Spectrum: Don Poss and Barbara Lukermann discuss building new stadium in Twin Cities

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On this regional public affairs program, Don Poss, executive director of the Metropolitan Sports Facilities Commission, and Barbara Lukermann, consultant to the state planning department, discuss building and maintaining a new Twin Cities sports facility. Included in discussion is study on impact the stadium would have on the Bloomington and Minneapolis sites. Poss and Lukermann also answer listener questions.

Read the Text Transcription of the Audio.

Good morning. This is Neil said Anthony speaking from the ksjn studio in St. Paul. The time is exactly 10 a.m. At 9 a.m. In St. Cloud skies were sunny. It's 16 below zero fahrenheit 27 below Celsius Windsor common Saint Cloud Rochester at this time sunny skies, and it's nine below 23 below Celsius and in the Twin Cities at 9 a.m. The National Weather Service said it was 11 below Fahrenheit 24 below. Celsius winds are calm and skies are sunny.The Minnesota Legislature through the stadium Act of 1977 created the Metropolitan sports facilities commission and directed it to decide by December 1st 1978 on the design and location of a sports Stadium at this point two sites one in Bloomington and one in Minneapolis or under consideration designs range from a multi-purpose dome stadium renovation of the existing Metropolitan Stadium, the legislation specifies that construction cost not exceed certain bonding limits and the commission maintains that the stadium must support itself chairman. Dan Blocker says, no Stadium will be built unless it can pay its own way.Currently public hearings on the stadium are being held throughout Minnesota to Studio guests will figure prominently in the stadium matter are here to answer questions this morning. But before we move to that portion of the program will listen to this brief excerpt from a talk that mr. Brother gave last fall about the work of the commission. The commission is a permanent commission established by the legislation and it is given a great deal of responsibility. The responsibility includes selecting a site, but that's just one of the very important task assigned to the commission. It is also responsible for determining the design. For it being very conscious of the cost for actually operating the stadium. If in fact the new one is built, but also it has responsibility by the intention the law to take over the existing facilities. So it will be an operating entity also have the very important responsibility of negotiating all of the user contracts which would include the professional teams and other users. The committee is also charged with several important items such as to give careful attention to the possibility of using solar energy and to consider the needs of the University of Minnesota. Those are some of the responsibilities that are specifically outlined and become part of the the commission's area of concern. Now, the commission is made up of seven members three are out State members and for our metropolitan area members and an old man, I'd like to also say that the commission is committed to be a very open Commission that it will be very responsible. I think you can look for an unusually high degree of dedication and that frankly I'm excited about it and anticipate that the commission will fully meet its charges and will not do very well and when it's all said and done I think each and every one of you will be happy with results. Are there maybe sometimes in between where certain groups may not be happy because they're certain wishes may not be met but I think as far as fulfilling the intent of the law of doing what is best for the Metropolitan citizens and a citizens of Minnesota and meeting all the other considerations. I feel confident that this commission will do an excellent job. I think one of the most important things that we've done is we've developed a schedule. And the schedule does give us some dates that hopefully will happen. They are Optimum dates, but they are dates that that if followed and if they are met will end up with the four dates that are on the bottom of schedule September one completion of a remodeled met Stadium if that happens to be the option. June 15th at September 11980 June 15th 1981 completion of a single-purpose football soccer open Stadium July 17th 1981 completion of a multi-purpose open Stadium. October 12th, 1981 completion of a covered multi-purpose Stadium. I think that's what it's about is what are the targets? What can be done to get to those Target dates? There will be some difficult times. But if those dates are going to be met the other schedule dates must come near Target. I think that's what the commission shall Endeavor to do. I like to assure you that that type of commitment and that type of dedication will go in so that the results can be achieved and that was Dan Blocker chairman of the Metropolitan sports facilities commission. Our guests today are done pause executive director of the commission and Barbara luqman a consultant to the state planning department who coordinated a study that examined the impact of Stadium would have on the Bloomington and Minneapolis sites. Before we take a look at the findings of that environmental impact study. However, I'd like to ask you mr. Paws at what stage of the site selection process are we at now right now and is conceptual phase in evaluation phase of both site and the design Alternatives and we're right now working with Design Consultants Architects and Engineers who are developing design models. If you will for the 405 Alternatives, we have to consider and those design models once once developed once cost at Apple NBA adapted to the sites. Could you review for as much as possible what the models are? Yes, those models consists of a domed multi-purpose stadium in multi-purpose in the wall. Define is a stadium that will accommodate football and baseball and soccer and I'm doing the multi-purpose Stadium. I might give you the 80 cost of the bonding authorities at the sea. Time with list the dawn the multi-purpose Stadium at either site has a revenue bonding limitation or authorization of up to 55 million dollars the undoing the multi-purpose Stadium at either side has a bonding authorization of up to 42 million dollars third alternative that we have is to build a football soccer stadium and remodel met stadium for baseball purposes and the legislature authorized a revenue bonding authority of up to 37 and 1/2 million dollars to do that. The fourth alternative that we have is too extensively remodel Metropolitan Stadium upgrade up get to 65,000 seats and 65000 seat is a basis for all the Alternatives and for the remodel to Metropolitan Stadium. We have a bonding authority of 25 million dollars a last alternative, which is very very seldom mentioned. Then really isn't explicitly mentioned in the law is to do nothing at all. You do have that option and that's one that's being considered the commission feels that has that option. Yes, as far as a dome stadium is concerned. I know that some members of the commission have been dubious about construction and operating costs because they seem to be substantially higher than that of an open field. But a dome is still being considered. Nothing has been ruled out. Nothing has been ruled out and I don't know that any members of the commission are necessarily dubious about the dome stadium. They do know as a result of their travels as last fall in 1977 that Dome stadiums are expensive to build and they're expensive to operate but one of the features of this connection, I think he is that they are arriving at no conclusions without facts and the facts aren't yet in Mrs. Wickham on this estate planning agency was told to do the draft environmental impact statement by the legislature, but you really didn't have a specific model to operate from what was the study based on in view of that fact that India poop to be a little bit of a problem. But one of the first things we had to do with the Consultants was to develop a prototype and by that means a an assumption that the stadium would be built identically on each of the sites in that time. We were still considering Eagan also as well as they Minneapolis in Bloomington site also a Time type of Les Mis deposit indicated to accommodate sixty-five thousand Spectators. And while this probably didn't make Minneapolis or Bloomington very happy. It was very important to the commission and I think mandated under the legislation that we compare apples and apples and that this wasn't an unusually I a sore. Sentimental impact statement in that regard that many environmental and economic concerns. Did you find any insurmountable obstacles deciding at either the Bloomington or Minneapolis sites? I think that the environmental impact study though has identified several in a trade of the commission is going to have to consider in such things as a air noise impact on does adjacent neighborhoods, but I say that the study has not ruled out absolutely any one of the options I want to get two of those trade-off questions and take each one of them up individually in a few moments. But first, let's set the stage on the environmental impact process. This is a draft statement and actually just the beginning of the process isn't there is much more that will figure into a more conclusive statement down the line somewhere. Isn't that the case? To as far as the commission's decision is concerned as far as the environmental impact statement process itself is concerned. I would say Noah 75% down the road on the road. Most of the technical work was completed in the draft environmental impact statement this coming week. I will be holding some required public hearings. I want in Minneapolis in Bloomington that that time will be receiving comments these comments maybe statements that are has have been made and missions in the statements. Whatever we get. We will then go back and respond to these comments and produce an addendum to the draft which we called in the final environmental impact statement, and we hope to be able to represent that to find me is to the Environmental Quality board at Excel April meeting they draft Eis to the stadium Commission. And what has the commission done with the the draft report? Mr. Pause at the present time? The commission is done. Nothing officially. They have each received copies. The copies are available for the reading and it's a very very sick documents day you perhaps seeing that's a couple of inches thick and very fine print it seems packed full of information and hopefully the Commissioners will have individually been able to read through that and digestion and ask questions over the next couple of months many public hearings are being held throughout the state at this time, but I'm including those at mrs. Slocombe and mention what you're holding the hearings what goes on it at the hearings. What do you ask for? And what do you do with what do you take away from those hearings? The first of all, let me say that the hearings are being held because they're mandated Noir the law provides that the commission must hold public hearings on the stadium design and location both within and without the metropolitan area. They commissioned to stab. There's some 10 public hearings. I believe around the state. They had already held three public hearings here in the metropolitan area and we held one this last Wednesday the fourth in a series of the Metropolitan public hearing purpose of the public hearings is to as the law suggests to receive input from people throughout the state to listen to their comments to listen to their opinions and secondarily, I would say the public hearing serve the purpose of providing information to the citizens outstate. It's a two-way flow of information other words. A lot of questions are asked a lot of information is is given to people through the question-and-answer process and we have found quite frankly as we as we go throughout the state as well, but there are some ice and some misconceptions about what the law provides. What seems to be some of the larger myths that have been perpetrated about this whole process in the work of the commission. That was one of the first message was selected to be a site selection committee. And as a matter of fact the commission has been referred to in that context to buy the news media during the first six months of our existence of site selection committee that mess I think he has essentially been put to rest now out of commission is going to be is now operating Metropolitan stadium and will be operating any Stadium of the bills or remodels the another mess. I think pertains to this question of taxes a good number of people have been led to believe that they are going to be personally responsible for paying for this Stadium through through their taxes and most people in my experience when I think of the term taxes think of property taxes and they think of income And the legislation has been very very carefully designed and enacted to prohibit that to prevent. The fall back on property taxes are income taxes or any popular tax a text that the people normally conceive. The only provision for tax has a 2% metropolitan area liquor tax and that is only intended as a fallback text not to support the stadium directly that's presently being thanked her with the exception of a small amount. I understand has been used for start-up cost for the commission. That's right. The first one half of the first years liquor attacks is to be made available to the commission to perform these these studies these technical studies in the various other things I have to do and putting the environmental impact statement the remaining two and a half years of tax for through July of 1980 are to be banked and a Debt Service fund and used as Bon Secour 84 It will be sold but not to be used to build a stadium as I understand it. Mr. Brucker is committed to not having to dip into that 2% backup tax. If it all possible he would like to see if a stadium is built the gate receipts cover the cost of bond retirement is that correct was a matter of fact the law requires that the law requires that you know, our financial feasibility studies that we present to the Metropolitan Council prior to their selling any revenue bonds to build what we recommend that we have to provide assurances that the revenues from operations of any new or remodel Stadium will be sufficient to pay debt service costs and operation and maintenance cost for any Stadium any configuration other than a dome stadium. And for a dome stadium the law provides that the revenues from operations have to be sufficient to pay debt service cost and a substantial portion. All the operating and maintenance costs and that the liquor tax could be used to pay the remainder which would be the unsubstantial portion of the operating and maintenance guys. So that provides that Safeguard it's not merely one or two people or the kids not commission policy against the law. Okay favor either of the sites to make any recommendations, I guess we've had a few comments just disappointed that did not come out eventually make the decision, but I think it's very important to realize that an environmental impact statement is not a study that is supposed to make a decision not to make specific recommendations. But essentially it's the layout on the table what's going to happen if it's almost like a simulation getting everything recognized out before any commitment is How to build whatever so I think it's important that I listen to Sarah we're of that we didn't make a recommendation but we did say if you're going to build here if you're going to build are you going to build this kind of a stadium? This is what we anticipate is going on with this is what we predict to be the air quality situation the noise situation the traffic situation the impact on the surrounding land you all right. Let's look at some of those specific issue is that you considered using the 65,000 seat model. What about pollution? Are there any significant auto emission problems at either site? There will be some impact on all the missions in the carbon monoxide levels and they will be different if the two sites in the case of Bloomington and we're talkin really about to science at Bloomington that I listen to where I we have the the presents I to the round 147 acres and then the commission did ask us to take a look at a 33 acre parcel immediately adjacent to that site. But at Bloomington that would be a concentration of parking large amounts of parking 14 to 18,000 spaces and the emission of people in cold weather when you have the Vikings games will have an impact on air quality weave identified in the report that that might be one location now, we're by the standards. I like it to be exceeded by a small amount but we've also in the environmental impact statement suggests us and mitigating measures as to what could be done. And for example are there is in the report a recommendation that if we want to clear that you Bloomington lot within an hour's time and that is sensually the standard that a consultant was appropriate and it would be necessary to make some fairly substantial Road improvements. I was an estimated cost of around 5.7 million dollars worth of Road improvements. So essentially that could dissipate the traffic more quickly and could reduce the impact on air quality with regard to Minneapolis. They will not be that concentration of parking around the site of the trade-off is going to be walking distance of up to 20 minutes to access 18,000 parking spaces. So they won't be that concentration of Co around the site. However, the existing air quality standards in and around downtown already. So they're creating some concern and there's going to be a need for the state and the city to continually to address that concern. how to bring the entire downtown of Minneapolis within the air quality standards Approaching 21 minutes after 10 and I guess on the public affairs hour this morning, I barbalu Kerman coordinator estate study of possible Stadium sites and Don Poss executive director of the sports facilities commission. If you have a question for either, mr. Paws or mrs. Lugerman, you may call 221-1550. If you live in the metropolitan area that Twin Cities metropolitan area, I should say that's two to 11550. If you live outside the Twin Cities area phone toll-free 1-800 652-9700 That's for people who live outside the Twin Cities metropolitan area one 800-652-9700. Misslook amended the study investigate some of the cost differences between a dome facility and an open field facility or simply remodeling the met and and what sort of cost implications there are. Yes, it did. But that is a rather tender subject. I think as far as the commission is concerned at 7 one of my first statement swear that we were dealing with a prototype and we had to come up with an estimated cost for this prototype. But indeed there's no guarantee that this is exactly what is going to be built. But if we were going to meet the requirements of the rules and regs as far as a an environmental impact statement went we had to do this because we were obligated to talk about the economic and social impacts as well as the physical impacts of air and noise. So the report does contain some estimated cost of building the Prototype, but I think it's very important that again, we're aware that these are not final cost but doesn't cost that we developed in the Eis and are appropriate for Eis purposes, but I'm sure that the person that his architects. The commission I going to do a lot more work and tens of that in terms of a finals economic feasibility. And that's the bottom line for the figure which the Eis could not do more about possible cost down the road when some of these designs are drafted and looked at perspective. I think it's very important to know to just deliver it and what Barbara said that they cost developed in the Eis on this prototype are relative there for relative uses for comparative purposes to compare one configuration to another but they are not absolute costs and certainly the commission does not intend to be bound. It wasn't intended that they'd be bound by those cost. We're bound only by the limitations in the law and the innovation in the expertise of our people to design a configuration within those Those are Bonnie limitations in the law or what counts okay back to you for another question. Mrs. Looking men about the study. What did the is estimate the effects of a stadium might be on adjacent neighborhoods. Would there be debilitating effects would therefore for the land expansion and construction has result of I should say. Yes, I think we did Identify some with regard to Bloomington. There is a stadium in place and some of those impacts of already being sort of absorbed by the address residential area. However, we talkin about another 20,000 seating capacity more traffic and I think the other would be some increased ability affects for parking in residential neighborhoods Piccadilly of the stadium where built on the 33 acresite cuz I mentioned going to the southeast of the present site. They might be some increased noise. In fact, we projected that they would be the same existing apartments and housing on that that part of the Bloomington neighborhood going to Minneapolis. There are a couple of neighborhoods who felt and I think that correcting that perception that they would be impacted to some extent to see the Riverside area, but that is across the highway to the East and this would be Less than the Elliot Park neighborhood, which is a neighborhood immediately south of the proposed industry square and their concerns are related to the noise noise coming from operation of the stadium particularly. If it were open Stadium, I think in Minneapolis, if it were a dome stadium, some of these are concerns would be mitigated to quite some extent are the concerns of a parking and I think with her cuz I know they're being some discussions going on already between the city and the Elliot Park neighborhood to consider extension of a parking permit such as exists around the Westbank of the University that would protect those residents from that type of the problem situation tailgating for example was also know if we don't have a large parking lots around Minneapolis that are we going to get tailgating in our neighborhood. I think what obviously would have to happen should the decision be that it's glad we going to have a facility and it A square that has to be some extensive a Cooperative planning taking place between the neighborhoods in the city to ensure that these adverse things did not happen might be selected in Downtown Minneapolis. So we might see the demise of tailgating or at least as we've come to know. It's at the present Mets stadium. I believe we have a caller on the line. So I'm going to ask my guests to put on their headphones so they can hear the call. Good morning. Thank you for waiting. Do you have a question for mr. Paws or mrs. Luker me when is the deadline for the decision on the site? Under Stadium. When does it have to be decided on if it this year or okay, the the law provides that the commission must make its decision on both side light and design on December one of this year December one 1978, and I want to emphasize that's on not by mine. Thank you very much for your call. Mr. Paws, as I understand the enabling legislation the sports commission must secure guarantees from the National Football League and the American League or the American League the baseball league that they will rent the stadium until the bonds are repaid. And I also understand the policy of the NFL at least of the NFL not to guarantee a franchise. If you don't have those assurances by the December one day that you mentioned will the project be abandoned. Are you negotiating presently nail first? Let me let me clarify precisely what the law requires the law requires that the commission prior to the issuance of any bonds that the commission must have signed lease agreements with both Major League football and Major League Baseball teams. First of all, the Vikings and the twins in this case and those are lease agreements must expand for the length of any bonds that we that we sell after 30 years. Those agreements must also be backed up by some sort of financial Assurance such that if one of the teams that defaults somehow or another or somehow or another breach their contract their lease agreement that damages in to the extent of the annual lease payments will be paid to the commission now, that's the teams in a day. The alarm requires that the major league the major leagues themselves a National Football League in the American Baseball League must profile picture Us in the form of an agreement signed agreement that they will assure the continuance of Major League franchises here in the Twin Cities area. Now that doesn't mean the Twins and it doesn't mean the Vikings. It means Major League franchises for the length of the term of the badge. We're not aware at this time that there is any written or formal policy by either League to not extend this such assurances, but I will send you that earlier last year in 1977 in a meeting that we had with the a representative of the National Football League. They did decline at that time batter into such an agreement. We still consider that is the first of a number of meetings that are going to take place over the subject. We have not yet succeeded in Meeting with the American League Representatives, but we are scheduled to do so within the next few days. What about negotiations with the users themselves the Twins and the Vikings? We have a negotiated anything any anything with the twins and Vikings, except of both the representatives of both teams. I believe are on record both officially and unofficially as indicating that they have no problem with entering into agreements with us lease agreement with us for the length of the bonds. As far as the details of any Lisa's we obviously can't enter into those types of discussions until after we know until after we've really finish these technical studies in our cost feasibility economic feasibility studies. So we have some idea of what to say to him going to cost to build and what is going to cost to operate and that thing is going to translate into lease term dollar terms for the laces. Okay. We have a call or standing by good morning and you have a question about the stadium. I like to find out the answer to this question. You already have a stadium Metropolitan stadium and it seems to me that the big issue raised by the Vikings in the twins is the weather that they would like to get out of it, which means therefore that the major Improvement that would come would be in the erection of a dome over Stadium or in some way to enclose a stadium difficult for me to understand. Why not put a dome over the existing Stadium rather than go to the expense of building an entirely new stadium and putting a dome over that. Oh, that's my question. Okay to not use the existing one if the major issue as seems to have been raised by the club's is a dumb. Alright, thank you for your question right now is covering the existing Metropolitan Stadium. One of the options that the commission is considering this to pass that is not one of the options. And the reason for it. I believe is that it is not cost effective to do something like that. It is not technically possible to Simply put a lid on the existing Stadium. I'm not saying that it's impossible and its entirety but it would be very very cost. Any sect of the song. We were talking a moment ago about drafting lease terms once it's determined what sort of action will be taken. Let me ask a speculative question. Let's say that it is Susan is made to build a stadium at one of the sites. Is there anything that any clause in a lot of dictates that the terms must be strong enough so that the users would ensure Bond retirement even if attendance dipped is there some kind of account that would be set up at the commission could dip into periodically to to meet those payments even if the Vikings have a couple of oblique seasons and attendance drops by 1/3. For the first of all, there's no provision for that in the law and I can't speculate as to what is so what direction are released discussions will take us but I would think however that would be very very difficult to achieve a lease with terms in it that would provide that the users could afford to pay when their business falls off and therefore it seems to me that the responsibility is with a commission do assure and it's caught projections that is not overly optimistic as we think many metropolitan areas that build stadiums work, but they're not overly optimistic in the ability of sports teams to attract customers. We have more Collard standing by good morning. Do you have a question question for mrs. Lotrimin or mr. Paws? Have fuzzy cost of building a new stadium at the various sites under consideration been compared to the income that could come on the various. sporting activities in the metropolitan area and will there be any provision to hold some of the Championship games and I'll be held at the Superdome in New Orleans. Steve hoody chair and some of that national income I understand the last part of the question. I'm not the first all answer that and ask you to clarify the first it is not the intended that we're going to let the possibility of are securing a Super Bowl or something of that nature and her into our judgment on the building of the stadium at all. But as to whether it should be dumb to run to under the number of seats are in the competition for the Super Bowl as you can understand is very very strong amongst the stadiums around the country and a place like the Silverdome in Pontiac Michigan, which has to be one of the finest football stadiums in the country of Nutley finest find itself standing in line and pleading with the NFL to get a Super Bowl. The matter of fact, it appears that the Super Bowl is attracted to the sunny climes and they were just it would just be unreasonable for us to anticipate getting a Superbowl. We are building a stadium just to get a Super Bowl. Probably free part of the question relates to the second and that is the cost of all these past Dome stadiums have gone considerably over there we can estimates. And it doesn't seem to be foreseeable within the next all I guess two or three years that I've completed new stadium will be built here at the Twin Cities at least cost overrun been projected and have the entire cost of the project been compared to what kind of income we could expect to get for a new stadium from football baseball Collin College activities. At least a couple of the the one in New Orleans where the Super Bowl was recently played went over its intended caused by an obscene amount it is it is ridiculous the amount of overrun on the other hand the Silverdome at Pontiac which is a football-only stadium. I was built within its cost limitations and they may be having some problems with a permit. Operating cost but it's as far as building cost. They they achieve their objective. We are right now and during the next three to four months in conjunction with the technical studies that are being done going to be doing economic feasibility studies to assure that we are going to be able to operate pay for the operation of any Stadium we built and if those studies indicate that for example, a multi-purpose dome stadium is going to cost more to operate than the team's can afford to pay that are going to play in it then that Stadium won't be built. The deposit we heard recently about a number of stadiums that have turned out to be white elephants where they have been cost overruns and simply have been too expensive and all of the crossword figured in when they commission or Committee of the commission this fall toward parts of the country and looked at some of the Stadium's. Did you find stadiums at War profitable that have been built recently Dome stadiums in particular? No, we didn't find any that were that were profitable saved but perhaps one and that was the the stadium in Foxboro, Massachusetts. Where are the New England Patriots play that happens to be a stadium. It was built by private resource essentially by the Patriots in the Allied organizations and subsidiaries. It's a very very Spartan Stadium far more Spartan the existing Metropolitan Stadium, but it appears that that one is at least breaking even or making some money but they're virtually all of the others that we saw are being subsidized in some manner or another. It's 22 minutes before 11 a.m. We have more callers on the line. Good morning. Do you have a question about the stadium on one of them is a question that's three possible problem areas in terms of environmental impact with the downtown same and one is a general political question. Damn, you going from Chicago to 11. There is a bottleneck where they vote passes under a bridge where it goes from two lanes to one lane. I like to know what that's considering the traffic flow of the stadium. Another question is when I go from the West Bank 5th Avenue and I going to be able to do that when there's a downtown stadium and also will anyone be able to shop at Minneapolis Ragstock, which is right across from the stadium and political question is how do we know that after pouring all this money into a stadium that the team's only for the Sunbelt anyway? okay, three specific questions and one to think about for a moment Lee and wood comes up in the context of Contracts and turn rangement between the commission on the team's misses. Look at my can you speak to any of those specific questions about the environmental impact of a stadium would have on that downtown area? Yes, although I'm not sure that I can be as specific as the The Listener is asking me to be with regard to Washington Avenue. The environmental impact statement did Identify some need for improving some of the intersections on Washington Avenue, but they were much closer to the ramp going on to 35W North and not the one that was that you were supposed to I think at Chicago and Washington we did identify the need a while games are we're in process to close Chicago Avenue and it will also be necessary to be rerouting 4th and 5th streets as a result of putting that stadium and Industry Square whether or not you're going to be able to conduct business at Ragstock Ragstock. Is there at the stadium is built? I'm sure you will. Yes. Okay, Miss pross. Maybe you could take up the question of how do we ensure that if we do build a stadium and that the teams won't run away leaving us with the stadium and number to The Fill light while there are two two Provisions in the law that address that question. First of all, we have to the commission has to enter into agreements with the major league football and baseball teams for whatever the length of the bonds are. Let it be sold up to 30 years possibly and that it must be a binding lease agreement for them to stay and use that facility in addition to merely signing a lease. The teams are going to have to provide some sort of Surety some sort of bonding some sort of assurance such that if they do leave. Then that's already has to pay the annual lease payments to the commission for as long as a term of the original lease the second backup in the more difficult condition to achieve. I think we all agree. He is that the major leagues the NFL in the American Baseball League once again have to assure us that there will be franchises here so that if the twins or the Vikings I should just somehow or another leave or go bankrupt or whatever that at least there are franchise franchise is here that can be exercised by someone at someone's option that the franchise can't be moved to another metropolitan area leaving us with the inability to use a stadium. All right. Thank you for your question. Mrs. Looking we discuss some of the environmental impacts at the stadium would have How would a new stadium affect the local economies if if we don't build one and the two teams move? What do we lose? And what do we make if we do build one in the environmental impact statements that said that this study was not going to look at the consequences for the economy of the metropolitan area of the state Lodge if indeed a Major League Sports left the metropolitan area. This is essentially beyond the scope of what an environmental impact statement there is to do but we did however I look at the economic impact some consequences of the 16 Alternatives don't under minneapolis-bloomington and the comparative economic impact between those options. I think one interesting point that came out in the study that relates to the motels hotels restaurant trade in the degree to which Benefit from the facility where they might be in Bloomington or in Minneapolis be found by surveying the businessman in Bloomington. It only about 6% of that total business can be attributed to the stadium if the stadium had to move from Bloomington to Minneapolis. I guess the worst case would be they may lose 6% of their business. However, there are things is charter buses. We don't know at this point in time how fans made react in the future and they still continue to choose a motel in Bloomington and go by bus to Minneapolis reverse of this if the stadium was going to Minneapolis what might be the impact in terms of economic gain for the Central City in proposing that site. I believe the chamber Minneapolis and the community-at-large feels that there had to be some significant economic benefits to the City of Minneapolis by having a stadium. In the Eis. However, we were very cautious and fell and we're not able to identify a situation that it was Stadium goes in this means that we can get a new hotel, etc. Etc. We do feel that the stadium could act as a catalyst by Maps being that little bit extra that might push somebody to decide what I'll put on an addition. For example, I think would have a beneficial impact in terms of the new construction on new hotel is being considered for downtown, but that's not exactly right up against the stadium, but Okay. I want to give out the number that you might call if you have a question for you to mister. Posthumous is Luca men in the Twin Cities area. It's too to 11550. That's too to 11550. If you're calling from outside the Twin City Twin Cities area phone toll-free 1-800 652-9700 and we have more callers standing by. Good morning. We're waiting for your question. myquest Apostle, why is it desirable to build a stadium has greatly increased seating capacity on television is becoming more and more of a factor in the support of the National Football League 75% of the income of the football teams. Now come from television and that's apparently is going to be in a constantly increasing amount television than with this great expenditure in football is going to demand the maximum viewing audience is not going to allow blackouts of metropolitan areas like New York Chicago and Los Angeles consequently if it's not like I won't be able to block out the Minnesota Green Bay the smaller areas people been realizing that they don't have to buy season tickets to the does not have to be a sell-out to see if the game is undoubtedly will withdraw more and more from in person participation particularly a tailgating is not to be a feature of the games and would stay home and enjoy them on television. That's my question. A lot of aspects of that question, but basically you're asking why 65,000 seats and my response is because that's what the law provides I might say that I just don't feel myself qualified to discuss the merits or the demerits. The law that was public policy that was debated for many months many years is a matter of fact in the legislature and the finding of the legislature was that there was a need for my potential need for a 65000 seat Stadium if true that television does have a major impact on particularly football as contrasted the baseball and that it does constitute a major Revenue source to a major league football. I don't think it's quite as high as 75% but it is just slightly over 50% at least and television is having a major impact on the last sigh think it's true that football is a spectator sport that doesn't need fan attendance. I need fans in the stands 65,000 seats or 65000 fans or 25000 or what? I really don't know has anyone looked into this issue of potential attendance. Mr. Pause if we build a stadium are there surveys that say, yes, we can fill it at this ticket rate for Vikings game or this rate for Twins game. Yes, the commission did authorize a study to be made last fall that would made some projections of the number of events and the potential number of fans that might attend those events for the various Stadium configurations, but we're really going to be refining That's Amore and at best it's going to be a matter of making some good guesstimate. There is no way of looking at a crystal ball and predicting 10 years down the road. What kind of attendance there's going to be at a football game. For example But the thing that we are intent on doing is making those evaluations within the base of the best information available not only here but around the country experience around the country and then applying a conservative a judgment to those observations. Okay. We have another caller standing by good morning. We're ready for your question. Thank you. I wanted to come back to mr. Bosses question about covering Metropolitan Stadium. I used to live in the Kansas City area. And I remember that the engineers original proposal that complex of stadiums was 4 a.m. A cover. It could be rolled over or off of either the baseball or the football stadium and doesn't get involved with the structure of the stadium would have rolled over it that would give you a seems to me a way to get the ice and rain snow and rain off the field in bad weather without losing the Open Sky if you had a warm July 9th in Minnesota, would that be worth considering as an engineering solution to the stadiums are located in the We are correct. The Kansas City original design did to comprehend that that possibility but while it was found to be technologically feasible, it was also found to be economically not feasible. And I would think that that finding May well have influenced the legislation here in Minnesota to the extent that that option was not even provided in the law. It was gross weight economically unfeasible in Kansas City in Kansas City on have enough cold and snowy weather in Kansas City. Are you saying all that that's outside the scope for the Minnesota law? Yes. It's outside the scope for the Minnesota law, but I would I would also say that the weather really doesn't have too much to do with rubbing. It was yesterday. When you were talking about economic feasibility were talking about the ability of the teams to generate revenues to pay the bills for those two. Define and the weather is not so disproportionately bad here in Minnesota is compared to Kansas City that would generate the literally hundreds of thousands or perhaps millions of dollars additional necessary per year to support that type of concept. Thank you for your question and thank you for waiting. Good morning to have a question for mr. Paws or mrs. Lou, and I was wondering if there's been any thought or if there's going to be any sport inside tickets round-trip to dome stadiums football. I guess I could say that it's going to be taken up with the pointed in each Commissioners mine at the point that they Commissioners vote next December 1st on the alternative of the Alternatives before them as we've gone around and visited stadiums. We've had an opportunity to visit some of them under load that is when there is an activity taking place a game taking place. And so the Commissioners have had an opportunity to get the feel of what it's like to play to watch a football game. For example in the Kingdom out in Seattle. They've got an opportunity to see what it's like to feel what it's like to watch a football game in the dome stadium in Pontiac Michigan, but it's a different kind of atom emits a translucent film and that gives you an entirely different feeling because light comes through if you can actually see a blotting out of the light as the clouds passed by overhead, they've had an opportunity to to witness events in a multi-purpose open state. And both at night in the day and in the daytime and I get a feel for it and there are a variety of opinions not only untrue or in the Commissioners our minds but also fans the team themselves as to whether or not they prefer to play. I think basically though that the major problem comes with the Baseball fans and even baseball teams for that matter. They thought of playing the national Pastime baseball game under a roof is appalling to some people but thank you very much for your question. And another caller is waiting. Good morning around the are good morning. I'm interested in me in the part about the financing of the stadium and appears to be an addiction in that the state legislature has mandated that the stadium be self-supporting and yet right off the bathroom 2% tax on entertainment to facility in Minneapolis, and I'm wondering Why that is and also what that holds for the future in terms of possible other forms of Taxation which with in fact prove that the stadium would not be self-supporting. I don't think it's a conflict or contradiction as much as a recognition of reality. And the reality is that nobody possesses a crystal ball, which is infallible. The legislation does not mandate because it could not mandate that the thing be totally self-supporting. There's no way to assure that but it does mandate that the projections and the cost feasibility studies must be made without any infusion or without any intent to use the 2% liquor tax not entertainment tax but a 2% on sale liquor tax here in the metropolitan area and it does require and bills in checks and balances to assure that other agencies and other lies are looking at those cost projections and critiquing those cost projections and that they're not just the product of a single mind or a single agency which is a promoting the stadium before bonds can be sold the Metropolitan Council for example, which Those bonds has to be assured that the feasibility studies in the attendance projections in the revenue projections are arrived at on a non optimistic basis without stars in eyes. And if they're assured of that in the bonds are sold and something unfortunate happens in the future and fan attendance falls off way below what trends have been nationally and look like then that liquor tax is available as a backup but only as a back but I might point out that liquor tax ends in August of 1980 and the accumulation of funds is only for the purpose of making the revenue bonds are secure in the eyes of potential buyers are taxed then stops and can only be instituted Again by The Metropolitan Council when the funds when the liquor tax funds fall below to you. Is worth of bond and interest payments and they can they tax cannot remain in effect once reinstituted. Once the funds have reached the level of 3 years worth of bond and interest payments not possible to accumulate huge huge sums of money by that tax and neither. Is it possible to just let it run indefinitely as many taxes. Do you want him to do it? So are there is a cut-off point of August 1980 on that liquor tax, which boss what is the dollar estimate the amount of money that will be collected by that time? Aaliyah it's rather difficult to estimate that because we haven't had enough good experience yet, but the original estimates in their mortgage estimate, even an estimate would suggest that there may be about 12 million dollars / that time. We have time for one more phone call. Good morning. Do you have a question for mr. Paws or mrs. Lugerman around the Metropolitan Medical Center in the movement of emergency vehicles downtown. Did the environmental impact? Yes. It did. In fact that was a topic of discussion at some of the public informational meetings. There would be some problem. I think with the heavy traffic coming out the pedestrian traffic coming out of the Minneapolis Stadium that's blocking roadways and intersections that would impact upon the ambulance routes into the two hospitals nearby. However, this has been anticipated ahead of time and I don't think it's an insurmountable problem or a problem that would jeopardize. Are the public health and safety issue, but I think it's going to require some extensive policing of those intersections and keeping some lanes open and it's something that has been put out on the table and I think it can be Colquitt. It's not going to be a problem. That can't be cope with exchange we have time for one more quick question. Good morning. You're on the air to tell me if the environment impact study has included are considering the kinds of improvements that I think must be necessary. When you put up such a huge edifice new water Provisions new super provisions and additional police help for directing traffic and things like that was that type of thing has to be paid for by the city where the stadium exist Yes Festival the city did address the issue of Need for sewer water and police with regard to sewer and water. No problem adequate capacity exists in both Minneapolis Santa and the Bloomington with regard to please service. Yes, there will be a need and yes, the 280 their Community would have to incur some costs at the local level to provide that necessary level of Police Service executive director of the Metropolitan sports facilities commission and Mrs. Barbara Luke ermine Estate Planning Department consultant who coordinated the draft environmental impact statement of proposed Stadium sites while I have a moment, I'll review some 10 a.m. Temperatures for you in the Twin Cities area. At 10 a.m. It was 7 degrees below zero and that's 22 below Celsius Southwest winds at 7 miles an hour. The wind chill is 19 below. And that is fair in Fahrenheit 19 degrees below zero fahrenheit. Stay tuned for options in education coming up on Minnesota Public Radio. I'll listener-supported service.

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