A friend of mine at the American Enterprise Institute observed. He said never had such a moderate book attracted such an amount of response. The problem is if I try to describe the book as it exists, there is a problem of saying well as this man backing away from all these things. We know he and Richard Herrnstein said not. Do you want to take these first 15-20 minutes tonight? To tell you what Richard Herrnstein and I had in mind to tell you why we wrote the book and to tell you what we thought was important about the book. And in that sense of things race has a very low place. What kind Stein and I at the time we wrote the book and I still feel tonight sticker and sign died last September. That the United States of America is in grave danger of seeing an end to a free society as we have wanted it to exist within certainly the lifetime of my children and very possibly within my own Lifetime and that it is impossible to understand the Dynamics that are creating these dangers and less one also understands the role that cognitive ability intelligence IQ, but you will is playing in some very powerful division forces of a Kind the society has never had to face before and that's what I'm going to talk about in this initial. Now. I know the doctor pissant will be raising other issues involving race and I will be glad to talk about those two throughout the course of the evening and into the questions, but let's start out with what the bell curve is about. First point to be made is that race is certainly at the center of the American psyche. That much is apparent to me is too many other people and has been throughout our history. But is less obvious that race is not at the center of America's destinies. Even in an age when we talk about a Multicultural Society in which the United States certainly is becoming more of it remains true that as of 1995 upwards of 75% of the American population consists of non-latino whites. About 13% of the population consists of African-Americans with the balance being made up predominantly of Latinos and Asians. Now in that kind of setting what happens to the white population is extremely important and what happens to the United States of America. That's one of the reasons that Richard Herrnstein and I spend the first the second part of the book eight chapters in all detailing the relationship of intelligence to a wide range of social behaviors limiting the sample to non-latino White unless you have read the book you would have a very hard time knowing that those eight chapters existed. They are virtually never met never mentioned, but it is in those chapters and the chapters that precede even those where we talked about two phenomena that are going on at opposite ends of American society. Let me talk first about the emergence of a cognitive Elite the proposition very simply. Is that a combination of a revolution in higher education? The Revolution and occupations + changes in the economy. Are creating and indeed already have created a cognitive Elite consisting of people way out at the Right End tale of the bell curve of intelligence many prospective members of the cognitive Elite sit in this audience tonight. What happened may be described very simply and quickly during the 1950's for reasons that different sign and I do not fully understand either now America's higher educational system under what a revolution It went from being a place where the elite colleges serve predominantly a rich population of students with a few smart kids in it to being a set of colleges which survey very smart set of students with a few rich kids in it. The best example is Harvard itself for which we have SAT scores going back to 1952 and 1952. The mean sat verbal then coming Harvard freshman was 583. Not bad. Not really anything to write home about with in just eight years. The mean sat verbal of incoming Harvard freshman was about 680. There was a full standard deviation shift upward in the course of only eight years in the same thing was going on at Carleton as well along with the rest of the higher education system. In addition to that of a variety of Economic and occupational Trends during the same. Of time was creating first a whole lot more occupations that are screened for high IQ. You might say what you wish as to what it is that is goes into this thing called IQ, but I'll tell you this much unless you have the kinds of skills that enable you to score pretty well in the IQ test you are not going to be a first-rate lawyer. You are not going to be a first-rate physician. You aren't going to be a first-rate professor. You aren't going to be a first-rate a lot of things in the society which are increasingly in demand and increasingly lucrative and this brings another road. I'm an aunt that I make this very important. The bear and that is the brains are lots more valuable than they used to be my favorite example of this involves a peculiar kind of high IQ that let somebody be very good at mathematics. But this person let's say doesn't really have any business sense as absent-minded does not have a whole bunch of other qualities that would enable this person to prosper in a world where he had to be an entrepreneur well in the past this kind of person would mainly find a job as with apologies to professors a mathematics or maybe in the hall as a professor of mathematics there weren't that many other jobs in the society that that called for that Arcane kind of skill the same kind of skill today commence six-figure salaries for all sorts of reasons. There are pure mathematicians working in Wall Street firms. There are people with mathematics skills who also turn out to be real good computer programmers getting six-figure salaries in Silicon Valley. It's it's a specific example of which is that You have brains in 1995 and even more so in the future is also to have a value in the marketplace. You did not have result. I'm going to have to go through a lot of this very quickly and in the state the result is that you have a kind of axis that is developing an American society that cuts across the traditional left-right political divisions or any other kind of idiot logical divisions and consists of real smart people generally quite affluent people and people who have also risen to Great positions of great power throughout the society. At the same time that that is going on. You have had something going on at the opposite end of society just as troubling. When I say the opposite end, I want to stress that point it is easy. I think for people when they talk about these issues intelligence to think. Well, we had this linear scorecard on which were measuring people and you got started out very low IQ, which means bad and you go to very high IQ, which means good in terms of certain kinds of outcomes wizard of linear changes in between. I do not think that's the way the process works the data on this issue are equivocal many times, but I think it's fair to say overall. The pattern is that the problems associated with low IQ show up pretty far down at the extreme of the bell curve that in fact the vast majority of people in the fat part of that curve are plenty smart enough to do all the things that are necessary to be a success and their families in their jobs in the rest of it. So we're talking about a limited part of society. But none the less a limited part of society which can create enormous stress has on the rest of society. Once again, I am not talking at this point about blacks were about any other minority. I am talking about whites and specifically non-latino White and the simple statement. Is this that if you take a look at the relationship between socioeconomic status and intelligence and other factors as they bear on such crucial social problems as poverty unemployment out-of-wedlock births High School dropouts, she can go through the list. The relationship is not only Strong by the standards of the social sciences. It is quite remarkably strong strong not in. It's just a statistically significant sense, which is certainly is the strong also in a substitute sense. So if you are talking about the degree to which a variety of social problems are concentrated in the lowest IQ segments of the society you are talking about major concentrations. We're by the odds of for example of your non-latino white male going to jail. Are about 17 times greater. If you have an IQ of 880 then if you have an IQ of 120, haha, but isn't it true that maybe that's this confounded with the fact that these white males in jail came from poor socio-economic background. If in a multivariate analysis, you take a look at that relationship. Guess what once you hold IQ constant the role of socioeconomic status virtually evaporates not hear you actually have to take a look at the book. We're actually with regard to everything I'm saying tonight. You really ought to take a look at the book, but specifically here you have to take a look at the book because the relationship the independent relationship social problems after taking I too cute into account various, there are some issues for example on which socioeconomic status continues to have a very large independent roll. There are others in which the role of socioeconomic status once you control for IQ. Not only disappear as it goes the wrong way. 1 however, make this generalization. After holding, so so we can Onyx state is constant. The independent role of IQ is attenuated hardly at all and often not at all. What this means for America's future. I think is presaged by what has happened in the black community because now we're talkin about things that don't necessarily have anything to do with IQ, but do have to do with powerful forces at work in the way America stratified cell. William Julius Wilson the sociologist in the University of Chicago wrote a book called The truly disadvantaged in which he Advanced a thesis which is since commanded a lot of attention and equivocal support. But but certainly a fair amount of support saying in effect that a lot of the problems of the black Intercity. We're at least exacerbated and maybe even created by a massive Exodus of the black middle class after the triumphs of the Civil Rights Movement. A similar kind of thing is going on in White America. It is not as obvious. It's not as sudden. It's not as drastic and White America as it was in Black America, but it's happening and the two authors of this book are prime examples. The current Stein's father was an immigrant Hungarian house painter with a high IQ. I'm quite sure but he was a house painter deck Herrnstein was a professor at Harvard his children are and astrophysicists and a Management Consultant. My father was a poor boy from a poor farm family. He had a high IQ. Only graduated from high school is children went on to college and their children are going on to college. You have at the you have a kind of invisible migration that has taken place throughout American society white society in which an awful lot of the talent has left. The farm has left the small town has left the low income working class community and found its way into that more affluent circles. This is good and $0.01. It's what the American dream is supposed to be all about. It has a downside. The downside is not found in as I say the middle ranges of society. It's not found in solid working-class communities which still have plenty of cohesion in many ways are there to a much healthier than the rich suburbs? It is found in the forest white parts of town where crime out-of-wedlock births all of the things which we have in the past associated with the black underclass are becoming more. I'll probably want some of you may be aware not just for the bell curve, which I wrote that also the book. Call Doug Sidney. Also an article called the emerging White underclass. It was prompted by picking up the latest issue of natality statistics and seeing that the ratio of births out of wedlock for whites was just about the same place where it had been for blacks. When did Patrick Daniel Moynihan wrote his famous monograph about the breakdown of the black family. And the proposition is there is no reason to think that when you concentrate single-parent families within a community as has happened and is happening both of my black Cinema on white that whites are going to be any more successful in the wrong long run at escaping the debilitating effects of that kind of phenomenon even now yours, I guess the only statistic I'm going to pass out tonight except for the one about SAT scores if you take the national longitudinal study of Youth And take a look at all the whites non-latino women who were poor in the year prior to birth. So the birds didn't cause the poverty poor in the year prior to birth 44% of their births are out of wedlock compared to 6% for white non-latino women anywhere above the poverty line. This is a problem for reasons that I have described in detail and other kinds of Publications, but I will summarize it very briefly by saying this when Patrick Daniel Moynihan said as a young assistant labor secretary in 1964 that any Community which law allows large numbers of its young males to grow up unsocialized by adult males asks for and gets chaos. He was right. And when you have large numbers of white males growing up on socialize by adult males behaving responsibly. We are going to see and are seeing already the same phenomena seeing the black underclass. This is a problem because of the brutal arithmetic. Whereby you have about six times as many white people as you do black people. I asked you to contemplate for a moment what the effects are likely to be if you got crime rates in low-income white communities that are equivalent to crime rates in low-income black communities think of the degree of hostility anxiety the over reactions that are produced by what we now call black crime and try to extrapolate that what the society is going to be like if you have six times that amount of crime happening and there are number of very responsible statisticians or projecting just that kind of increase At the same time that this is going on at the low end of the white Community. Remember this cognitive Elite not there. If you are affluent that if you are powerful and if you are satisfied with your life and all these kinds of external ways, let me tell you the attitude you are most likely to have toward the underclass. It is not to get rid of the welfare system more to do any of the other things which have been driven by a largely middle-class movement in the most recent election the impulse. Is that pay somebody to take care of these problems. Pay if to take care of them with the with me if you can possibly do so by solving them but in any case keep these people out of my hair that is the prevailing attitude on the wealthy among the powerful that is an attitude which I am afraid as a white Under classic bands is going to be increasingly abrupt and demanding and it's going to happen. We can take a look at all kinds of signs right now whether they are gated communities whether they are the concierge at the fancy condominium where they where they are all the ways in which wealthy people are buying out of America systems as they exist right now. But what I am supposed to jesting he's not saying my time is up. He's telling me I've got two more minutes to go. What this portends as far as I can see I was wrong as the current Scott-Heron Stein could see is the prospect of what we called the custodial state. By custodial State we mean an attempt by the people who have the power and have the money. To treat a significant portion of the population as Wards of the state. The metaphor that we use is a high-tech Indian Reservation. We spend lots of money on Indians American Indians. If you count the money we spend per Head Indian reservations are absolutely awful places as well. So it's not necessarily were going to cut budgets. We will throw a lots of food and blankets and medicine over the wall, but we will make a wall. The current sign and I are often characterized as being conservatives or worse. In fact, I would say that we were both very devoted to what we see is a Jeffersonian ideal of a free Society on free people living out their lives running around lives. We also were keenly aware of all the ways in which that critically depends on a shared Assumption of participation and worth and dignity that we see threatened by the trends that we have described. in so far as what I've just said to you does not sound like the bell curve you've heard about I can only suggest that I have described the bell curve that is My point is not to persuade you the dick ernstine are rights on every Jetson tits and bottle of the of the text of the book. But if I do nothing else this evening, I hope to convince you that the questions we raise are crucially important. Thank you. I was just saying to a child that he didn't mention anything about and about the unit in heritability of IQ. That's what its whole book is is that a high IQ is inherited 40% IQ 60% genetic and 60% environmental but throughout the book he kind of treats. These are so call her edibility component as rather fix. What's very depressing about that book is it says that your IQ by and large is determined at Birth and is very little that you can do about it in terms of the environment and terms of compensatory programs education that that's relatively fixed. I think that's the relative. That's the very controversial part of your book Charles and I That you're not really telling about the bell curve. If you avoid discussing that particularly crucial element because that's also where the racial conflict comes in as well that that is at the book presents to its audience the fact that black Americans have a low IQ, which is presume to be mostly in some way and in inherited that they have an average IQ of 85 and that whites have an average IQ of 100. This isn't some way primarily related to genetics. First of all, let me say a number of things we are used to accepting the idea about you and I don't know what you think alike IQ means but according to the bell curve. Dr. Mary says the IQ means intelligence that means you're Which is which is fixed and unchangeable after you take that IQ test whatever that IQ test is also. That the test that they used to administer that is to decide what you intelligence is ook unbiased and the ballot and reliable and song. There's no question or argument of Anna plus a lot of the day that he uses in his book are not related to eye to the so-called classic IQ test but other kinds of tests administered by the the Army which makes up a lot of his Brook SAT scores and so on. I think the thing about the bell curve that most disturbs me is that there was a strong implication that IQ can predict all all kinds of things about people that the low IQ fit people gif to the bottom and a high IQ people get skip to the top and we have have a meritocracy and that's the way it's going to be and there's not much we can do about it to any social programming. That's the key and when he talked It's about the people at the bottom being put on reservations or being somehow kept in that place are dealt with what is he talking about? And are we talkin about trying to elevate people in various ways to be part of society. Are we talkin about excluding them not let me just say a few things about the methodology of the bell curve. First of all, its comparisons of IQs of blacks and whites the whole things on scientific. Okay, it's unscientific and let me let me tell you why first of all. Mary himself recognizes that he's on Shaky Ground to use the word race night. He knows he's on shaky the Anthropologist will get them to use at work. So he regards to the word ethnicity uses. I'm going to compare ethnicities now. What's an ethnicity? So he takes blacks all and all of the previous research is a take blacks and call it an ethnicity comparing to another ethnicity whites and will wear what are the what are the genetic factors in ethnicity that determine isn't that a function and part of culture and a whole lot of other things if he's if if they going to make statements about black IQ on average being this and white IQ on average with this big Jess conglomeration of mixtures is not very scientific. First of all, what is the definition of a black person? What is the definition of a black person in America, most of the black people in America are mixed with white people? So when they say they're comparing whites to blacks what what kind of scientific comparison is that? That that's not really a scientific comparison in the book Mary States. I asked very well he states in the book, but we also discuss it how How did you decide someone was black or not? And he says to self disclosure. That is anybody who said they were black he put in heat if they go in the black not just marry, but the people of done this research in the past like Jensen and the rest of them they take anyone who is Black will you know when America a black person as defined by having any black ancestry? Right. Did you all understand that that is anybody in this room put that has black ancestry will be considered a black person in America. So he's preparing a whole mixture of people with another mixture people and then coming up with group Norms. Let me say the other other thing about the whole study and approach on this fits very very unscientific. If you're doing if you're making a comparison between groups of people that supposed to be matching pairs. So I don't accept any of this data that they're presenting because They don't have matching pair. What do I mean by that if they wanted if it's scientifically they wanted to compare? So-called genetic differences between blacks and whites. Then they would have to take a group of white people that had similar experiences to Black Americans here in America. That is I would have to find a group of white people that experience 250 Years of Slavery 100 Years of Jim Crow segregation constant ongoing discrimination and let's compare their IQs and see how they come out on these tests because remember during slavery 250 years of it blocks were forbidden by law that teach each other how to read and write so this was intergenerational over 250 years. Of not being able to pass down literacy. Discontinued thereafter after the Civil War with Jim Crow segregation and inferior education again passed down family the family. That part the environmental effects on blacks has been enormous and also on many other people from different ethnic backgrounds. If you can't find a group to match that then the validity of comparison comparing IQs by group is just a bunch of bunch of nonsense as far as I'm concerned. I also feel that is true about so-called twin studies say they have twin studies which a site where you could take two twins monozygotic twins and you separate them and they still turn out to have the same IQ, which is supposed to be an argument for the internet made then heritability about you with little kind of variance because of the environment. Well again, that's a little bit faulty if you use it as an argument to support the comparisons you make me tween white and blacks the less you going to have a pair of Bona zygotic twins one white and one black and let him grow up in the society and let's see how it comes out. Do you want to see it? They can't do that kind of study. But also it's a fact. That these studies in order to to Really push the issue of the heritability of argument. That the twins would have to be living in different environments that were relatively extreme not similar environments, even though they were separated. You understand what I'm saying? Another word you could you would you would need one living in an environment where they were very poor they didn't have access to education that the families they were living. It will not educated. Then you would have to have the other twin perhaps living with a very affluent educated family and then measure that I choose and let's see if they come out to be similar. Do you understand what I'm saying? They have not had that type of data to make that those comparisons ballot in terms of of scientific validity by By suggesting say he's also the book also suggest because of these differences in black and white IQ and that somehow you have a low IQ, you're going to be be Doom you're going to be at the bottom and social programs on help that a lot of those people who he's thinking might be taking care of custodial e which I don't know quite what that means or maybe on reservations allow them going to be like she knows a lot more going to be black. So I'm sure a lot of them were going to be a pool pool wipes, but it's that argument supposes a play sound the effect the very powerful effect of the environment on the development of IQ. Now. Let me tell you what an IQ test is No, first of all, there's an argument out there that these these tests do not measure intelligence in the first place. So some of the premises of the book of arguable on the face of it. A lot of psychologists will tell you that those tests. Do not measure whatever intelligences. What they measure is at the time that you take the test is how well you are informed in a lot of Eric so that it is it is set up for children from poor backgrounds Louis social life with background parents are not educated not to do as well as on those tests. It's also been shown through Head Start programs that if you if you give children and a very nurturing enriched environment that the IQs actually will go up, but then they disappear. But in the book they suggest other suggest. I don't know if it's this is in the book Charles that somehow the loss of these IQ points in black kids after Head Start is more of an indication or support for the for the fact that inheritance is very very important. You see now to me it means that the test in the first place are not valid don't have high validity. If you can raise the score of the ike the IQ test someone score do nurturing and enrichment then the validity of that IQ test as measuring something that is innate and fixed is not correct one of the reasons that they predict and I'm not the only one that's one of the reasons why they predict performance along the line even some of the abstract questions we could get in to adopt free of bias. some of the abstract questions that they think of Ribeyes and not for your by but these questions predict because if you give them to a child at age 8 And if they come up, I know any vocabulary and so on and so on and these questions first of all, the tests are designed to show how well you're going to fit into in a social situation according to the Norms, but they also show that you have developed certain skills already, but some of those skills that you have you have learned from your environment. So if you come from an environment that is a poverty environment not just economically you are not likely to score as well on those tests. The other fact that we know is that the IQ is in fact malleable and change both but takes the up to age up to age up to age 8 and maybe afterward depending on what kind of tests are given in and even the date around on these tests are not very strong. So the whole question of the validity of IQ test the arguments about twin studies to support support some of these on genetic grounds, and I know you you don't say 100% genetics Charles. I'm not saying that what you say 4060 or its range 40 to 60% and turn the environment also in other cultures, even of the same ethnicity. I feel that the low IQ that blacks have. I need to test relay primarily to the environment and to the absence and deprivation of opportunity over very long periods of time. Now, this is true and some other cultures for instance Oriental Jews. And Israel have low IQs. Okay, peruca bukaku Japanese, which is a cast group. In Japan have lower IQs the so-called Untouchables in India. Nepali East have low IQs to me that is an indication apart and others that part of the problem is the oppression and deprivation of certain groups in society based on caste and in America part of that caste system has been black blacks have been in a lower caste and deprived of opportunities to up to the function. Now, what is what is the the meaning of this particularly of social policy is is is flows from all of this if people come to believe that there's nothing you can do to change all of this because I chew determines really you're standing in society. Then it's going to curtail people's will interest and so on. To develop the kinds of programs that will make a difference but it's their lives of young children and families to help them to achieve and succeed in America. The other thing just as she lets again reiterate that the IQ is not fix. Although reading the bell curve. I frequently Charles. I got that impression until you came to the Flynn effect nnn acknowledge that overtime in the past number of decade. The IQ of Americans actually has gone up about 15 points C. Then they re norment. They re you know, I'm at to 100 but the IQs of God full of IQs can go up in populations. The IQs can go up in populations. You understand the saying it's not it means that the IQ test is is not cannot be Destiny, but I think that too many people use it that way. Remember you're talking about a number. Now Charles, I remember when we we we debated at Syracuse. You said to me if there was if something if someone came in looking for any kind of job, the one single piece of information that you would want if you only have to have one piece of information was what the IQR and I found that a little but that's not what I would want to know. I would want to know if they could do the job or not. Did you guys do you understand what I'm saying? I'm saying I would want to know if they could do the job. I work as a psychiatrist. I get upset with some of my psychology friends when they put these labels on children children coming to the clinic and they say all this that giving these wechsler IQ text test and so on to the IQ is 80 85 and then everyone treats them for Life Everlasting like the IQ of 85 SoDo all become self-fulfilling prophecy. Do you understand what I'm saying that you put the label on and then people operate from the label and then you condemn people to the bottom. We have to be very careful about that. They have been to start one study showing if you tell the school teachers that one group of kids have IQs High IQs, and the other group of kids have low IQs and you just throw them in there the teachers tend to gravitate toward and help the students who that been told have the high IQs. They perform better because of the labeling not let me get to buy I will conclude time is out, please quit. Time is out, please quit. So since I I wanted to make it more lively put y'all but I always also want job so that at least it say something about what his positions are with regard to the relative value and effects of of the genes genetics and heritability of versus the environment and how do you see that in terms of but a social policy? Let me to vote first chunk to the question raised most directly. Why did I talk about heritability? Here's here's the basic statement. We make we say look at there is no longer a scientific dispute about whether intelligence has a significant heritable component. And if you take all of the studies that bear on this is the range of somewhere between 40 and 80% is heritable. James Q. Wilson is observed that Herrnstein and Murray take the arithmetic mean between the old bad studies that showed low heritability and a good new studies that show high heritability, but that's the case of the conservatives being our ballpark figure. That's an example of the conservatism scientific conservatism that characterize the languages in so far to heritability is not a fixed. Relationship in any trade in so far as you equalize the environmental sources of difference in intelligence what happens the importance of the genetic component goes up? Not trying to race you were just talking about what happens with the better better job you do at creating an equal environment for All American children important implication. Other than that and I were not particularly interested in heritability and you will find a little on the topic in the book, but we do talk about and I supposed to make more of an impression of being bitter enemies. We didn't call each other by our first names but stupid changing IQ. Instructor can I as being very odd that it isn't as intractable as it is because in fact we think that there is a large environmental component to it. We're out and I read the data very differently, but I will go to the maps on specific studies and say it is real hard to raise IQ. You can do it usually temporarily unreliable a very very expensively by fairly modest amounts. We can talk more questions. So we should ask a question of why is it fall back again? We can come back to that but my largest statement about heritability is Who are the scientific mainstream and what we say the size of the heritable component is we freely acknowledge a large role of environment? And the question is do we have presently available to us inexpensive reliable ways of consistently raising IQ and answer that is I wish we did but we don't. Got to talk about race in this a few minutes, obviously. What do you say about race beats the hell out of us as to what the nature of the genetic racial differences whether it's a difference in IQ or whether you're talking about the people. Why do we use the self-identification of people by race? Because we are particularly interested in demonstrating weather. There is a genetic racial difference or not. We are interested in the social fact of race in this country, which does exist which is to say people think of themselves as black or white or Latino or Asian and it has social meaning and when we report differences in IQ scores regarding raise we are not doing no more climbing no more saying no more than that of these differences excess now appear in the form of means that people are all across the range in every ethnic group from lowest to highest the difference in means is large enough. To be of some importance but not overriding importance that it does reflect a real difference in cognitive functioning as opposed to artifacts of the test when it comes to jeans what we say is there is a legitimate scientific debate going on as to whether there is any genetic component that all we do say it's legitimate and we also say that given the highly incomplete state of knowledge are concluding sentences. We think it highly probable that both environment and genes have something to do with racial differences. That is the extent of the Herrnstein Marie Crusade for genetic differences a couple of comments about IQ test. This is where I disagree profoundly I would say there was one issue on which in the attacks on the bell curve as Milton Friedman months that I am blessed with many critics. The many attacks in the bell curve. This is not really been an issue of cultural bias in the test has been examined to a fare-thee-well. the items that Alvin was listing for you Which I don't question have been on forms of the wax or sometime. But this is not this is a fraction of what you can look at. You can look at test which are completely consists of abstract patterns with no cultural content whatsoever. You can look at test which involves numerical manipulation which requires no knowledge of arithmetic even such as reciting numbers backwards and forward the general finding is this If you ask is a hypothesis if you stayed is a hypothesis that the differences between ethnic groups arise from the items that are culturally loaded in a test and examine that hypothesis by item analysis. It is not only incorrect. The Gap is wider on nonverbal items non culturally noted items than it is on cultural noted items and I simply don't know of anybody at this point who does furthermore if you look at the proof of the pudding and testing which is its predictive validity to what extent does the score whether it's the SAT score or whatever to what extent does it predict job performance or predict academic performance differently for blacks and whites. If you're saying a test is biased against a group what you're saying is that that test gives an unrealistic Lilo estimate of a person's ability to do the job offer to perform in the classroom or whatever. You can then ask the question. Does that empirically proved to be the test case? This has been examined by the armed forces in higher education in elementary education by the federal government in a recent massive analysis of all the available data. There is simply no scientific assertion anywhere. That test systematically under predict Black Performance. I talked about it and I will talk about it some more. I'm sure I am talking about it because it is an issue with so many of you but as I finish this perhaps Escorting a sentence from the book itself is not a bad idea. This is the end of the chapter on ethnic differences. it says the whole paragraph talking about the genes versus environment issue. And I guess you're not going to learn tomorrow that all the cognitive differences between races are 100% genetic in origin because of scientific state of knowledge unfinished as it is already gives ample evidence of environment is part of the story, but the evidence eventually make the baby come unequivocal that genes are also part of the story. We are worried that the elite wisdom on this issue for years almost hysterically in denial about that possibility will snap too far in the other direction. It is possible to face all the facts on ethnic and race differences in intelligence and not run screaming from the room. That is the essential message. I think in writing the book we prove the great many people have run screaming from the room, but that does not change the point that this is not a big deal in understanding what's going on in American society. OK Google When I said what are the effects of of racism on all of this? I don't mean like discrimination of trying to make him. I'm talking about the effects of it psychologically. on the black person in black family terms of what they may think and feel about themselves as individuals. Did you hear what I'm saying and other words if a group of people because they've been told for centuries now for centuries and continue to be told that they are inferior. What effect does that have on their function there a psychologist who have looked into this black psychologist and someone who still say that one of the the critical problems you can you can study Blac youngsta's now at Age 3 and 4 and give them white and black dolls and the black youngsters will tell you that the black dolls on some way in. To the white dolls. They've been doing this since 1940s or where do they pick that up? And if that becomes internalized, how does that affect their function? I know Charles always meant you you mention of your first digits and so on. I don't think that reverse digital necessarily free of cultural bias because they do for with digits. I think it may have something to do with test-taking attitude. If a kid decides he doesn't want to do the digits backwards. That doesn't make it culture free in my opinion because if they could isn't the Meg come in with an added attitudinal thinks they may come into the tests less trusting. They may not want to work as hard and it has provide a reason but a lot of psychologists even and looking at black college students find that one of their the issues with them when you mention the SAT and do they outperformed it is that many of them are still trying to fight and overcome feelings of inferiority where those feelings of inferiority come from. Where did they come from somehow? They instil an insta institutionalize in this culture in the same way that maybe Asian Americans will perform better. If we have the expectation that all of them up, right? All of them don't like you to have that expectation. Of course is Asian gangsters and everyone else but that doesn't get played up in the same same way so that the expectation from the family from the community and someone may affect how children begin to develop and perform from from the very very beginning. So what I'm saying is that we have to be a we're not some now Dimension about IQ, but all the ingredients that go into making a human being someone who functions. Well someone who's intelligent whatever telogen whatever that means and it's a lot of kinds of intelligence we didn't get into that right kinds of intelligence and what can we do to support it and not close our eyes I'll get locked up with numbers and me. Would you like to be a number to all of you know what your IQ is? Does Collin College know the range of IQs of students on this campus? Did you have to submit IQ test and SAT scores Charles? You said the SAT scores that have gone up and that means everybody's getting cognitively that's because most students are taking prep courses in the SAT. I'll tell you I know that I know that could be. Anna pay more attention they all take me to spend thousands of hundreds of dollars on Kaplan and Princeton Review and all of these set they do it for medical school. We don't know what to make out of these tests from the medical students anymore because they take all these these courses and then it's some students don't take them at all. And so we don't know how to compare the test some of the students who get high scores just took the prep courses and the other students didn't and so if we use the test scores as an indication of how smart they are alone or primarily then we're in big trouble. You see the other thing is that even a college board people say the SAT test does not predict anything past the first year of fresh out of college. The SAT college-port also says that the SAT scores are not as predictable Foreman Rd group students at the Y student. So according to the College Board PSAT people they have a mild up. Position or more flexible position based on something scientific if they're proposing it to the public one final thing and I'm going to stop you know, the one single factor that your SAT scores are related to your sociologist professors can tell you know, the one single fact it's almost linearly related to this is in the New York Times about a month to month 6 weeks ago. family income There's a. Direct relationship with SAT scores and family income and with each increment of family income of 10,000 the students in that group SAT scores. Go up the higher income have the highest scored the lower-income to lowest cost and the people in the middle in gradations. The other scores. What does that tell you about IQ? And then heritability of intelligence versus your environment your level of opportunity exposure and affluence in America. Thank you.