Thank you Ellen. Good afternoon, everyone. This is Stephen Smith reporting from the capital Welcome to our listeners both in the Twin Cities and those listening in northeastern Minnesota on WS CD in Duluth in the background. You might be able to hear the Minnesota Senate which is preparing to debate whether or not it should recall a bill that it passed last Thursday and sent to the house as Alan mentioned the measure would permit the release of 24 million dollars to help a Coon Rapids biomedical company called endotronix build a new plant in Hibbing shortly after the Senate passed the endotronix bill last week considerable controversy ensued mpr's George boozy has been covering this issue. He joins us now George some senators were angry over what they weren't told when they voted right Steve on Friday. It was disclosed at the FBI was investigating endotronix, and it was also reported that three members of the Senate Majority Leader Roger Mo Senator, Ron dick.You have Hibbing the dfl sponsor of the bill and Senator Doug Johnson of cook who chairs the powerful tax committee knew about the investigation before the Thursday vote and did not disclose that fact to the full Senate that angered several senators and on Friday a decision was made by Mo and house Speaker Fred Norton to stop the bill to keep it from passing the house and being sent to governor perpich. Governor Purpose By the weight does want this bill? And he said he would prefer having the Senate version sent on to him. Let's go to the senate floor now where Senator Roger Mo the Senate Majority Leader is discussing this issue number 92 since the vote last Thursday and the disclosure of the FBI investigation that followedThere has been very loud and Justified bipartisan criticism of my decision to proceed on the vote on house file 92. In retrospect head. I had a few days versus literally a few minutes. I would have consulted with more members of the Senate than just the author's and my decision would have been different. After 16 years two and a half months in public life. I've discovered that there's one thing worse than making a mistake. That's making a mistake and not admitting it. I admit that I made a mistake by proceeding on the vote last Thursday and I accept the full responsibility for that decision to go ahead. My decision however, flawed was based on the author's wishes. Authors whose judgment may be colored a little bit by their intense desire to help address the economic problems on the Iron Range. Prior to the session last Thursday, I did suggest to them waiting. I suggested and offered Alternatives but in the final I consented to the author's wishes over my own best instincts and that was wrong and I admit it and I apologize to the senate for that action. We're faced with into Alternatives one would be to have the house not Concur and go into a conference committee. I choose not to do that because a number of you have requested an opportunity to have another vote on this issue. So I have discussed this with the leadership of the other body. And they concur. that the motion to recall they will go along with after the motion to recall and I hope that it prevails. My intention is to reconsider the vote on house file 92. I voted on the prevailing side and I intend to move to reconsider that vote. and if that prevails Then I'm going to move to re refer the bill back to the Senate Economic Development Committee that committee is chaired by. One of the most outspoken critics of the legislation and I would think that he would be able to work in a very bipartisan manner to help address the economic development needs of the Iron Range. So just as I accept your criticism of proceeding on the vote, I intend to insist that we proceed with this bill in whatever modified form to help address and to give the taconite counties the tools to help with their Economic Development issues. But as I suggested a couple of weeks ago somehow we must separate the these issues house file 92 must be rid of the albatross of endotronix endotronix is a dead issue insofar as its relationship to state government or any quasi-state government entity. So, mr. President. I move that house file 92 be recalled from the House of Representatives for further consideration. Senate Majority Leader Roger Mo as you heard he has to decide it has to bring this bill back from the house before it can go ahead and then reconsider the bill and send it back to a committee. This is Hunter Ron Dickens the sponsor of the endotronix bills in this chamber debating a bill which has passed this body. And the reason we're doing it is because it's a bill from its onset that has been manipulated by an unfair press. It's been given it's been given a title which is unfair because it's not addressed in the bill from the first day of this bill was heard in committee. I've told every committee I've been in that there are two separate issues here one is releasing of money from a fund that was set up by this legislature to help the Iron Range area diversify its economy and expand that economy to survive once attack a knight industry was over. There was a side issue and granted the legislation was probably spurred because of a company's desire to locate on the Iron Range. But if you get down to reality the things that have happened since then do not lessen that need for economic development. When you're voting today, you're going to be voting on a couple of different issues. One of those issues is are we as state senators elected by 60,000 some people going to vote on bills based on what's in the bill or based on what the Press is telling us is in the bill. the big hoopla about the so-called FBI investigation It's been something that's been blown out of proportion by the Press. It's been used as a political football and I understand politics and I've been around this game for a long time and you can use a political football but let's get down to the reality. The reality is you had a bill that did not mention endotronix had that Bill said 24 million dollars will be released to I triple RB to be given to endotronix. I would have pulled a bill off the calendar myself and put it back on general orders for discussion. What a dent. What does an FBI investigation? Well, first of all, they're investigating stock manipulation. It's an old story. We all read about it two weeks ago with a lawsuit by stockholders that were suing endotronix for stock manipulation. And what starts FBI investigation I can start when I knew you can start one on me members of this body have started on other members of this body in the past. Theoretically I reporter can start an FBI investigation to be later used in a in a story. If endotronix had applied for public money or had received a dime of public money, then it's our business to know that but this is a company that has not formally applied for anything who even knows if they're still interested to come there. I haven't talked to him in two weeks. The bill releases 24 million dollars to the Iron Range resources and Redevelopment fund board for economic development and then it goes through a process that's all laid out in law a couple of weeks ago. I would give the Press test before I talk to him. Only one person can answer the first First question which is what is the bill do and secondly the second question was and once it does that what is the process that has to be gone through? I just wanted to show you how well informed these news stories have been nobody passed the full test. The reality is that the economy hasn't gotten any better on the Iron Range. The reality is that since is Bill's been introduced 400 more families lost their job. The reality is that within two years 650 more families may lose her job at National steel another issue that's going to be here. We'll see if we can get support to keep those jobs. When you push the buttons today. Remember that if you push it to bring a bill back the wording of the bill hasn't changed. It's still releases 24 million dollars for economic development on the Iron Range words that were putting statues 10 years ago. We haven't come here with our hands out. I push the green buttons for for a sales tax relief for farm equipment. I push the button for interest by towns. I push the buttons for development in the metropolitan area. There's there's proposals in your fork or city Redevelopment. There's more proposals for interest by tan and even to fund the interest by town we did last year. We come to you asking to use our own money get our people off afdc. Those people want to work. But no we're going to be manipulated by the Press. We're going to let them tell us what the bill says that a company that didn't even apply for public money yet. You're supposed to have a big expose on FBI investigations at that point and you don't want to hear this. I really don't think it's our business and tell they make the application until they want to have public money. The bottom line of this is that we have a right to survive and we've got money that was put aside for our survival. So when you vote today, Your vote to allow us to survive. Are you vote to keep passing out money and will be in your asking for general fund money. Just like everybody else and every time you kick that political football today in this debate. Remember, there's a face of an iron Ranger on it Senator, Senator Johnson. Mister you're listening to live coverage of the Minnesota Senate as a debates the proposed recall of the endotronix bill it passed last week. This is Senator Doug Johnson of cook who's chairman of the tax committee and the a triple RB which was Associated Electronics package release. That the FBI was doing an investigation that's important to you. For whatever reason blame Senator Dick Lich and myself don't blame Center MO. We've been struggling for many years to try to do something for the economy on the Iron Range. The bill you had before you is not State General Revenue fund money gets local property tax money. That's paid by taconite companies in lieu of the property tax. Senator Dick Lech and I had heard about an FBI investigation earlier in the session. Then of course we heard it again on Thursday. Let me remind you the members of the Senate and those that write about our actions that we do not live in the Soviet Union. We live in the United States of America. That people came to this country because they did not want the oppression that went on in other countries of this world. Why did not we not release the fact with the FBI? Because if we'd have done that the conviction would have occurred before the trial and think of it yourself. You can go think of many instances where people have been convicted in the public mind and we're never able to recover because the trial was held in the public thought that those people were guilty that would affect people at had bought stock that would affect employees of that company that would affect many things that could have adversely and and permanently hurt people. I can remember in 1971 co-sponsoring a bill co-sponsoring a bill. Whereby we challenged the constitutionality of the Vietnam War and this body and some of you were here. I was the second author. I've never checked my FBI file, but I bet I've got one because not only did I co-sponsor that bill but we marched and we went to the federal courthouse. A right that we were given in this country and I bet I had a file I probably still do. An investigation is an investigation. Reporters call the FBI perhaps it was former employees that called the FBI perhaps it was political adversaries that call the FBI. That is not a trial. That comes later if the FBI or the SEC or any other agency finds something wrong and is centered dick ledge said we were asking and they are asking for a release of the money. And that process whether it's the FBI or the SEC or the Department of Commerce comes later. And certainly will be considered. When those final decisions would have been made. Internally, we were doing our own investigation several months ago Senator Dick lunch and I met with our staff and we have them call the FDA in Washington to really find out from the FDA if what they said was the same is what endotronix officials were telling us and it was the same. Last month, I contacted my catch the commissioner of the Department of Commerce because we were hearing these stories about these sales in Japan much of the information that came out of Center Frank's hearings. I called him worked with Senator Dick llege to have the Department of Commerce and Minnesota which is charged with Securities and Security fraud to look into that into that matter and they were looking into it and we were taking the initiative on those kinds of actions. Not waiting for some other agency to do it. We had initiated it because somewhere down the road if we would have tried to have a business transaction with endotronix or any other company. We wanted to know our self we weren't hiding anything. Again. This is not the Soviet Union. This is the United States of America and everyone has the right to an open and a free trial. I don't apologize for not telling the members of the Senate. That the FBI was looking at this matter. I think I acted in good faith. I think that again you don't convict before the trial and if I had to do it over again, I would do the same thing because there's a process of law. And of course that are that we'll be looking at those kinds of matters before any final decisions are made. I oppose the motion. I can understand why members of this body will support the motion for various reasons. If you only make your decision on a for business reasons, you will oppose this motion. If you're making your decision based on political reasons. And I can understand why the other party has their press releases out already. Then I think you have no choice but to vote for this motion and particularly in the light of all the news and all the headlines that have been coming up out recently Senator Dick Lich and I would like to see this bill passed today. I don't think we've done anything wrong in a Democratic Society. That everyone should be treated equally and have that right not just go on rumors and investigations were no results have been found but to give the Iron Range the opportunity to have this money so that we can work and try to get Economic Development. Center Mo said endotronix is dead. That's not even the issue anymore. If they got that company going again and something worked out, you know, maybe somewhere down the road. They'll look at the range. Again. It's one of one of the few companies in the Twin Cities that that is shown any concern for doing something on the Iron Range. The only one I can think of less than 5 that have tried to do something up there. This motion prevails and the bill goes back to committee. We have to go through. In this session or some future session and have to go through what we have had to do trying to expand our own money with protections built in I don't want to do it and I'm sure Senator Dick let's doesn't want his well so are our request to Republicans and Democrats alike. Is to treat us like the rest of Minnesota treat us as Senator Dick Lich said like the farmers with the special programs. They've got enacted. If there are special needs in the core cities of this state for poor people will support it. But our request is going to be that within this budget this year that rather than using taconite production tax monies that this legislature approved 20 million dollars for jobs and economic development on the Iron Range from the general fund rather than from our own money and we'll go into those committees and we'll try to make our arguments and be treated like any other citizens of this state that where there's a need. If you don't want to do it, let us do it with our own money that we use the state's General Revenue fund money to do it and you can help design that bill and you can put the Protections in there that you want from the state General Revenue fund. That's fine and we'll live with it. But don't convict before the trial. And keep an open mind and keep politics out of this and try to help a very hurting area of Minnesota that Senator Dick Lich and I are only concern is those people that are moving out thousands of them are moving out go up and down the streets of the range and see the for sale signs look at our schools. That's all we were trying to do with this bill and it's got an inner warp and so much politics and everything else that it's not going to survive. But again, if you have a commitment then you'll have to support us and get General Revenue fund money for the job needs and the economic development that we on the Iron Range senators are Doug Johnson senator from cook Minnesota speaking on the floor of the Minnesota Senate. We should mention that over in the down the hall in the Minnesota house the minority leader the Republican minority leader has moved or moved a little bit earlier that the endotronix bill should just be immediately sent back by the house to the Senate before the Senate even asks for it. He was ruled out of order by the dfl chair the Speaker of the House for Ed Norton and currently they are debating over in the house whether or not to appeal that that motion by the chair. The Republican minority is small enough that it's highly likely that the Democrats will prevail. This is Senator. Bob. Lessard of International Falls is on the senate floor right now. He was a co-sponsor of the bill. Let's go to the senate floor and listen to him not to refer the bill back to the committee of economic development is a vote for this bill a vote for neutronics or is a vote for this bill of vote to give us the economic you tools to help us out on the Iron Range. The president Senator Deckard as Was the vote last Thursday and last Monday a vote for this bill based on the wording of the bill is a vote to help us survive economically on the Iron Range. There's a process involved and Senator Benson admitted to me last week that Iron Range resources and Rehabilitation has a decent record as far as using Economic Development money's probably the best in any state agency and that's what you're voting for. If you vote for this bill is so that we have a chance using our own money to survive not coming around asking for help from somebody else but using our own money so that are we can maintain our schools we can maintain our neighborhoods. We can maintain our community and Senator Lessard. Yes, you vote for this. It's a vote to help us survive up there your constituents in mind Senator storm. Does Senator Don storm of Edina a Republican? A gray cloud hangs over this chamber today. And it's a cloud that I hope we can dispel. By the activities that are going to occur here. I guess I would like to address Senator mole and express to you the kind of genuine gratitude. I and my caucus have for your forthright kind of admission. And your forthright manner in addressing the fact that an error in the process has occurred. In spite of the fact that we sit on the other side of the aisle. There are times when statesmanship demands that we acknowledge the kind of pain and difficulty that I'm sure you experience. In having to address this issue in the manner you have and to face these cameras under this kind of difficulty. And you have our highest respect and regard for taking that step. That does not. However. Alter or remove what has happened here. I would like to remind this body that the manner in which we proceed the manner in which we receive the trust from the constituents who put us here is a manner that is basically underlined with information if we do not have the information we cannot make the decisions that are in the best behalf of the citizens. We serve or the great state that we serve. The importance of all the information is so significant that the process requires that we have more than one author on a bill. The process requires that the bill go to committee and perhaps several committees and that public testimony be given and all the information be gleaned. The importance of information is so great that the bill has to have several readings in this body and it must be exposed to the light and the heat of debate so that all of the information can come out and then it is voted upon. The Integrity of the process of providing information has been betrayed. Information was available to some people months before we took this vote. Information that now that it's out Senators on both sides of the aisle have said that would have impacted my vote. When that occurs the process is blemished and that's what causes the cloud today. Not only is information than was held but the very Integrity of the process is now in question. Was there duplicity and deception? I don't know. Will I ever know Perhaps Perhaps not? Am I going to be impressed by the fact that some people think that information wasn't very important. Am I going to be impressed by the fact that someone tells me we live in the United States not in the Soviet Union and everybody has a right to a trial or I am I going to have to remember that everybody in this body has a right to all the information. It seems to me that is the first right. We have a right to know it all and then we will make a decision. And I suggest to you we could and probably would have made a decision favorable had there been the honesty and the Integrity to share all of the information. That hasn't happened. So now we need to pick up the pieces and I think there are a lot of questions that need to be asked we are being told that endotronix never was a key part of this bill. May I just remind this body? That the author of the bill in speaking against the Brandel Amendment. Is quoted in the records of this body? As saying this amendment would hamper our ability to negotiate with the company. The whole process has been like you don't trust our judgment. Those aren't my words. Those are the words of the author of this bill. We are told endotronix never was closely related and yet Senator Johnson in February said I believe in endotronix. I believe they are going to be successful. If endotronix was not related to this bill, why were their employees paraded into committee meetings to testify about their fiscal and their experimental stability and integrity wasn't that a terrible waste of time and words for a company that isn't related to this bill. the governor himself Said public aid for the endotronix proposal should be based not on the status of the company but on whether or not the University of Minnesota tests results are encouraging. Are you telling me that from the governor to the author to the supporters of the bill endotronix was not a part of this process and that we should not be concerned when that company comes under investigation. I find that extremely hard to accept. I am glad and grateful that the majority leader has both the courage and the Candor and the compassion for the process. To make the motion to recall this bill and to allow us hopefully. to restore the Vitality of information And the necessity of Integrity to what we do here. Otherwise, I'm afraid. The level of trust that has already been blemished will not heal. And we are in for some real trouble. And I urge you to vote in support of the majority Leader's motion. So listening to live coverage of the Minnesota Senate debating the recall of the endotronix Bill. Here's Doug Johnson of clothes. Was voted against this legislation with or without information. He was against it. He was against it last week. He was against it the week before and the week previous to that. I find that a little inconsistent. Of his concern about information when he didn't support it. Sandhurst arm is talking about integrity. Senator Dick ledge and I we'd be referring to have not lied to this body. What are the people of Minnesota? We've told the truth all the way. And Senator Dick Lich has said many times the endotronix matter spurred the legislation. And that gave some hope for Hibbing in the Iron Range. the whether or not endotronix was something that would happen on the Iron Range. We need other tools for the Iron Range. The problem and the difficulty is that you can't negotiate with a business in the legislative process. Because immediately in particularly. the members of the other party they've been doing this for a long time with other things. We've been trying to get going on the Iron Range in their hypocritical ways. Well try to put roadblocks. And we'll try to put a political reason in a political argument. Knowing that these issues are very complicated. and knowing that most minnesotans don't understand that we're not talking about state tax dollars, but local tax dollars and Senator storm you and your colleagues continue that do it all you want. Senator Dick Lech, and I did not lie to this body. Order the people of Minnesota and we very much resent. That you would insinuate that we've done that we've done that but let's let's look at it. Let's look at the facts Center storm and what your motives are there political motives and nothing else. Senator storm mr. President Senator Johnson If as you suggest, my motives are political. That's betraying I guess the very intelligence with which I operate I oppose this bill from the beginning. Yes. And if that's hypocritical if it's hypocritical to oppose a piece of legislation because you is you feel it is business-wise unsound. Yes, then I am hypocritical. If it's hypocritical to oppose a piece of legislation because you've done some investigation and found there's a possibility that if this 24 million is taken out of that fund. That the tax relief that it's paying for up. There will dry up by 1991 and you feel you don't want to do that to those people. Yes, then I'm hypocritical and I accept that with pride. And if it's hypocritical to do your homework and to consult with your colleagues and to recognize that there's a cloud hanging over the one business that is related to this bill. And if that's the business on which it's going to fly that maybe we shouldn't support it. Then I'm hypocritical and I'll accept that analysis, but I will say to you sir that in that case hypocrisies. He is one of the greatest virtues this body can develop and I would urge all of you to follow suit. Senator Bennet Senator knock Well, mr. President. I hate to say this but since having voted for the endotronix bill once seems to be a qualification for floor debate on this matter. I did vote for the bill once and committee is Senator Dick large nose much to my subsequent Chagrin and embarrassment because mr. Chairman and members of the body the more I found out about it. And the more information that I received the less I liked what I was hearing. This is for its Canuck. I'm independent republican from White Bear Lake what the Senate's about about democracy. One of the things were about I think is finding out the truth. And it's kind of strange but true that in some cases finding out that truth and focusing on it develops a better bill. In other cases. The truth is kind of like sunlight on meet at a certain point the more it's exposed to it the more it smells and it smells and it smells and mr. President members of the Senate we have here what I think has become a rotten Bill and everybody in the state knows it it is the endotronix bill. Mr. President members of the Senate. That's the way it was defended what's offensive about what's happened to us here today though. It seems to me is what's happened to the process in the senate in the meantime to get us here. It was interesting to me to hear the discussion that this was not the Soviet Union that's very true. We demand information and we demand the truth on the floor of the Senate. That's what we're all about. The issues of process were one of the few countries in the entire world that guarantees process and that process has been violated here. I'm pleased as much as I can be under the circumstances that the majority leader recognizes that key fact and as indicated that it is time to put this out before us and to get it to the extent possible behind us and to recognize that the process itself has been violated here. I'm afraid that what we're seeing is a step-by-step of erosion of that process and erosion. If you will of democracy in the Senate, we saw it earlier. I think when we made our choice when he took our Democratic Choice out of out of the selection on the Senate calendar, we were told just last week in debate. We in the minority. You aren't privy to the discussions that go on in this private caucus that gets held from time to time in the majority. We were told by one of the proponents of this bill that if we wanted more information about it, he'd be happy to provide it for us privately. And now we've been told that it probably wouldn't have been in our best interest to be informed about an FBI investigation on a bill pending before the Senate. Let me suggest That if there had been a commissioner up for appointment for the approval of the advice and consent of the Senate and we were aware of the fact at least I'd like to think that I would if I were aware of the fact that he was under a felony investigation. I think I would owe it to this Senate. I think I would owe it to this process and I think I would owe it to the citizens of Minnesota to tell you as members of the Senate that that's what was going on. And I think members of the Senate that is what was owed us here and it wasn't forthcoming now. It's well and good to say. Hey, we didn't lie to anybody. We didn't actually come out and tell you I miss truth. But let me suggest that in these kinds of cases failure to disclose is the same thing as lying and it's inexcusable here in the Senate of Minnesota. I think our rules are designed to show that that Integrity is there and I think our people expect that there was a failure to disclose here. There is no excuse for it. I'm grateful that the majority leader has brought this issue before us I urge you all in light of the recent disclosures the reconsider this bill eventually to look at it send it. Hopefully where it belongs but at least look at it again long and hard so that the citizens of this state get what we as elected officials owe them, which is a closed and full scrutiny of the information that we need in order to pass judgment on this bill. Senator Dick which again is a Senator Ron dickless of Hibbing the sponsor author of the bill. Kick the ball again. and again and again Mr. President Senator Senator could knock you are an attorney. I'm not going to ask you to yield a question because I know that it appears to me that in this country. At least one of the things my grandparents came here for and I know that you will pull the beliefs of the Constitution also. Is that you don't convict people with a charge? There's a thing in the Constitution called due process. Now, we have a press that hides behind the Constitution for freedom of the press, but then abused the other amendments in that Constitution and one of them is the due process Theory and belief. If there were a commissioner up here trying to get a state job where he would be paid public dollars. You're right. We have every right to know what's going on in his life for her life. When you have a company a private company that has not received a dime of public money nor have they formally applied for any public money. Then I say no. Once they make that application and everybody has a right to know everything there is to know about that company. You don't convict people by having an investigation. Anybody can Institute an investigation whether they have they have grounds to substantiate it or not. So you make your political speeches make your accusations. You're smart talks and your big words while there's people on the Iron Range that are going to hurt. The issue behind this from the beginning and the reason I had it here because we have a right to survive and we have a right by the law passed in 1977 to do it ourselves. You're listening to live coverage of the Minnesota Senate debating. The recall of the endotronix build should mention that this broadcast is being carried in the Twin Cities on ksjn Minneapolis st. Paul in Duluth on WS c d wi are our Buell and wgl Houghton Stephen Smith and George boozy reporting from the state capitol as this debate continues George for those listeners who have just recently joined this broadcast. How about a quick recap of the issues here? And what's going on? Yes Steve as you recall on Thursday, the senate pass indo-chinese bill passed with two votes to spare. It was sent to the house on Friday. It was disclosed that that bill was passed by only three members of the Senate knew about an FBI investigation into alleged stock manipulation because of that opposition from other members of the Senate to the whole thing prompted leaders to seek the recall of the bill from the house bill is in the house right now the sentence asking going to be asking them to send it back if this motion passes and then they will reconsider the vote by which it passed on Thursday very quickly the endotracheal It's Bill would free up 24 million dollars in taxes from the Iron Range taconite tax fund. Although endotronix is not specifically named in this bill. It's been clear from the beginning and and the authors of the bill have made it clear from the beginning that that 24 million dollars was intended for endotronix a biomedical firm in Coon Rapids that wants to that is hoping to build a plant in Hibbing where it would produce where it would develop and produce technology to cure cancer or do or to create cancer killing cells in the treatment of cancer. That's the whole issue here. Some of the the author some of the supporters are saying that this is not the endotronix bill per se that the money would go to other development on the Iron Range and why don't we turn now to the floor and hear more of the debate Senator Howard Knutson a republican from Burnsville is on the floor. And ask are they really the body that should get 24 million dollars to spend on some kind of an economic trip, whatever that trip might be. So I suggest to you that somehow as the majority leader and said we've got to move to remove that cloud first and then we can consider the other judgmental matters president. Senator Dick which president everybody Is the feeling. That there's still people in his body to have read that bill. I want you to point out the page the line and the word that says endotronix in this bill. We've said from the start. Yes, the bill was spurred by endotronix interest in locating on the Iron Range. We also know nothing's for certain. There's a process there that's been in place that has weeded out over a hundred and fifty businesses and their attempts to get loans. And to get involvement with a triploid be on the Iron Range that process has worked in any company that isn't qualified to get those loans has been weeded out and they would have in this case. You're just assuming that the money was released and let go there's a process of that bill. I challenge you to read the bill. Read the bill and show me where it says endotronix. And that's your main. The first problem here is people have been referring this to this as endotronix where if the process works companies that can make it don't get Aid companies that do will be those that will be able to help us and that's why we have the legislation here question occurs on a motion to recall. You just heard from Rhonda glitch of Hibbing the bill sponsor members Senator, Dick llege. We've had an opportunity to talk privately before this will disclose it later. But what you point out Senator Dick Lech and when you indicate that the I Triple R B has a process that works and I have agreed with you. That's not what we're about today. Is this process? And is this process working? This is Dwayne Johnson of Lanesboro Republican minority leader of the senate or living under a rock. Not in some way to relate endotronix with this piece of legislation and I've read the legislation nowhere at all. Does it mention endotronix? And I've told you what my problems are with it, and I've been straightforward with you. But let me ask you this, why are endotronix present at the committee's? Why do they come to your office? And Lobby? Why do they lobby at the times when this bill is up now, whether they're still involved or not. And the latest information is that the people that are were directing that company of step down? Why? Was everybody drawing those conclusions and Senator Dick Lich. The Press is not on trial here. we are this process is on trial for as Senator kanak said not disclosing all the information. That's what we do. That's the only way we can base decisions and where our I would say our batting average is no better than the I Triple R B. We're only right percent of the time but we're dependent upon is information. All of the information was not disclosed. It's not a partisan issue. As a matter of fact the two votes over the March and you needed at least two of them came from this caucus and by the same token, there were votes in your caucus against it some of the outrage that I'll pass out later. It comes from both caucuses. Some of that is recognized by Senator mole. And that's the reason why he wants to clear the air so for it is for us to say in this body for those of you that have been in a lot longer than I have. That it's not appropriate to clear the air not to operate in an ethical and Statesmen like fashion. Then our process is going to erode and this session is going to be longer and all future ones are because we're setting a precedent here today. On the motion to recall a favor Senator aniki. Mr. President members that girl Rena key from looser and independent republic today and I've heard it a hundred times before on the floor of this Senate that this is a local issue that this is a local tax on the local people to be collected and used in Iron Range. I'm standing here before you to dispel that statement. This is of Statewide interest and of Statewide nature and it's important to all of us. Yes, there are parts of the production tax that are used in Iron Range in lieu of local property taxes, but 34 and a half cents of that production tests. Go tax goes into two funds that are Statewide in nature. They were voted upon by this legislature and they have to be dispersed by this legislature and that's why we're here today. The bill proposes to release dollars from this production tax. Yes, we agree that part of the dollars here are local in nature in lieu of property taxes, but the part we're talking about today is not a local tax. It's a Statewide tax that takes everyone in this legislature to be concerned about in to vote upon. So I just like to dispel that rumor and dispel that myth that this portion of the tax is not a local tax. Senator Johnson, yeah, this is Senator Doug Johnson of cook. He's just a tax chairman and a co-sponsor of this bill Aaron member of the state senate that doesn't understand it. He doesn't understand the taconite production tax. He doesn't understand how it works. He doesn't understand the funds all of the money that goes in the funds. There are two funds the taconite Environmental Protection fund and the taconite economic protection fund. They come from the same Source from the taconite production tax again Center and a key which is paid by taconite companies in lieu of the property tax. There is no State General Revenue fund money. Again, it comes from the local tax. So Senator aniki is absolutely incorrect. I'd encourage them to read the taconite statutes. And try to understand them because that's the kind of problem. We've had that people either who don't understand or people who don't care to understand are making those kinds of statements. It is local property tax money period Set a run a key. Again. It says Senator lanky of Le Sueur have a refrigerant Republican critic of the Iron Range of resources Rehabilitation board which would actually negotiate with endotronix under this bill. That's what is being set. Three and a half cents goes to cities and towns taconite Municipal Aid 16 and a half cent school districts fifty cents county 29 cents. This is the breakdown of it. We know where it goes. We know where it comes from. But basically these two funds are provided in attacks on the natural resource of Minnesota a right for all the people to make a decision on and that's what we're making here today a decision on that Statewide tax on this portion of it. Listeners on the motion to renew my motion should mention I mentioned earlier. We're waiting. Now as the president of the Senate room cues calls for the role on the motion to reconsider or to recall rather there. They want to recall the endotronix bill from the house or the Senate sent the bill last week the house earlier the Republican majority in the house tried to essentially spit the endotronix bill back at the Senate before the Senate could go about asking for the bill back the Republican minority failed on a 79 245 eventual vote. the recall does pass close the roll. Here's announcement. 51 eyes and 15 days. The motion is adopted. So terrible. Mr. President under motions and resolutions. I move we take up the Senate calendar. So now we have that vote that was 51 215 to recall the bill. That is the bill to allow. The I Triple R be the Iron Range resources and Rehabilitation board to negotiate a package with endotronix that bill passed on Thursday 36 223 that was with two votes to spare. Now. The Senate is asking for it back at this point Steve. The secretary of the Senate Pat Flavin is signing an order asking the house to send this bill back. It's just a one-sentence order requesting that the bill be returned to the senate for reconsideration. And that's going to be sent over there by a by a page a messenger and then the house will take up the issue and as you've noted that the leadership in the house has been waiting for this message. This is no surprise to them the bill will then come back to the Senate where Senate Majority Leader Mo again. We'll ask the Senate to reconsider the vote that Thursday vote at 36 223 vote by which the bill passed last week and then the bill If that passes and it's expected to buy this margin, you can see it'll probably be sent to the economic development committee, which is chaired by one of the harshest critics of the bill centered on Frank of Spring Lake Park. Now George all of that could all of that could probably take place including the reconsideration move to reconsider and refer back to committee could take place yet this afternoon, right? I assume it will that the whole issue has now been debated the recall petition in effect gave those people who want to reconsider the built a chance to have their say and they indeed did have their say there was some question about trust the fact that only three members of the Senate the two main sponsors of the bill Senator declined from Hibbing and Senator Johnson from cook and the Senate Majority Leader Roger Mo knew about the FBI investigation when the Senate voted last Thursday now, it is interesting to see the positions taken by Senator Mo and Senator Johnson on this Senator most that it was a mistake and he took full responsibility for not telling the members of the senate about the FBI investigation. He was told about about three hours before the Senate session Senator Johnson said it was not a mistake and he would not call it that that investigation is just that an investigation and he was afraid that it would be looked at as a conviction not an investigation. Now Governor Rudy perpich has had has been somewhat at Cross purposes with the leaders of the House and Senate on this issue has he not he's been a supporter of this measure from the beginning. And in fact, it was disclosed this week that his office was deeply involved and basically the whole origination of the endotronix bill if that's if that's accurate and but the governor didn't want to have happen what we just heard today, right? The governor said on Friday that he wants that bill sent to him the governor of courses from Hibbing. He looked at this as they attempt to create jobs in his hometown the very hard hit Iron Range Hibbing has been hard hit the layoffs the closures of the TEC-9 industry. Now, let's let's we also should make clear that the money involved in this this 24 million dollar bill is taconite production tax funds. Their taxes that are levied on the taconite companies up on the Range in lieu of local property taxes, but the legislature had to give its approval for the Iron Range resources and Rehabilitation board, which is made up of legislators most of them from the Iron Range to use this money and they would be negotiating a package either alone or an equity investment in endotronix in an attempt to get this Coon Rapids firm to build the plant up on Hibbing on the Iron Range now, ironically or whatever you want to call it that simultaneously today as this debate was emerging and developing at the Capitol. It was announcement from endotronix, which perhaps will it will reaffirm some of the arguments of the critics of this whole endotronix proposal, right endotronix announced today is Steve that Yamaha. One of the Japanese Distributors was withdrawing a promissory note 2 with respect to approximately three point seven million dollars in overdue accounts without this note. It appears that endotronix will be out of money. By early May following that the board chairman of endotronix Eugene grunberg and its President. Michael grunberg is a father and son announced that they were stepping down from their positions this again follows the FBI disclosure investigation Internal Revenue Service is looking into endotronix the state Commerce department. And now we have this roadblock to the 24 million dollars. It might have been infused into that company. It had this bill passed the leaders in the House and Senate Senate Majority Leader Mo and house Speaker Fred Norton have both said and Norton repeated today that for this whole so-called endotronix Bill to pass the legislature this session considering the trouble. It's been through and and they'll all of the relevation is about the investigation for the bill to pass. They both say that endotronix will essentially have to have its name stripped from the measure Fred Norton was rather adamant the morning this morning saying that that they're going to have to restore some credibility to both The process and the bill and it's going to have to be in his words a super-clean package for it to pass this session. Considering all that's been through now. I just to remind you the Senate has voted 51 215 to ask for the endotronix bill back from the house. The Senate will then reconsider it it will go back to committee and the whole debate will will generate all over again. I expected in the house this afternoon will hear much the same kind of thing. Although certainly not quite as heated as in the Senate because of course the house voted back in February back in February a some time before this whole issue came about and will remind you that in third on Thursday. When the Senate voted some members of some leaders in the Senate knew about the FBI investigation and did not disclose it to the other members of the Senate. We should also say hear that Doug Johnson said during the debates and her Doug Johnson hook that once this Bill gets back into committee. He's going to go with a different type of approach. He wants 20 million dollars in General Revenue funds. These are not the taconite funds we're talking about actual state tax dollars. The help the range and he says then the Senate can put all kinds of restrictions whatever they want to on this that because it will not be their own money as they like to label the taconite production tax money. One of the hottest debates at the Capitol this session so far and certainly it's a debate that's not going away. We can expect plenty of Sparks and politics and rhetoric and anger is the bill makes its way back down essentially the ladder that it climbed up and we'll have to do that again and that'll wrap it up for here. You've been listening to live coverage of the Minnesota Legislature from the state capitol in st. Paul the technical director for this broadcast. Will Scott Bridgewater. Thanks to George boozy for his insights this afternoon. This is Steven Smith reporting.