(00:00:00) Good morning, everyone Rich deep Min in st. Paul welcoming you to our Saturday morning public affairs program mental health is our topic today and we'll get to our program and our studio guests right after taking a brief look at weather conditions and forecasts at nine o'clock. The latest report we have around the region indicates. It's sunny in Rochester and 46 Fahrenheit. That's eight above Celsius in st. Cloud right now, mostly sunny and 43 Fahrenheit six above Celsius and in the Twin Cities, mostly sunny 48 Fahrenheit 9 above on the Celsius scale the weather forecast for the Twin Cities metropolitan area calls for sunny skies for this morning, then increasing cloudiness with a Chance of scattered showers through tomorrow continued cool with a high today and Sunday in the mid 50s lows tonight will range in the upper 30s and winds will be northwesterly at around 10 miles per hour shifting to the southeast this afternoon and the velocities will decrease as the day proceeds chance of measurable precipitation in the Twin Cities. He's today 20% 50% tonight and 40% on Sunday. According to statistics from the National Institute of Mental Health one in 10 people in the United States have some form of mental illness that would benefit from professional treatment estimating the current population of this country at about 225 million. That means about twenty two and a half million of us are mentally ill to the point. We could use some help the topic of mental illness is very broad indeed and we by no means expect to cover all aspects of it this morning, but in anticipation of May being mental health month this morning, we're going to discuss some aspects of an illness which until recently was pushed into the closet with me in the studio to help in that discussion this morning are mr. Dale Simonson judge Suzanne Sedgwick and mr. J Croft. Mr. Simonson is president of the Minnesota the Mental Health Association of Minnesota a former Hennepin County Court commissioner. Mr. Simonson is currently in private law practice judge Suzanne Sedwick sits on the bench in Hennepin County district court in the Family Division among her many community activities judge said Wick currently Is the honorary chairperson for the United Nations International year of the child and Jay Croft is the newly selected associate director of the Minnesota state Council for the handicapped. Mr. Croft is an Episcopal Minister and he's just moved to Minnesota from Akron Ohio. Mr. Croft is deaf. And also in the studio with us this morning is Gloria reisman who is interpreting for mr. Croft. Good morning all and Welcome to our program. Mr. Simonson. I'd like to begin by asking you what are some of the signals of mental illness some of the things that people might look for in themselves just as a sort of a thumbnail checkup. Willie there's so many ways that a mental mental illness can manifest itself that that you could almost make an endless list and I prefer to start by pointing out. We try to emphasize more mental health. And if you start with what mental health is, I think it becomes easier to identify a mental illness in its earlier stages. Mental health is not just the absence of being mentally ill there are certain positive. Feelings and attitudes and behaviors that make a person mentally healthy and I think it's not something that we all would like to be if you stop to think about it. Nobody wants to have an absence of mental health and what we mean by that first of all is that people should feel good about themselves. If you can't feel good about yourself, it's going to be very difficult to feel good about other people. If you're consumed by anger jealousy, and I think one of the most important things is so often people sell themselves short they say, oh, I'm not any good. I can't do this. I'm not an expert at anything, but everybody has talents they have skills and they are important and they should be important to themselves. If nothing else. I have a friend who often says I'm the second most important person in the world. He always had somebody that is selected as somebody that is really very important to him and we'll put before his own interests a spouse or friend or whatever. But he says I'm the next most important person and I think that's that's one good way to look at that should like yourself. Secondly. You should feel good about other people feel right about them help others have some sort of personal relationships. One of the things we see quite frequently in people who are suffering from a mental illness is a sense of isolation loneliness not having any kind of ongoing relationship with other persons. And in the the other primary importance item of such importance is being able to deal with everyday life. Do your work meet your responsibilities fulfill your family responsibilities. I'll make decisions have goals that you're able to follow through on when these are seriously lacking any one or more of these then we start looking at and thinking in terms of mental illness and there's no dividing line all of us have weaknesses in one or more of these areas. Now what he is is perfect at them and there's no one point at which we say that mental illness begins, but when they are seriously deficient then we start looking for some of the symptoms that we would call mental illness. I want to come back to some of those symptoms and also some of the things that people might do for themselves in order to to to remedy them, but I want to ask judge Sedgwick a question about mental health and families you see I would imagine a lot of situations from the bench in Hennepin County District Court that that involve mental health to one degree or another in the family in particular and I'm wondering if you talk a few minutes about that. (00:06:18) Sure. I should correct one thing. I was on the Family Court until July of 1977. And since that time I've been on regular rotation in the district court and him presently sitting on the criminal bench, but I would think that the question really applies not only to families but also to people who have problems with the law in that Family Violence or violence against other people whether in or out of the family is really seems to me to be based on the inability of people to control what our natural feelings of aggression or natural feelings of anger and with families, I think. is one additional thing where people Parents sometimes feel to view children as people. They view them as some small something that they have there but not really as people with the same feelings and the same convictions. Although at different levels as themselves a lot of the violence that we see both directed towards children and directed towards other adults in the family comes in large measure because people when they're small in this you have to keep in mind, I'm not a psychologist but this is our observations of people when they're little are frequently taught to deny their emotions like a child will come home and say I just hate my teacher and the parent will say well no, you don't really hate that teacher you you know, you're probably what did the teacher do or something of the sort? Well, he does hate her. Why not deal with it and say well what what was it that went wrong that? Makes you hate your teacher. Some unfairness or something the sword. Well that really must have made you angry. What did you do? But instead of dealing with what are very normal growing up emotions and adult emotions people are told deny them. No, you're not angry. No, you're not cross, you know know and of course they are so I think that it you can't deal with something until you recognize that it's there that it's natural something we all have and it's something that has to be controlled angers good there is nothing the matter with being angry. It's what you do with it. And the people that get angry may act very constructively on it. Once they get rid of the overt manifestations of it. I might go out and walk two miles if I'm very upset with something but physical exercise is one thing that is used even in the prison's where they put up the punching bag that's been used for kids for years at local gyms. Our centers for children an acceptable way of dissipating normal anger or aggression is through physical activity. And then another area that I think is counterproductive to learning to dissipate anger or aggression is television. I really think that this kids get the idea and watching the incredible number of violent programs on TV that that's par for the course, you know, this is the norm and depending on how much of that they watch you have seen and I have seen children that are sitting in front of a TV screen not flinching at all on something that is basically very destructive and horrible and they are taking that as just you know, that's life. That's something that we see day in and day out. Well, it's not and it should be taught as a perversion that should be shown as a perversion. It should be it should be shown as that is not the norm and not desirable and it isn't so I think that to the extent that it treats it that treats violence and the acting out of aggression against other people as the norm that it's cheating children and we've got generations of kids that have grown up with it now kids actually in their own families watch an awful lot of of improper aggression at least from the number of people that are being arrested for assault on the spouse or anger against children that results in the battering so it's a composite of thing, but basically if I could make one recommendation that I for a problem, I think I see it would be to teach children at very early ages that anger is normal that anger is good and that using it in certain ways is good and in certain ways is not (00:11:06) From the Bench is there much you can do when you get a family or part of a family before you would and it's evident. At least. It looks like this kind of a situation is that they're there because they haven't learned how to deal with their anger. What kinds of things do you have available to you at that point or is it I mentioned it varies with the individual case, but are there some things that you can do that that can possibly help things out? (00:11:36) Well, the people that are dealing with counseling would all be dealing I'm sure upfront with aggression and anger and the programs even in the criminal area would also be dealing with that in as far as parenting skills. Go our statistics really show that 90 some percent of parents who better their children were battered themselves as children which again goes back to the premise that violence begets violence and a lot of those parents would really like to be good parents. They don't know how they've never seen it. They've not experienced it and Part of the of the treatment then and this is assuming that the child is not in an immediate physical danger, but part of the treatment would be just exactly that the learning of controls and some of the groups throughout the country like parents Anonymous that have worked with parents with the potential for battering act on that premise, you know, if you really think you're losing control give us a call immediately and someone goes over and sits with the child while the parent goes out and walks around the block because walking it dissipates aggression, so they act exactly on that premise and I think those groups are available and I think we have counseling available and certainly where children are abused. We have programs in Social Service work and psychologists available that work on that (00:13:14) area. Jay Croft are there problems that are peculiar mental health problems that are peculiar to people with physical handicaps. (00:13:25) Yes very much. So. Every day, there's brother were frustrated. Sometimes learned sometimes smoked yesterday. You called me and asked me to come over and talk with you. You want to talk with me on the phone really, but I do not have an interpreter there. So it was easier for me to work the two blocks over here. And buried no one said Pearl and was proud to find my way around when I got to the front door the door everything family locked and I heard the bang that they do it because they could not use the telephone outside to do it. I turned around and started walking back to my office and we're going to have somebody may come whether soap telephone call to you. But then you open the door. So I was doing happy this morning to see you signed up there. This ain't working to most people they have to be very small thing. They would pick up the telephone but to be a telephone is an absolute (00:14:17) barrier. It's just something that's why I must do to the type of dude. It's just something about my my lack of experience in dealing with a person who is deaf too because as soon as I got off the phone with somebody at your office yesterday, I immediately got caught up in something else and then about 10 minutes later realized that there was nobody downstairs and that you the phone out there which is of use to most people who come here wouldn't be of any use to you. So it was a lesson for me too. (00:14:54) The crew to put handicapped has several people who themselves have disabilities. I am the only deaf person on the council. So I have my own pair use other people have Mobility problems. And when we see a beautiful building there, perhaps our tax money to contributed paid for it. But the building is not accessible even one step is a huge barrier. Sometimes this is the real problem. I understand the Minnesota has a very high-tech seat and those surely hope that those texts are not be used to build buildings that are not accessible to the entire population. The other things with their public service announcements and radio television. Now, the only thing that I really understand that television mean is a professional wrestling. Everything else is maybe a parliament maybe not but television itself. It's a poor medium to communicate with deaf people because radio was worse. There are many many of the First Dates depending on the handicap. Sometimes it's first day to deal so high. That the disabled person needs mm. Maybe health help just like anybody else everyone sort of I ever hear about Paragons. I heard about a deaf girl who can't play the piano another one with the 105 decibels to could use the telephone they simply do not believe that No, I made from Ecuador appealed. His fields are 26 Barrel to the Boston Marathon. It was only half an hour behind the able-bodied when it but not everyone is like (00:16:47) that. The other day when I attended a briefing for the Press at which you spoke you mentioned that at best reading lips is only about 25 or 26 percent effective. And I think that a lot of people would be surprised to hear that that most people think that deaf people can read lips quite easily and can understand and know what what the person is saying, but that's that's not true. (00:17:22) The PDC castigate the words red and green look exactly the same as the lips. Eight nine and ten look exactly the same. So you go to a bank or store admittedly a hearing impaired person had problems. More and more cash registers are being built with the amount of visible only to the person when you empty the keys, I think central deliberate. So the person would have such a shock when you see that the total bill but it's it is hard because the cashier will tell you the amount now most deaf people have a little trick of handing over Bill. There'd be no is larger than the amount. If you're buying something that going to be 11 download + text Evernote to about to text with handling $50, even though we may have exactly to the packet. I always carry a large amount of change my packet for that Lisa (00:18:23) are there some and I understand you're new to the state, but are there some places where handicapped people can go to get? Service mental mental health mental counseling that's they can get a particular understanding of from people or do you suggest that they go to any mental health agency? (00:18:52) A person with a physical Mobility problems can and should receive services from any mental health agency now, they should all be accessible no stairs or never bathrooms. It was inaccessible parts of the building first instead of funded by public money that is required by about the person with the communication impairment. The problem is much greater. The urban psychologist and psychiatrist, like other people reacted and have their own hangups about a person who has a communication problem. A deaf person in this state is very fortunate because there's an excellent mental health program is said program see hospital. So interested that although the director is hearing that name d the administrator in the clinical psychologist about that mean where did that do it? This I believe is unique in the nation. There are so many other places though. We're the mental health needs of hearing impaired. People are not being met. It is fine. If you live in the Twin Cities area, but if you're up in the North Woods at the Snows begin to bother you and your death, in fact even to come out to help unless you have a teletype machine, which is very expensive. They could be very big problem. (00:20:29) The time is coming up on 21 minutes past 10:00 o'clock and you're listening to a discussion about mental health in the state of Minnesota and what's available to to people with various conditions and in various situations, if you'd like to call in and ask a question of any of our guests this morning you can do so by calling us at 2 2 1 1 5 5 0 in the Twin Cities area. That's two two one one five five zero if you live outside the Twin Cities metropolitan area, but in the state of Minnesota you Call us toll-free at 1-800-669-9133 Watts number and I'll give it again. It's 1 800 600 200 7000 in the Twin Cities number is 2211550. Mr. Simonson while we're waiting for the first caller this morning. I'd like to go back to you and ask you to give us a brief outline of some of the access points to mental health care in the state some of the places that people go and also talk a little bit about whether or not most mental health care that's provided is done in hospitals and institutions or is it provided as an outpatient? Well as far as access points, there are many. Perhaps surprisingly to some people the most the most used access points are not psychiatrists or mental health centers or psychologists or the Mental Health Association or anything else but through family doctors family clergy and sometimes through schools teachers through sometimes through employers number of companies are starting their own programs to assist employees with whatever problem they have whether their personal financial mental health or whatever. And what does it mean when somebody seeks treatment are a number of barriers to people seeking treatment for one thing? We know that 75% of the people still regard any kind of mental illness as having a severe stigma. We know that about half the people still think that any kind of mental illness is it is largely a result of the person's own emotional weakness. Not a health problem is as we would think of their own fault. Yes, if they're mentally ill it it's their fault. It's even more pronounced with people who are alcoholic but 80% of the people think that an alcoholic is an alcoholic because some sort of Personality weakness not any kind of a health or illness related type of thing. So people are reluctant to admit to a problem. You mentioned the figure 10% of people at any one time needing help. Other Studies have indicated that may be as high as 15% But when you interview people about whether they have mental health problems in the family only five percent say yes, there's a great denial. Most treatment for mental health problems is through the family physician. That's and most mental health problems are not severe enough probably to require more than that, or maybe the position will make a referral source. That's not really my area of expertise. But relatively small percentage are treated in (00:24:08) hospitals. Probably something like 10% (00:24:11) of people who receive some form of treatment for an emotional problem are actually admitted to a hospital for him. So the vast majority is on an outpatient basis and if they do go into a hospital, it's been such a tremendous change over the last 10-15 years used to be that was a rather extended. . In the hospital and now the average stay is very very short matter of days and a few weeks for the most part. So it's been a great change. Okay, we have a caller on the line. And before we go to that person, I'd like to remind listeners again that if they have a question for any of our guests this morning Dale Simonson from the Mental Health Association of Minnesota judge Suzanne Sedgwick from the Hennepin County District Court or J Croft from the handicapped Council of Minnesota. You can call us at 2 2 1 1 5 5 0 in the Twin Cities and let's go to our first question or this morning. Good morning. You're on the air. Are you there? Okay, we can hear you now. Go ahead with your question, (00:25:13) please I just want to say that. This is their second year and surprisingly enough there doing a musical right now called celebration. That was just an aside. I myself have been in hospital for psychiatric treatment and I haven't been in since 1970 because I decided that drug therapy was not for me an electric shock which to me is an Abomination was not for me and I quit Sakaya tree and went to a psychologist a social worker who inside of a few months did something for me that the psychiatrist couldn't do in five years. Now. What I want to know is how often now do they use shock treatment? And where does the patient have the chance to have a choice many times a psychiatrist will take on a patient and they are not given a choice as to drug therapy the electric shock treatment or Psychotherapy which to me. Something that a person's in the field risks and involves himself with the patient and takes the time to find out what the problem is instead of covering up with an electric shock treatment. I think that depressives and which I was you cover up the symptoms with the shock treatment with drug therapy. All you do is run around like a like a zombie your mind is going a mile a minute but your body can't react and there you have the frustration of trying to do something and you can't because of the debilitating effects of par innate or lithium or what lithium is something else Thorazine is an Abomination as far as I'm concerned and where does the patient have a choice of having a drug treatment ear at the electric shock or the best way is D is the Psychotherapy and what I want to see a bill or something where a patient is given a choice. (00:27:16) Well just as an aside before we answer your questions. And it's my understanding there is a bill that's currently somewhere in the hopper right now and maybe our guests can talk a little bit about that too. But I think judge Sedgwick will start off at least in trying to answer your question. Go ahead (00:27:31) judge. I think that several of the points raised by this lady are are just extremely important and I would respond by saying this it's my understanding that at the present time and I don't believe that this was the case in 1970 when this lady last had hospitalization, but at the present time if a person is committed Involuntarily the doctors cannot use electric shock unless there is a hearing before the court and unless the doctors prove that all other areas have been tried and are not successful and that the only remaining area to help this patient is electric shock. So the burden is definitely placed on the medical profession to show that they have tried all other available treatments. I think that in the area that this lady described that that the time that she had shock treatments that was not the case. I think also with drugs she's pointed out another important thing that some doctors of course will use drugs more easily and more readily and more quickly than other doctors and she indicated that she had been to a psychiatrist for a period of time and had Up and helped and then went to a psychologist. I don't necessarily think that it is the discipline as such that makes the difference. It really is the person and the reporter that the patient has with the person it's clear from listening to this lady that she has an excellent Rapport it either because of the of the combination of the personalities of the psychologist that she went to and her personality or just the approach that the particular therapist had but she has a good rapport and that works and that is one of the most important things is to have have mutual trust between the person that is in need of help and the person that's Furnishing. It drugs are really controversial because we see a lot of people that are treated immediately with drug therapy, you know from the so-called, dr. Feelgood who will if somebody is A little anxious immediately prescribed a hundred tablets of something to make them feel good. I think the medical profession is taking a very hard look at this and that again depends in large measure on which dr. People who some doctors flatly do not believe in that and would suggest many other ways of handling it. So anyway, she's raised a lot of really good questions and thoughtful questions and questions that are going on not only in the legal Community but in the medical community and in the among the psychologists and psychiatrists that are providing the (00:30:32) treatment. Mr. Simonson. Yes, the questions are good. And what's interesting is that her experience first of all in shock with regard to shock treatment? The Mental Health Association has been working for a couple of years with the Psychiatric Society the medical society and hospitals. To ensure that the guidelines for giving shock treatment are well publicized and followed in the central thing about those guidelines is that the patient must be well and completely informed about what's involved with shock treatment any risk involved why it's being used in that particular case what the alternatives are judge sedgwick's point about the court hearing that is true. If the patient does not agree to take undergo the shock treatment most of the time the treatment is given with the consent of the patient patient may have tried and the thing I want to emphasize is that this lady drugs didn't seem to help her and this coyote just didn't seem to help her. I know Gentleman by name of Percy. Now who's an author and wrote a book about his experiences with depression where exactly the opposite he spent five years under Psychotherapy and received no help until he found a physician who found the right combination of drugs and snapped him out of it and he's been fine ever since so I think that's the main thing is that no one therapist. No one discipline. No one course of treatment is going to be the same or the correct for everybody and so it's important and I think it's also important with with physical ailments that people learn to question the doctor know what's being done know why it's being done know what the alternatives are. If one thing doesn't work see somebody else to get a different opinion because there are no firm answers and I think it's more true in mental health than a lot of other areas what happens though, if Person, I'm imagining that it that a person who has finally decided that they have a problem and they need help and may consider themselves may feel more vulnerable and and less and rather helpless you're talking about the assertive patient and I'm wondering what a person does if they've pretty well come apart at the seams and they feel very helpless and a physician psychiatrist says well now this is the course we're going to take with you and we're we're sure this is the best route to go and is it pretty much that you have to learn by extreme experiences this woman apparently had had to to go through a course of drug treatment and find that that didn't help the the and she finally found her way back another route. I wish there were an easy answer even even those that we would say are mentally healthy is a great tendency to follow whatever the doctor suggests doctors have been. Trained and and we have been trained to see them as the the unfailing unfailing authority on on everything but there are different approaches. I think to be aware of that. I think the family members of the person should be monitoring what's happening and insist on being kept informed again it very some doctors don't like to talk to anybody else but more and more the tendency is to involve the family and treatment because almost always the families involved in the illness one way or another. Okay, we have another listener on the line, but just before we go to that person, I'll give out the phone numbers again in case something we've said here has triggered a question or comment in your mind. If you're in the Twin Cities and you'd like to call us. Our number is 2 2 1 1 5 5 0 2211550 and if you live outside the Twin Cities, but in the state of Minnesota call us toll-free at Seven zero zero and let's go to our next caller now. Good morning. You're on the air. (00:34:58) Good morning. My question centers on Services mental health services that are available for physically disabled adults. I recently co-led a group of eight disabled adults who had both physical and difficulties and speech impairments. And this was a pilot project. And unfortunately, I am leaving town and the group recently ended and many of the people in the group were feeling rather discouraged about the lack of services and I'm wondering if you know of any groups that have started up or that are available for disabled physically disabled adults who do have speech communication (00:35:42) problems, Jay Croft. (00:35:46) I'm only my second because it's a job. So I don't know but if you call the council for the handicapped 2966785 during normal working hours Monday to Friday, we an early bird agency with here at eight o'clock everybody. (00:36:02) Okay, that's so uh, perhaps uh, (00:36:05) somebody take it who's been here longer than I have could help. (00:36:08) Okay. I'll give that number. Again. It's 29667854 the Minnesota Council on the handicap. Let's go to another listener. Good morning. You're on the air. While we're waiting, we have a couple of listeners at least the phone show that there are a couple of people are there. Let's see if we can get another person on the air. Good morning. We're listening for your question. Doesn't sound like a question. Let me give the numbers again very quickly 2211550 in the Twin Cities outside of the Twin Cities, but in the state of Minnesota 1-800-695-1418 cut off there a minute ago. Please call us back. We have another listener do we yeah, okay, good morning. (00:36:54) My problem was depression to in fact, my doctor said the second time I was hospitalized that he had never seen anyone as profoundly depressed as I was but he was completely buffaloed as to what to do. We tried the uppers and downers and nothing had much of any effect at all. He came to the conclusion that my problem was chemical for some reason this ring true to myself my husband even my teenage children, but he didn't know what to do about it. He did try a drug called Barney which did seem to help but had tremendous side effects. Well a couple years later I discovered nutrition and niacin and my depression problems were not completely removed. But I mean it was just like the difference between night and day not with something I could deal with on a rational basis and when you talk about exploring all other avenues, I wonder how many psychiatrists are really aware of the nutritional factors involved. I tested out to be extremely hypoglycemic. My son is fourth generation hypoglycemic, and of course, he's had problems in the same area. Now that we know that our diet is so important. This has had a lot of you know, this has been a tremendous help to us. Also there is a spiritual factors involved I had assumed that this was probably the biggest part of my problem and it wasn't but No, for many people the spiritual aspect of it is the key. And so this woman is right that sometimes like the Psychotherapy worked for her for somebody else that chemicals work. But I often feel that the doctors program is far too narrow. They should be considering these other things that perhaps no I've done really more at home with my nutrition books than I have with medical profession (00:38:58) ever. Mr. Simonson is nodding his head in approval approval. I couldn't say it any better it you just have to explore and I wish more doctors were more willing to explore all the possibilities some are better than others just like in anything else is the Mental Health Association doing anything in this regard right now that you know of the to educate Physicians to put a little pressure on them, perhaps at least find out what approaches they take when it lets A general practitioner has a person who comes in and has symptoms of mental illness right now. We are involved in a consumer study to determine what subjects what what things consumers see doctors not knowing about that the consumers think they should and and this is being done in conjunction with the University of Minnesota medical school and hopefully we'll see some of that appear in the curriculum of the medical the medical school so that perhaps some of these other things will be emphasized more than they are now. Let's go to another listener who's on the line with the question or comment. Good morning. We're listening for you. Hi, good morning (00:40:14) Leonard off to mr. Simonson about an aspect of mental health, which usually isn't talk about because it's so new and that is the religious cult that are around today and I I was I was a member of the unification church and I feel like I was put under a lot of mental stress and I in fact that I was put under certain techniques in mind control and I was wondering if mr. Simonson was ever studied. We're looked into this aspect of mental health. (00:40:45) Mr. Simonson. No, I have not and I should emphasize. I'm I'm not a trained as a psychologist or psychiatrist or anything else. I know that that there is a good deal of interest in this type and I don't know if you'd call it. It's not a mental illness, but certainly a mind control has been of a great deal of interest and it went back I think started in the time of the Korean War and the term brainwashing and now it has come up of renewed interest because of the The growth of the religious cults and this is something that I guess it's often. The terminology is very confusing. We're talking this morning about but mental health, but I don't like to see the term mental illness applied to many of the people that judge Sedgwick is seeing who are in on criminal charges. They may have some sort of behavior personality problem. I think one of the key things to look at when what I would call a mental illness is a change something that is changing from the person's normal personality because that is what the psychologists and psychiatrists are trained to work with principally. Jay Croft. I've only be two weeks here, (00:42:06) but I did 10 years. It has Episcopal priest and it's important that you take your Villages like the very silly to be spokes per minute. If a preacher promise to do the moon promise to do a straight path to heaven with no problem. There's something wrong if it's the religion tries to make you do things, which we don't feel appropriate. There's something wrong with you. It's because purpley Village inserted and hips and encourage your personality develop it now change into a zombie and make me hang around the railroad station. So try to sell flowers. So religion can help people to prevent mental problems, but I can also if you drugged like anything else like fire it can also be used a dangerously. (00:43:11) There are some other listeners on the line will go to another one right now. Good morning. We're listening for your (00:43:15) question morning. I'm calling pretty much in regard to You people have been talking about drug therapy in terms of mental health for my experience. There are many many developed many dimensions of mental health and mental illness and I would say it's important to distinguish the difference between depression and psychosis. And I think I think it can't be denied that certain drug treatment is is very much effective in terms of psychosis or schizophrenia, whatever the however as defined and I think the psychologists are might be able to agree with me in (00:43:56) that we don't have a psychologist with us this morning and we should make that clear that that mr. Simonson is an attorney who is president of the Minnesota Mental Health Association. And so we don't have any Physicians on our panel this morning and so we can't really speak definitively about that on however. Mr. Simonson District not even though not And I worked in the field for a number of years as an administrator and as as a sort of a judge doing commitment involuntary commitment, so I was exposed to a lot of this and I guess I would agree that there certainly is a distinction between depression and psychosis psychosis is not an illness that is simply a description of symptoms really we're saying that somebody has lost contact with with reality or unable to deal with reality. It's what we think of the person whose hearing voices or so withdrawn that they're not aware of what's going on around them depression is describes the again a set of symptoms, but they can be of wide range of seriousness. You could be just a little bit we all get depressed at times. We feel sad Something's Happened. Sometimes we feel sad no particular reason. It's only when it becomes very severe that we say that it is a psychosis and Depression can be a psychotic depression. But most of them are not there milder than that listeners called in and and message has been passed in to us here in the studio, which I'd like to pass along to the members of the panel this morning. And that is the person wants to know if there's any mental therapy being done in the Twin Cities area for victims of rape and for rapists, and I'm wondering if if anybody can talk about that a little bit judge said we could (00:45:48) yeah, I have to say I can't I can't exactly tell you where this is being done. But in the past couple of years in large measure through the county attorney's office that there has been a victim representative with the county attorney's office. And I know that a rape center has been set up now whether this is at the hospital itself at Hennepin County General or not. I don't know I do. All that people both on the police force and the medical personnel who would be handling and testing the rape victims have all had considerably more training in the past couple of years and they had before that and that these matters are being handled differently the with the victim assistance program at the county attorney's office. The there are either paralegals or people on the staff there that are designed to more or less let the victim know how this matter is going to be handled in court what will happen during the course of the proceedings. And so it doesn't come as quite the counseling trauma that it was as far as the courtroom aspect of it. But the whole thing from the person's first physical examination of the contact with the police has really received a lot of well deserved attention and has received. Very good response both from the police department the medical personnel and the lawyers (00:47:23) involved. Mr. Simonson, I might say for any listeners who have questions about resources that are available or just general questions. They would like to get answered about mental health problems during business hours. They can call the Mental Health Association at 9255806 and we maintain an information and referral program. So to help people get information about resources and that number was 9255806. Our number is 2 2 1 1 5 5 0 and it's 12 minutes before 11 o'clock. You're listening to a discussion of mental illness some of its aspects and we have another listener on the line. We'd like to go to that person now, good morning. (00:48:13) Good morning. I like to remind you listeners and all disabled disabled people in the area of the services of Curtis Center in Golden Valley (00:48:21) Courage Center. If the number is 5 8 8 0811588088158808110811. All right, very good. Thank you for calling. (00:48:35) I'm going to Hollywood. It's a very obsessive up atmosphere very positive environment and I found them praise. Very useful in serving the needs of all disabled (00:48:49) people very good. Thank you for calling with that information Jay Croft. (00:48:54) You just did that the code said to also has a teletype we did people can call you and that's a wonderful (00:49:01) thing. So it would be kind of like a hotline. Okay, very good. Let's go to another listener. We have a number of people waiting on the phone lines. Good morning. Yes. It is. (00:49:14) One question. I was going to mention about the rape cases that are a good many of them. There is diverse might happen to know a good deal about them and in years past it's been very very difficult. I don't know what the percentage is now, but it used to be estimated that a very small percentage of rape cases were reported because when the new from their friends and other people that had had difficulty like that, they would not have any help from women that they would be quite rudely treated by men only around including the policeman putting any other of the Court proceedings. And so it was just a case of not reporting them at all. I do hope that at least one gentle woman will be present in any of these things come up because it is a very very difficult thing for any woman of any age or any education any ability to face. The things I guess it's been answer to but there are many many people that go in push them when it is the person that pushes it in to a mental institution. That should be behind bars. And there's a registered nurse. I've seen this time and time and time again, there is not enough investigation or is not enough believability people just take the first thing especially this men in the case. It's quite often that had really hadn't they had no place to go. They had no one to take their part and I think it's a little better now, but it still is far from the way it should be and men who have never supported their lives and never been good to them and abuse them over and over and over again even placement often do not see it as it is and I think there's just been too much of this in times past. I hope to goodness. It has changed. We need an awful lot of help for people like that people come in. Better tool that they died. It was almost nothing good about them. They got off scot-free. I don't know how much and I'm sure that said for casinos time it again and being a woman. I'm sure her attitude is much different than some of the men. I'd like to have some comment. Please (00:51:25) judge said (00:51:25) work. Well, there is a lot of ground covered by by the listeners question and I would say that in the past couple of years again that there have been there's been more interest in the whole area of Family Violence. But you know one thing that hasn't come out this morning that Dale said the other day on a panel that one of the most important aspects of mental health is prevention and one of the ways that Family Violence and that abuse between adults is prevented is to start with children and raise children who have good solid concepts of again what Dale said earlier of themselves respect for themselves faith in themselves and a positive attitude about themselves because those people will not be the battered people of this world. It is the people who have the poor self Concepts. Who have been walked on stepped on and put down his children that grow up to be the battered adults the put down adults and the stepped on adults of the world. So when you're looking at an overall view, if you really wanted to prevent violence among family members you do it by raising kids that had a positive attitude towards themselves. These people are not battered because they won't permit it and they won't form relationships with people who are doing the battering. So I guess that with that Focus, I agree with the lady that it's been an area of the past that's been a sad one. But if we want to change it, I think we have the knowledge to do it and I agree with her that I hope we continue to improve it. (00:53:16) We have about six minutes left in our program this morning in our lines are full with people waiting to ask questions. So we'll go to another listener right now. Good morning. You're on the air. (00:53:26) Hi. I'm calling from Austin and I was wondering what opinions you may have on residential treatment centers for emotionally disturbed children. And if I percentage of children needing help are being discovered and receiving help and if the treatment centers are really proving beneficial to these children and their families. (00:53:45) Mr. Simonson. Oh boy. No, I don't think a high percentage of children needing help or getting it. We have a tremendous shortage of Good treatment programs for children and not just residential you residential treatment is what you use if nothing else is appropriate or works, but we do have some excellent child treatment programs and I'm more familiar with those in the Twin Cities area, but I know that we are still sending a good number of children out of Minnesota and away from their their homes for residential treatment, and it doesn't make any sense to me at all. If they need residential treatment at should be provided here close to where they live and we certainly need a good deal more of non residential treatment just to handle the numbers of children who need some help. Any other comments? Okay. Let's go to another listener. Good morning. You're on the air. Good morning. We're listening for your (00:54:55) question. Good morning. I was calling to give information to the party that asked the question about services available for sexual assault victims on a psychologist who works within this area quite a bit, but I wanted to call attention to the Rape Crisis Center in Minneapolis, which is the second oldest in the country. It's been around for about five years. They're located at 31st and Fremont Avenue South Minneapolis. And the phone number is eight to five help 4357 or the letters help and they have ongoing groups for victims of sexual assault attempted sexual assault which has just as powerful psychological impact is the actual completed act and for incest victims. They have trained volunteer like counselors and they have referral resources for professional help and that's called for and in Ramsey County. You have sexual offense Services SOS. What you're listed in the Ramsey County White Pages under Ramsey County on the number there is 2985898. And that's at 65 East Kellogg Boulevard for outstate listeners. We have people in we have rate hotlines and crisis centers in Bemidji and Winona. St. Cloud Brainerd and many other cities Rochester throughout the state and people that want more information about availability of services in areas other than Minneapolis or st. Paul could call the state program for victims of sexual assault which is in st. Paul and that's two nine six 7084. (00:56:35) Okay. Thanks very much for that information. We have three minutes left in our program and time for about one more question and we have a listener on the line. Good morning. We're listening for your question. (00:56:46) Hi, I'd like to redress the issue of shock therapy a friend of mine. Who's a psychologist. Study through the university and the effects of shock therapy. And one of the things that they found was when they did autopsies of people would had shock therapy that there was severe Scar Tissue going through their brain and I'm wondering if anyone on the panel can tell me that killing brain cells is really beneficial to anyone. It seems to me like it's the ultimate destruction and I'm wondering if anyone on the panel would consider subjecting themselves or their children or anyone they really care about to that kind of treatment and I use treatment without really thinking that it's treatment John (00:57:28) Sedgwick. Well, I was just going to comment. I don't think there's anyone on the panel that is advocating or that professes to know in detail about shock therapy. I think that we know that it's not to be used lightly now whether whether as this caller suggests, that should never be used. I think that would really take Is that we don't have here this morning. I think that that is probably the subject of a good deal of medical dispute all that. We were trying to point out earlier and I know Dale mentioned that too is that it is definitely not used lightly at one time. I think it was yet now is not and there may be situations in which nothing else works. But I think that really is more a medical question. (00:58:18) Well, we have about a minute and a half less left not really enough time to take another call but enough time I guess for me to thank you all for being here with me this morning judge Suzanne Sedgwick from Hennepin County District Court and deal Simonson who's president of the Mental Health Association of Minnesota and J Croft who is the new associate director for the handicapped Council of Minnesota and who tells me that this is the first radio program. He's heard in 30 years and also thanks to Gloria reisman who has been interpreting for Jay this morning. The time is 1 minute before 11 o'clock and We as we told you at the beginning of the program. We were sure we weren't going to cover all of the issues in mental health and perhaps we can do another program on the topic before too much longer. Give a brief look at the weather forecast for our region. Sunny skies for the rest of this morning though in the Twin Cities clouds are already moving in those clouds will increase in number and coverage as the afternoon goes on and the temperatures will remain on the cool side through tomorrow highs today. And tomorrow will be in the mid-50s lows tonight in the Twin Cities in the upper 30s chance of rain this afternoon in the Twin Cities 20% that'll increase to 50 percent by tonight and 40% on Sunday the time in just about 15 seconds will be 11 o'clock. We'd like to invite you to stay tuned for voices in the wind with your host Oscar brand and following voices a summary of news and weather at noon. 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