenbaum, give us a call to 276 thousand of the Twin Cities number for toll free number outside the metro area one 800-242-2828 John from Cloquet your next tobacco saying Schindler's List, you know, that was a CEO. My name of Amy Schumer was a CEO of a large US tobacco company in the world and he has created a holocaust upon a rock. At least. We hope and pray that our skip are Minnesota Attorney General on Free Will Allow weed the people jury to decide and not allow some agreement. We made behind locked doors. Now my question is if the jury decides force a large sum 6010000000 or whatever. Tobacco companies, Florida to worry about that then go to Tobacco companies appeal and how many quarts put the appeals go through how long into the future called the speed bubblegum stretched out all the way may be the Supreme Court. Rosenbaum. What does collar on my show ideas assuming there is a verdict this size number one that never precludes a settlement there such a thing as post-verdict settlement time. You can settle all the way to the time the case is ended so you can have a settlement 3 years down the road but assuming there's no settlement in the case goes to verdict their route would be through and they bring motions to the trial judge to reverse his own decisions that may get to go to the Minnesota court of appeals then they go to the Minnesota Supreme Court. Ask no guarantee, but they ask for something called a writ of cert to the United States Supreme Court in this case because of the sort of immensity and the importance in the voluminous number of documents. And whenever you could easily be talking about 3 or 4 years and and that's assuming there's no reversal. If there's a reversal you could have three or four years in the whole thing could come back and be tried again cuz it doesn't ask you a question. We let him go there but I'm sure it did see it's going to Janet in St. Louis Park. I Jenna the verdict come I think it said tobacco companies over last 10 years have demonstrated very clearly. They're their ability in the courtroom to settle but I would really like to see if they ask you how close you followed the trial. Addiction for years and I think a lot of information that has come out has shown that they really have been very deceptive to the public even though information in the last 20 years has been available. If I look at my father's generation who would now be probably 70 or 75 years old didn't know about all those hazards when he started and I think those organizations are liable for that, Thanks Janet. She brings up a good point but you gotta understand every every lawyer in that courtroom, at least the plaintiffs lawyers want this to go to Verdugo. I guarantee of make sure he's he doesn't want to settle this case at this point, but you got a bear in mind that those decisions are not going to be made by the lawyers. Every one of those lawyers has a client who's calling the shots and contrary to a lot of people think in the best of all Worlds the lawyers work for the clients not the class working for the lawyers. Wright's upbringing Fred a car phone died Fred you're coming a question about what I see is the morality of the whole concept. We are we've got politicians are salivating over how to spend all this wonderful money. We're going to get where we're encouraging the tobacco company to sell Lotto tobacco. They can't pay it because tell a lot of tobacco and it when we just can't wait to get our hands on the money. We how many kids we going to have to kill with that and what about the government itself? I mean how much money does the government make on taxes do they not know what's going on? And why are they be held harmless? So I guess the larger question is why we so happy with the settlement. First of all, I'd hate to have it said I like to see according to the court system. But why we doing anything that would encourage the tobacco companies. Okay and Frederick, are you been watching the trial pretty closely or thanks. I love with Fred had to say because a lot of people are critical of the whole thing saying basically got one co-conspirators who won another the state of Minnesota is profited in the form of taxes and other things from tobacco really from the beginning and you never know that could be an X Factor with the jury. You know, it it's a situation where I'm really getting the sense from your callers that they feel up the way that most people I know do to that. They really like to see this case go to verdict that I think a lot of people would I still betting that it's not going to go but I think it's interesting that the people who could automatically have a certain amount of money and probably have some tax reduction are still willing to roll a dice that I like. All right, and just remind her number is here to a way in and whether or not you think that should be a settlement in the Minnesota. Tobacco trial to 276 thousand in the Twin Cities to 276 thousand a toll-free number is one 800-242-2828. I let spring and Jane from Eden Prairie. I see of this but I have a question for the attorney and that is that usually wouldn't it be a strategy to settle before all the documentation was released in court. And now that the tobacco companies have been forced to release all these documents what interest would they have an in settling? I mean there be no no Advantage for them. I mean, is there any advantage for them to a good question and hang on the line? I want to ask you about it wasn't like they should be a settler in that situation here and then you got a politician. Who's calling the shots? And I think that there was no way that Hubert Humphrey was ever going to be able to settle this case without these documents being released that was one of his condition and I believe this case it's only been about money would have been such a long time ago, but Hubert Humphrey is running for office and he made very clear that these documents have got to get out and a half of what he was looking for in my opinion were the political games of getting these things out in and you know, you talked about the morality you talk about all the rest. I mean to this there will be books written about this case. There's no Purity and goodness on on any of the side to nobody's all good. Nobody's all evil even though that's the way a lot of people want to paint it our guests in the studio. Today is Ron Rosenbaum. He is at y a lawyer in St. Paul and host of the WCCO radio program holding Court, what we're doing on midday today is that taking your calls your comments and questions about the Minnesota. Tobacco trial specifically whether or not there should be a settlement. Reports of settlement talks and a few of one away in today on whether or not the state you settle give us a call at 227-6000 and the Twin Cities one. 800-242-2828 is the toll free number will get two more calls in just a moment this week on Minnesota Public Radio Beyond Affliction the disability history project. You're welcome to a person in a wheelchair. What do you do to stand there and look how is it? Okay to bend down most of the able-bodied people have no clue on how to deal with disabled people or a series of documentaries and calling the attitudes and experiences that have shaped the lives of people with disabilities. That's this week on Minnesota Public Radio k n o w FM 91.1 in the Twin Cities in a four-part series of documentaries on the history of disability and this country called Beyond Affliction coming up a noon today as part of our midday broadcast. Today's installment is titled the overdue Revolution and asks the key question. Like what is a disability and who has one that's coming up a noon today here on midday business and economic reporting on NPR is supported by the law firm of Larkin Hoffman Daley and Lindgren solving problems and creating opportunities for business and individuals quick look at the forecast for the state of Minnesota today for Northwestern. Minnesota will have mostly cloudy skies and a chance of mainly afternoon showers otherwise should be probably to mostly sunny high temperatures for the upper 60s in the far north and between 80 and 85 degrees in western and southern Minnesota tonight showers likely in the far Northwest just a chance of showers and thunderstorms in the rest of Western and far Southeastern Minnesota close tonight from the lower 40s near Thief River Falls near 50 in Rochester tomorrow a bit cooler actually quite a bit cooler most locations Heist tomorrow mainly in the 60s partly cloudy skies in the arrowhead Cloudy Skies elsewhere with a chance for some showers for the Twin Cities today revised. I now have 80 to 85 Degrees a Southeast wind 10 to 20 miles per hour Sunshine all day partly cloudy tonight a little red around fifty and then tomorrow mostly cloudy skies 40% chance of showers and a high in the upper 60s the last report of the Twin Cities 69 degrees and mostly sunny skies Sunny Sky. It is 26 and 1/2 minutes before 12 noon. You were listening to mid-day on Minnesota Public Radio. Finelli in today for Theory eichten during this hour. We are talking about whether or not there should be a settlement in the Minnesota. Tobacco trial if you'd like to a call with your comment or ask a question of our guests Ron Rosenbaum a trial lawyer in St. Paul and a host of a radio program called holding Court in WCCO radio. Give us a call to 276 thousand in the Twin Cities or one 800-242-2828 Mike from Saint Paul has been holding that sell bring you in by Mike good morning. One of the things that bothers me about this is that the documents show a clear pattern of Abuse by the attorneys by the law firms that we're working for the tobacco companies. There was a document destruction. The judge said there was crime and fraud. The lawyers were telling the scientist what research they should do and what they should destroy and you know, these guys are going to get laid off the hook. There's a there's a they're giving a monopoly in society to to be attorneys, but one of the responsibilities they have is living by their the rules of professional responsibility and they broke in just about every one of my think I don't think that the Minnesota the organization that monitors this is going to do anything. I don't think the court will do anything and when there's a settlement will basically be told you could this is okay you can do whatever you want to get your client off. You know, what you can you can do this sort of thing for years and we're not going to do anything about it. And I think that a settlement doesn't address that really important issue because these guys were basically enabling the tobacco companies to do what they did for so many years you have no doubt there will be a settlement. I think it's it's that says something that they'll need to negotiate. They probably I don't know if they'll be a settle. You're not but whether there's a settlement or not, you know, what even is going to a jury is a form of a settlement away. All right, Mike. Thanks very much settlement. Minnesota will not solve the problem for the tobacco lawyers of whatever fraud a crime they may have committed. There are grand juries around the United States investigating that there. Is there a Senate and House committees looking into it and whatever settlement is entered into here is not going to take care of that problem. So if you bring up a good point, but even if the state of Minnesota wanted to give immunity to those lawyers, they can't do it. Thank goodness that that will hopefully be dealt with within a different context by criminal investigators and perhaps people looking into professional responsibility matters dealing with lawyers Russell Minneapolis. Go ahead. I think the question of whether or not there should be a settlement pretty relies upon that pretty much relies upon how the money is paid. Being paid over a. Of 25 years if my just rough calculations are correct is is comprable to a billion dollar settlement earning interest up about 6% compounded over 25 years, then you'll arrive at your 5 billion dollars, but the state is it actually the state that ends up to a billion something to the attorneys. What where it where it where is this 5 billion dollars that they're talking about that. It's it's accumulated interest me with maybe pays a billion and wait for that money to accumulate over 25 years and they're off the hook for a billion bucks. So it's all settled on clear. Okay, I will ask around to Ron and then we'll ask him maybe a few if that helps you and your decision, but you think they should be should happen. But maybe you've seen something. I haven't put that the key to how much this is worth is how much is going to be paid on day one of the five billion if no money is being paid but you got 5 billion paid out over 20 years. That's one thing but my guess is in Mike's arisi is no fool. Mike Cerise. He's going to get a big downside there. He's probably going to get to three billion dollars in that settlement paid on day one in which case the present value of that settlement going to be a lot more than the 1.7 billion dollar that they were asking for in the first place. I think that that you have to bear that my other the number I've heard for attorneys fees was never a billion dollars. It's it's the number that under their contingency agreement they're entitled to is 25% and that will they'll have to present value the worth of this settlement and I can Assure you that the case is settled it's going to be a heck of a lot more than a present value of 1 billion the rest. Would you rather see it go to jury or a settlement for that money is if you could do as well find government bonds or thanks very much for calling Twin Cities number is 227-6102 for 22828 is the toll free number Donna vagina your next good morning. Good morning. I don't believe in sport law. So I don't care about the egocentricity of jury Hubert Humphrey represent people of Minnesota. He's certainly within our legal process is obviously he's doing an excellent job. Negotiations is apart of the legal process of very very important part of it. So like all this talk about. Well, I'd like to see it go to the jury and after all they've sat there a long time lot of egocentricity involved and I call that sport. Blonde and not supported by but I think the people who are directly involved with the negotiations probably have more fact subtleties at their fingertips than do and does the jury. I think the door at the jury has been at an admirable job hanging in there and I think they could come up with a good decision, but I don't distrust the negotiation process at all. I just want to make that statement. Thank you very much. Thanks very much. To 276 thousand in the Twin Cities are the toll free number is one 800-242-2828 Pamela from Iron. Go ahead. My dad died last summer from lung cancer and it's about 2 weeks before he died. He told me he just didn't really think the cigarettes really had anything to do with it because he was so ill-informed and in such denial. I work at a pretty unskilled job in the people at my job. Don't listen to NPR. I'm the one who brings in the news and I would like to go to trial because it'll be publicized not only Radio stations like this one, but the more and more I really accessible media to my compassionate to work and I would like that because it'll are the dirty linen. The people will be giving me information. They can't I mean, I don't know where to find those documents and I don't have a computer but it'll bring all of the topical things here that people can actually follow through the main news sources and they'll be able to get the information we need and that's why I don't think that's a bad company wanted to go to trial because if people actually see and realize and go through this trial they're going to understand what's really going on and they're going to have a real problem with the people of the whole country because people are going to be very angry. This information drug is very important to everybody so you think it was 2276 dollars in the Twin Cities number one 800-242-2828. We are asking folks to call in today with their opinion on whether or not there should be a settlement or not in the Minnesota. Tobacco trial. Give us a call Tina from having your next. Yes. I would like to see this go to the jury for several different reasons. I have not that I've distrustful of the settlement that they would come up with. I have no doubt that it would be a good one for Minnesota. I believe in the what the caller said before that that I think that if it goes to the jury you'll get more publicity about what actually went on and and then they're trying to cover up their their research. Okay. I have never smoked but I will say I've always known that smoking was bad for you and that it would cause problems since I've been 11 years old. I've known that I can't believe that anybody that smoke didn't know that not to say that I don't feel sorry for people that smoked and receiving all had a lung disease or cancer or whatever else but to blame somebody else for something of decision that you made I have a hard time dealing with anybody that says I didn't know smoking was bad for you is in total denial and always has been but most people that smoke are in total. Denial should be a settlement or go to the gym. I think I should be no settlement. I think I should go to the jury and her two reasons one that is that I believe that to Jerry the people have a right to be heard all the way to the end to make a decision because that is our legal system. And I believe that they will be honest and come up with a good settlement for the for Minnesota to have trouble with that run yet. You know she brings up what I thought the defense in this case was going to because I think it's a very strong defense the tobacco companies always had available to them the defense of pushing. Come on. Give me a break people known for 35 years is 4050 years a Surgeon General report came out in 1964. Everybody has a right to be sort of a stupid as they want to be in the society. We believe in Independence the promise they put their own CEOs on the standard said you don't we're just not convinced that there's a connection between smoking and cancer. Thereby making it almost impossible for me to tell the jury everybody knows this is ridiculous. I think it was a major mistake Dan from Burnsville. Go ahead just like the comment that I too would like to see it go to a verdict. I think we all Understand the advantage of a settlement in that of course is that there's a guaranteed pay off to the attorneys and a guaranteed pay off to the state and that way we do avoid the risk of the outcome of the trial. But again, the settlement allows the tobacco companies to use their billions of dollars in profits to deflect the process another prosecution, which they've been doing success to 8:40 or so years. So I'd like to see one salad prosecution on their record of the deflecting successfully prosecution after prosecution attempt for for an unbelievably long. Of time. I'd also like to say that I understand that people need to be responsible for their behavior, but I think you're you're just made a very good point that there's been a huge Pro. Tobacco Lobby going on that has been countering all of the claims by the government and the states that is bad for you. Call Rodney when I asked you about do we don't talk much about the judge very much the center of this trial. What about the influence of some of the comments that judge Kenneth Fitzpatrick has made tobacco companies have claimed is bias. During the trial but I'm worried about the effect of his comments on the jury jury. He's always take their cues from the judge which is why lawyers are so concerned about the way the judge deals with the case. I mean when you're a lawyer you're fighting for a side and you've always got another side and hopefully that balances itself out the jury. He's got a pretty good eye at deciding who's doing what but juries are always looking for the neutral of thority figure in the courtroom. And that's always the judge and I think that's a major X Factory or not. I would be very surprised if that doesn't factor into the what I think is the other Terror by the tobacco company to this case going to the jury we have about 10 minutes left. We do have time for four more calls. So I do I do give us a call at 2 to 7/6 thousand in the Twin Cities one 802-422-8282 away in on whether or not there should be a settlement in the Minnesota. Tobacco trial Chris from Minneapolis. Go ahead. I believe there should not be a settlement. I think tobacco companies are deathly afraid like Ron just said of this going to a jury because if I'm not mistaken, Ron this could set up a precedent where the government might introduce legislation toward the way tobacco companies do business because there has been a pattern of deception and more importantly. This is a major public health hazard. Yeah, your color brings up. She's absolutely correct time in the dots the terror here on their part of the tobacco companies. This case is being watched all over the world. These are giant in very profitable companies. And if this jury comes back as they might well do with a runaway verdict. I'll tell you a whole no politician is going to be able to support the tobacco companies in Washington and it's katie-bar-the-door in terms of what might happen to these corporations Vincent for Minnetonka your question or comment Nazism and I definitely think it should go to a verdict for a number of reasons. I found all of which are bad for the young companies. I'll come back with a with a positive but also been mentioning on that the state would benefit tax. There is wood would benefit by putting money in their pockets could explain exactly how that would happen. Well, I'll try I'm not a legislator but but let's assume for argument's sake that there's a 5 billion dollar verdict or two and a half billion dollar or 5 billion dollar settlement of two and a half billion dollar verdict that money is not going to outer space. I mean that money is going straight to the state and the legislators are going to have to decide how it gets divided up. It's not Hubert Humphrey's money. It's the state of Minnesota taxpayers and I got to believe with a windfall like that. There's going to be anti-tobacco programs was going to be all kinds of health problems. But there's also going to be a heck of a lot of money left over to to go towards tax relief and in politicians being what they are. Everybody's going to want to claim credit for that and I'd be surprised if it doesn't affect the taxpayers directly John in Prior Lake. Go ahead. Well, I'm totally opposed to the entire idea for anyone to say that they didn't know smoking was dangerous is incredibly naive stupid that at least and to say that you're also stupid enough to trust tobacco companies to be comes to be forthright about what they told you about. Their product is equally stupid. I mean the majority of people don't smoke 75% Ralph's light smoking rates are increasing slightly among young people smoking rates will continue to increase regardless of the outcome of this particular legal event. And as far as the taxes go the last thing in the world the dfl actually rather see it go to the jury because there's that one in 100 chance to dream Ashley wake up and say this is the third and come in with an s That great. Thank you. Let's go to friend Duluth High. Go ahead Fred. believe that they had a case to You should have took him to court. I think that the cigarette manufacturers obviously, it's some issues but I feel that we've been warned all along that this cigarette smoking is bad. So to take a chance with the jury then or what do you think? I think that's Very well if if they're forthright and honest, I think that they should be acquitted. But I ended the colors got he raises the point that I think it is the one I raised earlier about the fact that I think there was a strong defense available. I think a lot of people feel the way he did that everybody knew tobacco was it was dangerous? Theoretically that wasn't the issue the issue was that there was secret information on addiction that they weren't passing on and that they were targeting children who did not have the ability to make those kinds of decisions. But in all honesty the real case was that cigarette smoking causes damage in the real defense. Was that everybody knew and therefore the Tobacco Company shouldn't be responsible. But in any event, we're now in a situation where the jury's going to get the Kaiser is going to be settled. So in a way whether he took it or not, as old news Tina from St.Paul go ahead cuz they haven't really work on a long time to do this. I don't think would be fair to them if they came up with the settlement, you know, I mean, it's just not fair you sit there for three and a half months. Send has been ongoing and say that I think that we should be able to trust attorney general. Skip Humphrey to do the right thing only. Skip is he in the 2900 documents and that are secretive that the tobacco companies have hidden from the American public that are fraudulent and have to see the American public and I think we should trust attorney general to do the right thing. I mean, I I fully do and I think that he will come through for the taxpayers and come through for the kids in the state and I don't think he will compromise his principles regardless of what he decides to do. Spring in brine in a car phone Brian. I do think it should go to the to the jury for your decision. I hope the jury will come to their senses to make the right decision which is to find against the state. But even if they don't even if they make the wrong decision, it will go to a peel and we will finally get a decision. If they settle it will never have a decision and that's what we need to do is finalized the issue finalize the law and instead of inventing laws we go let the law of laws that are on the books decide the case Judy and Minneapolis. Maybe it will time for your call. Go ahead and I'm very concerned about the public health aspect of this and I'm not sure whether I wanted to go to a settlement or to a jury verdict until I know whether what Leverage is there in both ways for there to be some action towards the Tobacco Company. We're really targeting children and gym in Wisconsin. I think you're going to get the last word. Go ahead. November is if he gets a guilty verdict from the jury, thank you since you were so brief we got time for more eye Gary from Minneapolis. Go ahead. If they've thought about the long-term goal of this all of this is to get people to quit smoking and if they succeed on the other hand when people start living like 5 and 10 years longer what's going to be the ramifications for like Medicare and for all these people that have have to be a nursing home for Jerry Ward. Erase think there should be a settlement. Okay. Thanks so much for your call. Call Rana we run out of time by thanks to all the colors today who called in the Ron Rosenbaum. Thanks so much for coming in today and my pleasure change your activation. We've been talking to last an hour about whether or not to Minnesota should settle in the tobacco Trail or in the Minnesota. Tobacco. Try whether not there should be a settlement at all. And it was nice to hear from all of you. Thanks so much. Ron Rosenbaum a trial lawyer in St. Paul host of WCCO radio is holding court and I appreciate your again you coming in today? It is now a six and a half minutes before 12 noon. I'm Ray Suarez rioting in Indonesia over soaring gas and transportation cost could derail the country's economic bailout package. The big issue for the administration is to hope that the regime can deal with signs of dissent in a fashion. That doesn't become brutal Georgetown Professor James clad will look at Indonesia's problems and prospects for democratic reform on the next Talk of the Nation from NPR news. Anderson for Talk of the Nation this afternoon beginning at 1 right here in Minnesota Public Radio Garrison Keillor